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Meta Boss Select! Megaman Matchup Discussion 2.0

This weeks discussion?


  • Total voters
    7
  • Poll closed .

Xavix

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Megaman Smash Select.jpg

Original Matchup Thread
Introduction
For anyone who remembers classic Megaman, they remember this screen: where Megaman chooses the robot master boss he wants to face next. These bosses all had clear strengths and weaknesses against megaman, and it was the player's job to determine them and use the right weapons to win the fight and become stronger. These traits couldn't apply more to Megaman in Smash, needing to use his varied arsenal properly to overcome any challenging foe. With over a year of Sm4sh being released,the character roster finalized, and the patches finished, we've now reached the perfect time for matchup discussion. The purpose of this thread will be to compare all of Megaman's strengths and weaknesses against each individual character in a competitive environment to determine who has the advantage.

Rules/Structure
To help maintain consistency, here is the schedule for discussion:
  • On Sundays discussion will begin on characters dependent on relevancy in the meta.
  • Each character discussion will last one week until the next Friday, moving onto the next character in the list.
  • Discussion should be about how the two characters movesets help them in the matchup, advantages each has over the other, good stages to pick for the matchup, etc.
  • I will update the OP with the current character of discussion, a characters matchup post discussion (including first post and notable posts.), and after the first round where every character is covered, I will upload (and appreciate help with!) a spreadsheet with each individual matchup on a table.
  • The most notable posts concerning Mega's strategies for the neutral, offense, defense, mixups, and stage selection will be quoted in the post discussion area for each matchup, so focus on those is encouraged. Trying to make this easier for everyone to see the best of that week! (discontinued because my laptop sucks, but these types of posts are still encouraged)
  • Along with the global smashboards rules, please be civil on your opinions compared to others, and do not flame others for their thoughts on a matchup and how they are "wrong" (matchups are opinions, and opinions cannot technically be wrong or right)

Current Matchup discussion
Week 1: Megaman Ryu.jpg from 2/26/16 to 3/4/16
Week 2: image.jpg from 3/4/16 to 3/11/16
Week 3::025: from 3/11/16 to 3/18/16
Week 4::yoshi: from 3/18/16 to 3/25/16
Week 5::4sheik: from 3/25/16 to 4/1/16
Week 6::4cloud:(unfortuanately a randall icon doesn't exist :() from 4/1/16 to 4/10/16
Week 7::mario: from 4/10/16 to 4/17/16
Week 8: :4pit:/:4darkpit: from 4/17/16 to 4/29/16
Week 9: :kirby: from 4/29/16 to 5/8/16
Week 10: :samus: *this was when dates became a bit confusing*
Week 11: :foxmelee:
Week 12: :ness:/:4lucas:
Week 13: :4falcon:
Week 14: :4tlink:

