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Bowser’s Diary – Community MU Data and Analysis

Zapp Branniglenn

Smash Lord
Joined
Apr 13, 2014
Messages
1,707
Location
Santa Ana, CA
"Ahh! You little sneak! You read my diary!" - Lord Bowser in Paper Mario (N64)

Hello again. We had a dedicated matchup thread in Smash 4 but no notes were ever saved or sorted. So for Ultimate, I think it's important moving forward to collect notes whenever somebody takes the time to research them. I went and did my own notes on the Mario matchup to show examples of things I felt were pertinent to test, but this is a community effort and I will gladly update this OP with more notes provided by other players who have some things to say about matchups. As well as their own ideas about what they feel is pertinent information. I don't expect us to have a full dossier on each matchup, even if we add to this years and years in the future, but I feel like something is better than nothing.

Videos: Big Sean vs Vice - Dec 2018: I like the first match because it shows how well Bowser can come back in a matchup like this where his opponent lacks kill confirms, also shows what happens when you fire breath Mario's Up B.

Ideal stage picks: Final Destination, Smashville. Mario has a very hard time landing against Bowser and these are the best stages to exploit that weakness. Tri-plat stages are sub optimal for Bowser as they allow Mario to extend U-air strings for more damage and to a point where I think he can actually kill Bowser. That being said, platforms are never useless to Bowser so you don’t have too much to fear from a counterpick to Battlefield.

Mario's kill confirms on Bowser: Falling Uair to meteor F-air if Bowser is caught right at the ledge at 60% onward is the only thing I can confirm, and even then DI in and wall teching may save Bowser depending on how far offstage he is.

Bowser's kill confirms on Mario: Falling N-air into B-air at high percents. Or U-air if they are in front of Bowser. Side B is another lethal followup if you have platforms to land on. Falling N-air, falling U-air, a very close falling F-air, and the back portion of Utilt can also confirm into Side B at lower percents, which allows for a potential bowsercide kill.

Neutral – Mario generally struggles with approaching any target with more range than him, opting instead to force the approach with fireballs or charging FLUDD. Mario cannot land against Bowser due to his lack of D-air and no disjoint on N-air. However, Falling U-air will be his landing option of choice due to its excellent combo potential and ease of connecting on tall targets. Be prepared to block that if you don't have time for an anti-air tilt or smash. If he ever burns a double jump or full hops, you should be running directly under him, swiping with Utilts or aerials. You can also feel free to spew flames if Mario is not approaching because Mario is only fast enough to reach over the attack for a punish if he’s already in the middle of an approach.

Mario’s safest tool to wall Bowser out is his short hop double B-air. If you are hit by the first one, don’t panic, Bowser can block the second as long as he isn’t sent into tumble at mid and late percents. Bowser can challenge either B-air in neutral with F-tilt. And if you block the second B-air, the shieldgrab will reach Mario unless he is spaced perfectly. However, it’s not a guaranteed grab, since Mario can spot dodge in time. Definitely go for it to see if he’s that smart, but otherwise avoid it since Mario can spotdodge and punish Bowser’s grab attempt. If you read Mario going for this option, punish with fortress to defeat his dodge or shield jump away to avoid the mind game altogether

Fireballs are easier to avoid now with our frame 3 jumpsquat but keep in mind the damage and knockback are much lower than the average projectile so the stakes in avoiding them are low and probably won’t factor in to your eventual death. Choosing to jab or fortress clank fireballs will stick Bowser in a ~20 frame rebound animation. Pulling up shield and then putting it down after a block is also 20 frames, unless you shield jump in which case it’s just 9 frames. If two fireballs are in play, block the first and shield jump over the next in order to stay on the move.

Edgeguarding – If you can get offstage far enough to reach Mario before he’s within distance of the ledge for his Up B, Bowser’s F-air will kill him. And if Mario air dodges, the height he loses can kill him while Bowser returns safely to the ledge. If you know you can’t reach him in time, you might want to stay on the stage, that Up B will out prioritize your attack without expert timing and can possibly stage spike you which is a risk best avoided if your damage is high. You can spew fire over the edge at him, but he will Up B through it after two or three tries and you’ll only get a small profit in the trade of damage. Bowser can also D-air trade against Mario’s Up B, but that is naturally a risky prospect. If you’re too late you fail, if you’re too early you die, possibly without even hitting him.

