• Welcome to Smashboards, the world's largest Super Smash Brothers community! Over 250,000 Smash Bros. fans from around the world have come to discuss these great games in over 19 million posts!

    You are currently viewing our boards as a visitor. Click here to sign up right now and start on your path in the Smash community!

Social Bowser's Castle

Big Sean

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jun 3, 2003
Messages
484
Location
Berkeley
Well, I suppose Jab to Slip Bomb could be viable because of how it forces reactionary shields. Slip Bomb can break shields on its own between the descending and landing hits, but it always felt more finnicky compared to Bowser Bomb doing the same thing. Probably because Bowser doesn't leap as far forward from the ground. Using Slip Bomb out of a jab would have you landing slightly to the side of your target rather than directly on them, which can result in a punish.

As for the trip effect. I feel like it's possible that if you successfully trip somebody, Bowser's jab could hit them before they can roll away or get invulnerability frames from any other option. Other moves may be too slow for the followup.

The real strength of Slip Bomb is in the air version. Bowser starts descending about 10 frames faster than the other Bombs, making it that much harder to react to. I feel like Slip Bomb is more of a substitute for Dair than it is for Bowser Bomb.
I remember @Jerodak was showing me that after the slip bomb you have a tech chase mixup where dash slash covers multiple options. To be able turn an otherwise neutral situation (which can often be bad for bowser) to a situation where bowser had the advantage seems like it has the potential to be quite powerful.
 

MagiusNecros

Smash Master
Joined
Nov 16, 2014
Messages
3,176
I remember @Jerodak was showing me that after the slip bomb you have a tech chase mixup where dash slash covers multiple options. To be able turn an otherwise neutral situation (which can often be bad for bowser) to a situation where bowser had the advantage seems like it has the potential to be quite powerful.
I forgot Dash Slash was a thing in relation to Slipbomb.
 

Zigsta

Disney Film Director
Joined
Oct 4, 2008
Messages
8,316
Location
Burbank, CA
NNID
Zigsta
3DS FC
1547-5526-6811
I got 9/33 at a local today. Beat Rich Brown's Luigi and Olimar but lost to Zenyou's Mario (dude's scary good) and a local Yoshi. :(
 

LIQUID12A

Smash Modder
Joined
Jun 26, 2014
Messages
16,477
Location
South Florida
NNID
LIQUID12A
3DS FC
0877-1606-0815
I got 9/33 at a local today. Beat Rich Brown's Luigi and Olimar but lost to Zenyou's Mario (dude's scary good) and a local Yoshi. :(
Bowser lost to TWO of his nemeses, it seems.

If only the Yoshi had been a Luigi. :cheep:

Nah, ya did good.
 

2-2

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Sep 21, 2009
Messages
473
Location
Dayton, OH
NNID
VGMtheVagabond
I'm going to a local tomorrow. I should probably get some practice in beforehand.
 

MagiusNecros

Smash Master
Joined
Nov 16, 2014
Messages
3,176
So ledgetrumping or as I understand it this is where an opponent has reached the ledge and then you grab the ledge and force them off the ledge.

When Ganondorf ledge trumps he can jump up and Bair his opponent. And he can get into this position quite often.

With Slipbomb however due to it's speed we can quickly ledgetrump any opponent and set up an immediate Bair or go for a Dair if we expect an air dodge.

And with Slipbomb it's rather easy to ledgetrump since you have to be at the very edge of a stage to grab the ledge and not land on the stage. Regular Bowser Bomb requires more spaced distance and is slower.

And if you are lucky you can probably also hit them if you Bomb them in the first frame of ledge snapping.

I urge Bowser players to try it at least once. It makes Bowser feel deceptively fast.
 

MrEh

Smash Hero
Joined
Aug 24, 2008
Messages
6,652
Location
Honolulu, HI
This isn't worth because regular bomb accomplishes the same thing with higher reward. Slower? Yes. However, regular Bomb isn't a godawful useless move in other situations.

Alternatively, If you wanted to grab the ledge quickly, you could always just run off the ledge and grab it. That's still the fastest way for Bowser to trump someone since we can't spin off ledges anymore.

Using Slip Bomb to accomplish a trump is redundant considering the two other alternatives.
 

MagiusNecros

Smash Master
Joined
Nov 16, 2014
Messages
3,176
Well whatever floats your boat. It's another option. And that's all I got to say about that.
 