Side notes:
  • quotes for notable advice for discussions won't happen anymore so I don't destroy my computer (it's not very good and the more I type the more it lags), but I will leave it up for Ryu
  • If someone can show me how to make a link with the first posts that would be appreciated :)
First post: Scroll down :)
BugDoctor said:
Luckily, we have a lot of tools for dealing with Ryu. All forms of hadoken will be stuffed by one pellet, making his main long distance damage tool nearly useless unless he uses it unpredictably. Many Ryus also like to use Focus attack to come back to the stage while doing damage, countering an attack, or dashing out of it...but fortunately for us, Focus attack is canned by multi-hitting attacks, which Mega Man has a ton of. Metal Blade, Air Shooter, Slash Claw, Top Spin, Crash Bomb, Spark Shock, and even two quick pellets will knock him out of Focus and leave him open for other follow ups. Leaf Shield will do this as well, but since there is a decent amount of time between hits, I don't like to rely on it for this purpose since Ryu can release his Focus Attack in between the 1st and 2nd hit. That being said, Leaf Shield is still great for just keeping him from starting his combo game, as with many of the combo-heavy characters, so don't be afraid to use it a little more than usual
Megamang said:
Something to note, the ryu does have options. A Ryu well versed in item usage can hit you with a rising aerial that will also grab the metal blade. A rising airdodge at the ledge can all grab the grounded metal blade, and a quick throw is a lagless and powerful getup option. Of course, to grab the blade means they have to wait a little for it to descend, so you can be ready with pellets to beat the blade and then combo the pellets into nair to reset the situation. I like it, developing ledge traps is a solid part of increasing a character's meta potential, considering 'trouble killing' is the flaw of 95% of the cast and top tiers always put extreme pressure at the ledge.
p1ay6ack said:
Im usually playing the neutral by keeping him out with crashbomber, thrown leaf shield, and waiting in hand with my metal blade and finding the right time to open. yes pellets do help, but i wouldn't rely on this too much considering how ryu can shorten the distance easy if you get predictable.
CopShowGuy said:
If Ryu needs to recover horizontally, that's usually a good time for us to finish him off. Tatsumaki isn't a very safe move and it makes his movement easily predicted. Focus dash cancelling can be intercepted. Just don't mess with Shoryuken.
Megamang said:
Being able to connect Uair is a solid indicator of if the MU will go well. It just does so much damage, 2 uairs actually outdamages most of Ryu's BnB, which is insane. It can snatch his foot for trying Fair as an approach. Usually if you have the time, eat the aerial if you know it will trade for uair. Not only will it stop his combo game from starting on the hit, it will put him in a bad situation since his air accel is pretty terrible.
BugDoctor said:
A lot of Ryu's attacks have a decent amount of lag, and leave him open for kill options. If he is charging Focus on the ground and is at kill percent, go for a Z1GMA Upper as the blade will knock him out of the charge (unless he cancels out of it). Hadokens have a decent amount of lag as well, so if a Ryu is trying to use them to create space, jump to dodge one of them and use that opportunity to go for a Blade to Upper. F-Smash is also quite vulnerable to this approach.
BugDoctor said:
This all being said, when a Ryu gets in, it's bad news and we take a lot of damage as a result. Mega Man is pretty heavy, which means he'll last a little bit longer against the inevitable command Shoryuken, but pretty much any combo starter can lead into it, so playing keep away is the most important part of this battle. However, if Mega Man is using his tools properly to create space and avoid significant damage, I find this matchup to be in Mega Man's favour
MegaSpider said:
As I mentioned, Ryu can do heavy damage to us when he gets past our defenses, so when that happens, do everything you can to win back neutral, since Ryu's neutral is really good when he's in control. His Hadokens are weak and are cancelled by our trusty lemons. Honestly, the only Street Fighter combo that scares me is the True Shoryuken, which is crazy powerful and can kill super early.
Megamang said:
Make SURE you know how to SDI his utilt chains, my friend mains Ryu and nothing is dumber than watching him beat people that just sit there in the utilt tornado. You should be able to get out after 2 utilts, and he should never TRSK you from the tilts.
Drarky said:
Final Destination is big, flat and a good place to run away. If Ryu want to keep it up, he's going to have to be running a LOT to catch us, and the Blue Bomber has a lot of room to prepare his projectile game.

Battlefield and Lylat Cruise both follow the same logic: Juggles. Air Shooter is a fantastic tool against Ryu's landing options and messes him up a lot. Not only that but thanks to the platforms, performing falling aerials becomes harder for him and so we have stopped one approaching option for free!

Dream Land works too but the rather low ceiling can be dangerous against Ryu's Shoryuken kills.

Both SV and T&C are okay options, since the few platforms that appear and the moving platform in SV can help Ryu to move around into our zone, and the possibility of getting Shoryuken is rather high.
The general consensus is that the matchup is :4megaman:60:40:4ryu:
First Post
This matchup is generally considered :4megaman:50:50:rosalina:
First Post
This matchup is generally considered :4megaman:50:50:4pikachu:
First Post
This matchup is generally considered for Yoshi to win. (Nobody really gave ratios for this discussion)
 
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CopShowGuy

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It all feels so clean and new!