Bowsercide – Mario will never return to the ledge from a Bowsercide, so gaining a full stock advantage by spending your current one is an enticing prospect. Remember though that Mario struggles with killing Bowser without an edgeguard or raw smash attack, so Bowser can live a very long time on each stock. If you feel like you've outmatched the opponent, then don't spend stocks needlessly unless it's Mario's last one.

Recovering against Mario – Bowser recovering is Mario’s best shot at earning a stock. FLUDD and Cape can both gimp Bowser if he is in the middle of Fortress while Mario’s B-air can have the knockback to finish Bowser at very high percents. What all these moves have in common is that they’re horizontal, and can be avoided if Bowser makes his recovery as vertical as possible when approaching the ledge. Mario’s only sensible option is to run off and B-air Bowser as he ascends for an attempted stage spike which you should be prepared to tech. In ultimate, teching is impossible if you are hit with something that has enough knockback, but even at 200%, you will still tech Mario’s B-air. If you sense that you’ve gotten Mario conditioned to use this edgeguard by default, then you can start going for higher recoveries as a mixup.

Once at the ledge, there is not much to worry about. You can choose any of the four ledge options that feel comfortable in that moment. You can also let go and Fair or Side B onstage to put out a hitbox if he stayed onstage for his edgeguard attempt.

What to do when grabbed – Weight based throws are out in Ultimate and so is Bowser’s D-air landing combo break tech when grabbed at zero percent, which hurts Bowser, however, Mario’s Dthrow is more susceptible to DI away and his nerfed Utilt hitbox gives him less potential reward at those low percents. He will instead opt for Uthrow into U-airs which will generally be true at any reasonable range but not lead into a kill unless the stage has platforms to extend the combo. My best advice for DI on Uthrow is to mixup between away and toward, since it can drastically change where Mario’s first Uair will send Bowser and it is difficult for him to cover all possibilities. One you’re at ~80% the potential damage reward on his combo throw drops and Mario should opt to Fthrow or Bthrow Bowser to send him offstage which you will of course DI toward the stage.

Additional notes
  • Mario’s raw Usmash will get the kill at about ~150% on FD or ~160% on the bottom of Battlefield. (training mode values)
  • Mario's raw Fsmash is his only attack with decent KO power. On FD the sourspot/sweetspot kills Bowser at ~98%/84% on the edge (no DI) and ~130/110%% center stage (No DI).
  • His shorthop B-air will send Bowser into tumble at about 50 percent, at which point you must tech to avoid followups. (training mode values)
  • Fast fall F-air is a safe poke. If you are spaced well enough where the farther half of the move's range strikes Mario's shield, he has no guaranteed punish. But if you're too close he can shield grab, among other options.
I think my notes are more than a little wordy.On re-read it feels like I'm talking about a lot of Bowser's basics that apply to many matchups rather than shorthand, digestible notes, but I may revise it in the future.
 
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Janx

Banned via Warnings
Joined
May 27, 2019
Messages
8
I just noticed this post and would gladly join the discussion. Give me some time and I'll pull together some MU notes, I think I have some on a laptop somewhere.
 

Zapp Branniglenn

Smash Lord
Joined
Apr 13, 2014
Messages
1,707
Location
Santa Ana, CA
whoa, I don't even remember making this thread. Wish it took off.

Taking a glance at my example notes for Mario, there's some good tips in there but it's a bit wordy. Probably should have gone with a bullet points style for brevity. Some of it also comes off as "how to play Smash" more than focusing on specifically how the matchup is unique. Pointing out which of Bowser's tools is most valuable is a good angle, but a thread like this doesn't need to be a Bowser guide. And some notes seem focused on explaining how the matchup had changed between Smash 4 and Ultimate, but by now Bowser mains are used to the new Bowser and not so familiar with Smash 4 Mario.
 
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