Zapp Branniglenn

Smash Lord
Joined
Apr 13, 2014
Messages
1,707
Location
Santa Ana, CA
Bombing to the ledge has the merit of a massive hitbox as you come down. If you simply run off with the standard ledge trump method, Bowser is pretty vulnerable to Up B hitboxes by being such a large target. If you're opponent is Pit or Duck Hunt, then it's no issue to begin with. Another problem with bombing to the ledge is that it will take a good 35-40 frames to reach that ledge and grab it, and I think Slip Bomb is more or less the same timing give or take 2 or 3 frames. So you need a good sense of timing for when your opponent is going to grab it. What I do encourage is ledge trumping in general with Bowser. I haven't caught many people with the ledge trump Bair, but I we could always just jump back on stage and set up for a short hop Dair to dunk, or space a Bowser Bomb to hit them as they regrab the ledge. That rising hit will scoop up most ledge hangers, and a 24% punish is the best we have in terms of damage for the trouble of ledge trumping.

So I've spent the last few days doing further research for a thread I did on Jab Locking. It took days, maybe as much as ten hours of work to get all the data ranges I needed. However, based on the official rules, Smashboards seems pretty adamant that double posting is not allowed under any circumstance. Could somebody bump the thread for me? You could talk about how Bowser has no viable jab locking moves because his moveset is too manly. And besides, his jab is pretty much a jab lock in its own right. Jab to Bowser Bomb is pretty much the same damage and KO potential as jab > jab > jab > Fsmash from other characters.

Yeah, I know asking for bumps is totally lame, but the thread is only a week old, and if you searched "jab lock" in the search bar for this site, you'd see it after three pages of results. I really want to see this tech advance the meta further. And the update may make it worthy of being moved to the Smash Academy subforum where it won't get pushed down by absolute drivel each day.
 

Big Sean

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jun 3, 2003
Messages
484
Location
Berkeley
Isn't a jab lock a move you do when someone doesn't tech to force them to stand? Bowser had none of those. I think what you're talking about are strings from jab 1 that can also frame trap.

Edit: oh **** nvm I don't know what I'm talking about. Good work on the data @ Zapp Branniglenn Zapp Branniglenn
 
Last edited:

MagiusNecros

Smash Master
Joined
Nov 16, 2014
Messages
3,176
I bumped that thread for ya Zapp. I don't think Bowser has a jab lock though. On certain heavies you can link maybe 2-3 Jab 1's but most cases you'll want Jab 1 > follow up.

Run off trump takes too long. I will practice more with Bowser Bomb and try to gauge the correct distance to grab the ledge.
 

Zapp Branniglenn

Smash Lord
Joined
Apr 13, 2014
Messages
1,707
Location
Santa Ana, CA
@ MagiusNecros MagiusNecros Thank you very much for the bump. Though it seems readers still don't care much for the subject. Watch me sulk later as I watch just how valuable those days of research are to the community at large. There's gotta be a better way of getting this information to the people who would make use of it. I think of how characters like Samus and Ness could improve with jab locks implemented into their gameplay, and I don't see how that doesn't make people giddy.

You are correct in that Bowser has no jab locking moves. Dtilt, Ftilt, Dair and Fair all have the necessary angles to jab lock, but too much base knockback for it to work at a reasonable percent. Dtilt actually will work as far as 4%, however there's no way of getting your opponent into a prone status without dealing at least 10-12% damage from a throw in the first place. It's a shame, but unless his jab 1 were capable of locking (it's not) he wouldn't benefit very much at all from the concept.
 

herpyderpherper

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Sep 30, 2014
Messages
113
Location
My House,Earth, The Universe
NNID
trjcchapple
I just ordered a GameCube adapter, im used to wii u gamepad or 3ds but i decided to use a GameCube controller because i can't use the gamepad and the 3ds controls are weird at points, what i have the most problems with is that the grab and shield buttons are reversed, i grab where i mean to sheild (actually works sometimes) and vice versa, and i can't switch them since im gonna play melee and PM also, anyone have any advice? On the bright side this might help me break my habit of rolling and airdodging too much
 
Last edited:

Hitman JT

The Infinite One
Joined
Nov 9, 2008
Messages
1,120
Location
The Gates of Hell
NNID
JT.Hitman
3DS FC
1435-5432-6684
Ash and Bengals were talking about the same thing behind me. But I'm not yet confident in pulling off the quick ledge trump thing consistently, so yeah.
 