So Ryu is first?
I'd say we have the advantage as long as we can keep Ryu out. He's super dangerous if he can ever get past our wall of projectiles, however. Thankfully, most of our moves are multi-hits so Focus Attack shouldn't be too big of an issue. Lemons shoot fast enough that he will usually get interrupted during Focus Attack. Uair, Bair, dash attack, Usmash, Dsmash, Metal Blade, Crash Bomb (explosions), and possible Leaf Shield can do the same.

If Ryu needs to recover horizontally, that's usually a good time for us to finish him off. Tatsumaki isn't a very safe move and it makes his movement easily predicted. Focus dash cancelling can be intercepted. Just don't mess with Shoryuken.

Something neat I found out is that you can utilt him when he's using moves that extend his hitboxes beyond his limbs.

This MU is at least a 60:40 in Mega Man's favor.
 
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BugDoctor

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I personally don't find Ryu too bad to deal with, as long as we are able to zone him properly. He can close in fast if we're not careful, and since Mega Man is sort of combo food, Ryu can deal a ton of damage once he manages to get close. The main strategy for this match is to keep Ryu at a distance (as with many matches), and just watch out for his powerful smash attacks and command Shoryuken.

Luckily, we have a lot of tools for dealing with Ryu. All forms of hadoken will be stuffed by one pellet, making his main long distance damage tool nearly useless unless he uses it unpredictably. Many Ryus also like to use Focus attack to come back to the stage while doing damage, countering an attack, or dashing out of it...but fortunately for us, Focus attack is canned by multi-hitting attacks, which Mega Man has a ton of. Metal Blade, Air Shooter, Slash Claw, Top Spin, Crash Bomb, Spark Shock, and even two quick pellets will knock him out of Focus and leave him open for other follow ups. Leaf Shield will do this as well, but since there is a decent amount of time between hits, I don't like to rely on it for this purpose since Ryu can release his Focus Attack in between the 1st and 2nd hit. That being said, Leaf Shield is still great for just keeping him from starting his combo game, as with many of the combo-heavy characters, so don't be afraid to use it a little more than usual.

Pellets are great in general for this matchup, so keep a wall up as best you can and you'll find Ryus will get frustrated and make approach mistakes.

If Ryu recovers low, standing with LS (and also in shield) near the edge is viable I believe, since it will knock him out of his shoryuken at the higher point of the attack. This will often make Ryu drop a bit, and the player will perform another up B out of panic. This usually makes Ryu shoot way over the platform, leaving him open for a punish of your choice (usually S. Claw for me). I think he is pretty vulnerable to leafstooling as well, as long as you perform it a bit further out before he uses shoryuken. I haven't done it often though, so I might be wrong about that...feel free to correct me.

Often times, Ryu players will get frustrated by pellets and will go for an aerial approach. Stuff it with a blade, Air Shooter, or Spark Shock, or just run under and create some distance again. You can also shield the attack and grab if you know they're going to go for it, which allows you to create space again and keep your zoning game up.

A lot of Ryu's attacks have a decent amount of lag, and leave him open for kill options. If he is charging Focus on the ground and is at kill percent, go for a Z1GMA Upper as the blade will knock him out of the charge (unless he cancels out of it). Hadokens have a decent amount of lag as well, so if a Ryu is trying to use them to create space, jump to dodge one of them and use that opportunity to go for a Blade to Upper. F-Smash is also quite vulnerable to this approach.

Ryu's recovery is also incredibly predictable. You can Hard Knuckle him fairly easily during tatsumaki, or if they perform it too high as a return option, you can let a Charge Shot rip and hit him. Heck, toss a blade out there if you want. Shoryuken is also stage-spike material, so go for it if you get a chance. Just be careful at higher percents in case he catches you with the end of it and it kills you. At this point, it's better go try for Leaf Shield shenannigans.

This all being said, when a Ryu gets in, it's bad news and we take a lot of damage as a result. Mega Man is pretty heavy, which means he'll last a little bit longer against the inevitable command Shoryuken, but pretty much any combo starter can lead into it, so playing keep away is the most important part of this battle. However, if Mega Man is using his tools properly to create space and avoid significant damage, I find this matchup to be in Mega Man's favour. I'd put it around 60:40 for Mega Man, in all honesty.
 

Mega-Spider

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Good ol' :4ryu:. I'm still happy that both Capcom mascots are in this game together. :)

Anyway, despite being a top tier character, Ryu loses to Mega Man. I compare the Ryu match up a lot to the Luigi match up. If Ryu can get past our wall of projectiles, he can do some major damage to us, and True Shoryuken us, his trump card. However, doing so is difficult for Ryu since Mega Man's line of defense and strong neutral game keep him away. Focus Attack, another card Ryu players like to pull, doesn't work on us as much since many of our moves are multi-hit and Mega Man's dependency on spacing makes Focus Attack a non-issue. I was going to say that Ryu is also weak in the air, which he is, but Ryu players like to pull F-Airs on us, which comes out really quickly. So if you're gonna for the bread and butter D-Throw into F-Air, do it quickly or better yet, troll him with Air Shooter.

Off stage, Ryu doesn't have much to combat us. Using the Hurricane Kick, while helping his horizontal recovery, doesn't protect him from damage. I often like to use Z-drop Metal Blade into Slash Claw, since he's extremely prone to that.

As I mentioned, Ryu can do heavy damage to us when he gets past our defenses, so when that happens, do everything you can to win back neutral, since Ryu's neutral is really good when he's in control. His Hadokens are weak and are cancelled by our trusty lemons. Honestly, the only Street Fighter combo that scares me is the True Shoryuken, which is crazy powerful and can kill super early.

Overall, this is one of the top tiers that Mega Man has a shot against, and a pretty easy one if played correctly. As far as advice is concerned, keep a steady line of defense against Ryu, gimp him when given the chance, and mix up your approaches to really annoy Ryu players. So, a 60:40 MU.
 

Red Shirt KRT

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I think we have a good matchup here, probably 55-45 in our favor.

The 2 big things that work for us are this.
1- Ryu's airspeed and ground speed. He is really slow in the air and on the ground which makes getting through our lemon walls that much harder.

2- Our projectiles/multihit moves
The only melee attacks that we have that are not multi hit are Dsmash, Usmash, and Fair. All our other attacks are either projectiles or multihits which really nullify his focus attack.

The only thing I would say to add to the OP is have players suggest a matchup number (60-40, 55-45 etc.) otherwise it is badass!
 

p1ay6ack

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i'd say its 60-40 in our favor. the way Im playing the MU is getting a crash bomb on ryu, then either way for him to shield the crashbomber or pick up a dropped a metal blade, wait, then either throw out the metal blade when he stops shielding (insta toss works wonders here cuz of the no end lag) or throw the metalblade at the ending hitbox frames of crashbom. what does this cause? it either hits ryu and allows you to make followups, or it depletes ryu's shield so hard, you can then go for an upair on his depleted shield and get 20%

Im usually playing the neutral by keeping him out with crashbomber, thrown leaf shield, and waiting in hand with my metal blade and finding the right time to open. yes pellets do help, but i wouldn't rely on this too much considering how ryu can shorten the distance easy if you get predictable.
 

---

鉄腕
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On second thought I have decided to leave Zero's Advice open and have it serve as the new general match up thread. The title/OP are good too to let go to waste.

This is looking good so far. Nice and fresh. I've updated the Q&A thread to reflect the recent changes to the board as well as adding the Air Shooter thread. :)
 

Drarky

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One thing that hasn't been mentioned is which stage you may want to fight against Ryu. I feel like both Battlefield, Final Destination and Lylat Cruise are probably our best options.