SolCalibre

One of UK's Best Sonics, apparently.
Joined
Sep 23, 2011
Messages
72
Location
London, UK
NNID
Solcalibur64
@ Hitman JT Hitman JT
Ledge trump is pure sweetness. i hope you get the grip of it.
Especially with bowser's strong bair.
I really wish it had a touch more range, many times have I successfully used it... only to be barely short of range... D:
I got 9/33 at a local today. Beat Rich Brown's Luigi and Olimar but lost to Zenyou's Mario (dude's scary good) and a local Yoshi. :(
God, I hate Yoshi...

All of his moves like: I can do this and it will WORK! Getting the hang of just doing: Say hello to my up air, you respect me not the other way around.

Also, not sure if this has been mentioned but it goes without saying his jabs are amazing. Sometimes it's what I would mostly do on the ground and I can see percent going up.
 

MrEh

Smash Hero
Joined
Aug 24, 2008
Messages
6,652
Location
Honolulu, HI
Well, Yoshi does have one of the best jabs in the game.

It's like Yoshi was always extremely gifted with neutral A moves for some reason.
 

B!squick

Smash Master
Premium
Joined
Jan 4, 2009
Messages
4,626
Location
The Sunny South
Hey guys. Have I missed anything or is the meta same old same old? I hear Diddle Kong is still good even after the patch.
 

trombonophone99

Smash Cadet
Joined
May 13, 2015
Messages
69
Location
U.S., Florida
NNID
trombonophone99
Hey guys. Have I missed anything or is the meta same old same old? I hear Diddle Kong is still good even after the patch.
Diddy is still good, just not Brawl MK level (exaggeration ofc). Definitely top 10 still. Right now, contenders for number 1 are Sheik, Rosa, and Luigi.

On a completely different note I feel like I shoulda introduced myself or something. I've been lurking on the boards for the past week or so and I've liked what I've seen so far; I learned a lot and I definitely feel more confident in my Bowser after looking the threads over. Loved Bowser since melee, haven't gone competitive until a couple months or so ago. So sorry if this is off-topic, just wanted to thank you guys for taking the time to be involved!
 

herpyderpherper

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Sep 30, 2014
Messages
113
Location
My House,Earth, The Universe
NNID
trjcchapple
Would anyone on here be willing to battle me? I feel like i have been playing really bad recently and would like someone elses opinion on it
Edit: yeah we played about a month ago
 
Last edited:

herpyderpherper

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Sep 30, 2014
Messages
113
Location
My House,Earth, The Universe
NNID
trjcchapple
So the 6th graders at my school are having a tournament during their lunch, normal rules except Ike, kirby and R.O.B are banned, apparently ike is too fast with the amount of power he has, kirbys hammer is broken so hes broken, and R.O.B is broken because he has both melee and ranged combat, 6th graders saying this, honestly smash bros at my school makes me want to cry sometimes
 

trombonophone99

Smash Cadet
Joined
May 13, 2015
Messages
69
Location
U.S., Florida
NNID
trombonophone99
@ KuroganeHammer KuroganeHammer Fade away more? As Ness I've had a bad habit of mis-spacing fair and committing to it where I shouldn't and I end up getting punished by a shieldgrab or what have you. I'm pretty sure Sheik can space her fairs like that, to where she can fade back to avoid a punish.

So the 6th graders at my school are having a tournament during their lunch, normal rules except Ike, kirby and R.O.B are banned, apparently ike is too fast with the amount of power he has, kirbys hammer is broken so hes broken, and R.O.B is broken because he has both melee and ranged combat, 6th graders saying this, honestly smash bros at my school makes me want to cry sometimes
I have an innumerable amount of cancers from this. Please direct these poor souls to the Matchup threads or...something, anything to save them from this misinformation.

What are some feel good games to play when you feel frustrated after a cruddy session of Sm4sh?
 
Last edited by a moderator:

UltimaLuminaire

Moderator
Moderator
Joined
Aug 2, 2007
Messages
643
Location
TX
NNID
UltimaLuminaire
@ trombonophone99 trombonophone99 Board games will work. If you don't have friends, then pretty much any JRPG will do. Action games could work, too, but it's your preference on a scale of Musou to Ninja Gaiden Black.
 

S_B

Too Drunk to Smash
Joined
Aug 11, 2006
Messages
3,977
Location
NH, Discord: SB#6077
Switch FC
SW 5369-1969-6280
Too done for words, showed them things on here showing their not broken, EXACT QUOTE : well thats them not us they all suck and have no lives we could rekt them, i actually cried
Get the NNID of the WiiU they use and let them choose the character they want to play as (who's allegedly overpowered) and the character they want the opponent to play as. I'm sure we can find someone here who can curb stomp them...
 
Top Bottom