Final Destination is big, flat and a good place to run away. If Ryu want to keep it up, he's going to have to be running a LOT to catch us, and the Blue Bomber has a lot of room to prepare his projectile game.

Battlefield and Lylat Cruise both follow the same logic: Juggles. Air Shooter is a fantastic tool against Ryu's landing options and messes him up a lot. Not only that but thanks to the platforms, performing falling aerials becomes harder for him and so we have stopped one approaching option for free!

Dream Land works too but the rather low ceiling can be dangerous against Ryu's Shoryuken kills.

Both SV and T&C are okay options, since the few platforms that appear and the moving platform in SV can help Ryu to move around into our zone, and the possibility of getting Shoryuken is rather high.

That's all I have for now, hopefully it will help.
 

Eren Swaeger

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Iirc megaman can duck (maybe even dtilt) ryu's shoryuken. This may be a stretch, but also side b. For this mu, for the most part, stay away from ryu as most of his moves lead to another which may end up in a deadly shoryuken from ryu. You'll want to keep ryu in the air as much as possible or use metal blades to stop his side b. Using rush to stall or even zone ryu put with diagonal metal blades, lemon walls, or lag canceled fair is great aswell. double jump fair or bair to uair hits ryu if he is on the ground as a double jump fair or bair's lag is canceled out if you double jump it. And use a lot of lemons as well.

For stages, dreamland is a high risk, high reward, we have ledges so we can be more creative with metal blade and easier uair setups, but the stage is lower so ryu's true shoryuken kills fairly early. Bf is a better alternative. Lylat is usually a no go for megaman because the lower side of the airwing ( is that what it's called?) catches our metal blades which makes ryu's side b even more helpful. SV and t&c are good choices for megaman. Duck hunt is nice aswell as we a use the trees for more uair pressure or metal blade if they go onto the tree.

This is my first time really posting anything like this. Hope my two cents helped lol
 

p1ay6ack

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battlefield and lylat good against ryu...? i mean i can see how the platforms help us, but if we are in the disadvantage, those platforms can be very detrimental to us. i really wouldnt take ryu to bf or lylat just cuz of how extensive these platforms can enable ryu juggles. fd is fine. you got lots of mobility
 

p1ay6ack

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View attachment 98560
Original Matchup Thread
Introduction
For anyone who remembers classic Megaman, they remember this screen: where Megaman chooses the robot master boss he wants to face next. These bosses all had clear strengths and weaknesses against megaman, and it was the player's job to determine them and use the right weapons to win the fight and become stronger. These traits couldn't apply more to Megaman in Smash, needing to use his varied arsenal properly to overcome any challenging foe. With over a year of Sm4sh being released,the character roster finalized, and the patches finished, we've now reached the perfect time for matchup discussion. The purpose of this thread will be to compare all of Megaman's strengths and weaknesses against each individual character in a competitive environment to determine who has the advantage.

Rules/Structure
To help maintain consistency, here is the schedule for discussion:
  • On Fridays discussion will begin on characters dependent on relevancy in the meta.
  • Each character discussion will last one week until the next Friday, moving onto the next character in the list.
  • Discussion should be about how the two characters movesets help them in the matchup, advantages each has over the other, good stages to pick for the matchup, etc.
  • I will update the OP with the current character of discussion, a characters matchup post discussion (including first post, notable posts or advice, etc.), and after the first round where every character is covered, I will upload (and appreciate help with!) a spreadsheet with each individual matchup on a table.
  • Along with the global smashboards rules, please be civil on your opinions compared to others, and do not flame others for their thoughts on a matchup and how they are "wrong" (matchups are opinions, and opinions cannot technically be wrong or right)

Current Matchup discussion
Week 1: View attachment 98561 from 2/26/16 to 3/4/16


*side note 1, as matchup discussion begins, any thoughts or ideas to improve the OP would be greatly appreciated, thanks!*
*side note 2, this thread was coordinated with the mods and is intended to replace the original matchup discussion thread. You can find the link to the original thread above and the thread for general matchup discussion (will put link in soon).*


I'd like to suggest that under a charachter's MU that there should be categories like neutral, offense, defense, mixup, stage advantage. I understand that for the MU that there will be difference based on playstyle, but it would be cool if we had a basic way to play the neutral on one specific charach. like lemons work good on ryu but on bowswer, lemons work risky and can cause you a stock if you mispace. I stress the basic way to play because we can get the idea this will be effective and you can branch out from the basic way to play based on your playstyle. i think categorizing will help people alot more than just walls of texts
 

Xavix

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I'd like to suggest that under a charachter's MU that there should be categories like neutral, offense, defense, mixup, stage advantage. I understand that for the MU that there will be difference based on playstyle, but it would be cool if we had a basic way to play the neutral on one specific charach. like lemons work good on ryu but on bowswer, lemons work risky and can cause you a stock if you mispace. I stress the basic way to play because we can get the idea this will be effective and you can branch out from the basic way to play based on your playstyle. i think categorizing will help people alot more than just walls of texts
Ok! I'll quote people with good advice on each over the course of each week and put them under a spoiler in the OP after the discussion has ended.
We need folks from the Ryu boards to comment too.
I actually asked people to put in some input over here, I'll post in the official matchup thread while I'm at it.
EDIT: Thanks Pacman9 for beating me to the punch :)
 
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Eren Swaeger

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Are we covering megamans bad mu's like pikachu next or are we just doing random characters ?
 
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Megamang

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We started here because we already had a Ryu conversation going.

They are currently discussing megaman in their thread, but I don't think it has much commentary. Last I checked, Emblem Lord said more was coming soon, which is nice because he has solid writeups.

Ok, a small correction. Ryu actually has really good airspeed, its just his air acceleration which is poor. Which is even better, because megaman has solid air accel and can stop Ryu's air movement with a single pellet, meaning he should never reach high speed. But don't think of it as purely outspeeding him and being surprised when he catches you, it is an outmanuevering situation more than pure speed.

Due to his height and need to approach, air shooter does wonders. Pellets stop his ground game (make sure you SH backwards if he makes a good approach such as a powershield advance) and S.claw and air shooter eat him in the air. The disadvantage you have is his crazy kill confirms and weight means he will be killing at a lower % than us, but our % comes much easier.

If you die first due to this, don't think you have to approach. Zone him and pester him with projectiles, throwing yourself at him is a good way to make his lead insurmountable. (No lead is insurmountable due to our ability to gimp in this MU).

Make SURE you know how to SDI his utilt chains, my friend mains Ryu and nothing is dumber than watching him beat people that just sit there in the utilt tornado. You should be able to get out after 2 utilts, and he should never TRSK you from the tilts.

I like battlefield because while both characters are heavy, the longer living is nice vs a character you can gimp. Leaves into grab is always a nice way to get him offstage, but don't be afraid to mix in F/U throws with air shooter juggles. Get creative, fake jumps, shoot many air shooters, bait him to think you're going to bair when you uair, do whatever you can do to get air shooters. They really do a lot of damage and can kill from a safe distance.

Basically, horizontally keep him walled with pellets. Anything else, slap him around with bair and uair.
 

Xavix

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Well, looks like we know who we're discussing next week, right guys?
Actually, I started Ryu because we were discussing him in the last thread. I was considering doing a few different options, but if Rosalina (or Pikachu) wants to be discussed next we can! I have no idea who to pick next so please pick for me suggest away!
 
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Eren Swaeger

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We should do pikachu because if pokemon sun and moon. But rosa is ok too, I just want pikachu cuz I need more help on the mu.
 

Mega-Spider

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Xavix Xavix Maybe that's something else we can do. Near the end of the discussions, we can spend a short time discussing who could be our next discussion?
 

Eren Swaeger

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Xavix Xavix Maybe that's something else we can do. Near the end of the discussions, we can spend a short time discussing who could be our next discussion?
I reckon we should to avoid messages that aren't applied to the matter at hand, say, ryu.
 

Xavix

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Xavix Xavix Maybe that's something else we can do. Near the end of the discussions, we can spend a short time discussing who could be our next discussion?
Ok. On Fridays we'll *briefly* discuss who's next to talk about. I don't want to spend forever on it.
I reckon we should to avoid messages that aren't applied to the matter at hand, say, ryu.
Good point. Back to Ryu :).
I've noticed that Ryu is suprisingly weak to Air Shooter for some reason. He seems to get caught in it everytime he is above me on platforms as he doesn't have a reliable way to deal with it.
 

Mega-Spider

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Ok. On Fridays we'll *briefly* discuss who's next to talk about. I don't want to spend forever on it.

Good point. Back to Ryu :).
I've noticed that Ryu is suprisingly weak to Air Shooter for some reason. He seems to get caught in it everytime he is above me on platforms as he doesn't have a reliable way to deal with it.
Air Shooter: The troll of Mega Man's arsenal. :p
Since Ryu's air game isn't his strongest point, we can exploit that by juggling him.
 

Sorichuudo

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I wouldn't mind discussing Rosalina next as i am losing 2x0 sets against our local Rosalina player.

Don't think i can add much to Ryu here, Focus attack doesn't do much for him since most of our kit is multihit. We can also duck under some of his moves and potentialy punish with an utilt, but it doesn't seem as useful as against Falcon's dash grab, since he wont be running in then just stopping and trying to utilt you.
Overall, I can see we having a small advantadge in this MU.
 

Mega-Spider

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Something noteworthy about Ryu: Both his Hadokens are pretty weak projectiles that while have a decent amount of damage on them, clank with our pellets.
 

Xavix

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Something noteworthy about Ryu: Both his Hadokens are pretty weak projectiles that while have a decent amount of damage on them, clank with our pellets.
Yea, it pretty much destroys Ryu's defensive and camping game, reserving them for mixups at best. Regardless, Ryu seems to be forced to play defensively for most of the matchup, but what makes so much closer is that it's incredibly difficult for Megaman to escape Ryu's combos. I found that scaring the Ryu to not take openings in fear of getting punished is Megaman's best mindgame in the matchup, and leaving Ryu in a bad spot from the start seems to be the key for me.
 

Mega-Spider

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Yea, it pretty much destroys Ryu's defensive and camping game, reserving them for mixups at best. Regardless, Ryu seems to be forced to play defensively for most of the matchup, but what makes so much closer is that it's incredibly difficult for Megaman to escape Ryu's combos. I found that scaring the Ryu to not take openings in fear of getting punished is Megaman's best mindgame in the matchup, and leaving Ryu in a bad spot from the start seems to be the key for me.
Ryu has mind games of his own, such as his Focus Attack being cancelable in the air, allowing him for a slightly better recovery. Of course, since most of our moves are multi-hit, Focus Attack isn't going to be his friend in the MU.
We have the potential to be one of Ryu's worst match ups because our tools are made to combat a character like Ryu. It's basically the Luigi effect: Can do damage up close, but we have such a tight grip on our walls, they can still lose the match up.
 

Sorichuudo

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After we are done discussing here, will we have a write up on a thread exclusive for the MU?
 

Eren Swaeger

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Also, using zair or throwing the metal blade down when they're on the ledge works as a frame trap if you use uair after, the blade will catch their normal and attack getup which will combo them into uair, or the uair can catch their roll or jump. Of course, they can wait this out but, they lose vulnerability if they stay.
 

Megamang

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I'm having a little trouble picturing it hitting a roll, unless you are u-airing where the roll will end up... and the metal blade covers the ledge area?

That is pretty awesome if it really combos. Stuff like that will only improve our Uair game, which is huge since it does an amazing amount of damage.

Something to note, the ryu does have options. A Ryu well versed in item usage can hit you with a rising aerial that will also grab the metal blade. A rising airdodge at the ledge can all grab the grounded metal blade, and a quick throw is a lagless and powerful getup option. Of course, to grab the blade means they have to wait a little for it to descend, so you can be ready with pellets to beat the blade and then combo the pellets into nair to reset the situation. I like it, developing ledge traps is a solid part of increasing a character's meta potential, considering 'trouble killing' is the flaw of 95% of the cast and top tiers always put extreme pressure at the ledge.


If they are doing the rising airdodge to counteract the grounded blade, a charged fsmash will send them back out dramatically and I believe beat the metal blade with a little charge.

Damn I wish the blade sat in the ground spinning, leaving a constant hitbox, gyro style :baneling:
 

Eren Swaeger

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I'm having a little trouble picturing it hitting a roll, unless you are u-airing where the roll will end up... and the metal blade covers the ledge area?

That is pretty awesome if it really combos. Stuff like that will only improve our Uair game, which is huge since it does an amazing amount of damage.

Something to note, the ryu does have options. A Ryu well versed in item usage can hit you with a rising aerial that will also grab the metal blade. A rising airdodge at the ledge can all grab the grounded metal blade, and a quick throw is a lagless and powerful getup option. Of course, to grab the blade means they have to wait a little for it to descend, so you can be ready with pellets to beat the blade and then combo the pellets into nair to reset the situation. I like it, developing ledge traps is a solid part of increasing a character's meta potential, considering 'trouble killing' is the flaw of 95% of the cast and top tiers always put extreme pressure at the ledge.


If they are doing the rising airdodge to counteract the grounded blade, a charged fsmash will send them back out dramatically and I believe beat the metal blade with a little charge.

Damn I wish the blade sat in the ground spinning, leaving a constant hitbox, gyro style :baneling:

Forgot to mention. You can also wait the uair out if you're expecting a roll to hit them with the uair. The uair still connects if they jump, attack, or do a normal ledge getup, but it's less damage.
 
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Megamang

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Being able to connect Uair is a solid indicator of if the MU will go well. It just does so much damage, 2 uairs actually outdamages most of Ryu's BnB, which is insane. It can snatch his foot for trying Fair as an approach. Usually if you have the time, eat the aerial if you know it will trade for uair. Not only will it stop his combo game from starting on the hit, it will put him in a bad situation since his air accel is pretty terrible.
 

Mega-Spider

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Being able to connect Uair is a solid indicator of if the MU will go well. It just does so much damage, 2 uairs actually outdamages most of Ryu's BnB, which is insane. It can snatch his foot for trying Fair as an approach. Usually if you have the time, eat the aerial if you know it will trade for uair. Not only will it stop his combo game from starting on the hit, it will put him in a bad situation since his air accel is pretty terrible.
You ain't no air fighter, Ryu! XD

BTW, as much as we have the advantage, look out for Collarbone Breaker. It's an extremely strong shield pressure tool, and can even break shields. I suggest power shielding in this MU because of that.
 

Megamang

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Yea, unless you powershield don't try and punish a Ryu OOS. It doesn't seem like it should be, but his reckless kicks on your shield are actually totally safe.

And mega-spider is totally right, make sure you don't eat a collarbone breaker on your shield without a PS. If he starts doing a pressure string and ends it with collarbone breaker, it is escapable. The startup is too slow to be a true blockstring. Roll, jump-AD, or Spotdodge out of there before it breaks your shield. Ryu is one of the best at punishing a broken shield too, it isn't good news.

If he gets you on the edge of a platform or stage, mash jump... not sure what causes it, but sometimes when you are shieldbroken you can just suddenly footstool off for safety. *shrug*
 

Sorichuudo

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If he gets you on the edge of a platform or stage, mash jump... not sure what causes it, but sometimes when you are shieldbroken you can just suddenly footstool off for safety. *shrug*
Yeah, Chopper Dave mentioned that sometime ago, something about still being able to do a footstool while on the falling animation of a shield break.
 
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