Social Banjo-Kazooie Social Thread - Project Dream Come True!

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Banjo

Never said everybody would accept hard facts. *shrugs*

 

[TheBeastHimself]

Don't know why people downplay Minecraft so much. You are blind if you can't see how monumental the game has been to the industry, how huge it is, etc. Unfortunately, Banjo does not hold a candle to Minecraft's legacy.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Don't know why people downplay Minecraft so much. You are blind if you can't see how monumental the game has been to the industry, how huge it is, etc. Unfortunately, Banjo does not hold a candle to Minecraft's legacy.

Pretty much.

Though in the end, being the bigger game doesn't mean that character will get in. That's really not how it actually works in any official capacity. As I said before, there is a pattern than a company's biggest icon(s) get in first(and right now Microsoft's biggest icons are Chief and Steve without a doubt. Chief is pretty much dead in the water right now, and Steve is a highly viable choice. Banjo still could be chosen over him, of course. Neither one is anywhere near a lock of the two). Another thing is that at least with the other companies, the choices were also a lot easier. Microsoft bought out their biggest icons from other companies. But also considering how much easier it was to translate the rest of the major icons to Smash. Steve is not hard to make work in Smash, but he's definitely not super easy either. There's more effort required than some characters. B&K does honestly look easier to translate in, but at best that's another pattern(using a character who is easier to throw in first). It's no different from the pattern than a company's first character is their biggest icon(s). They're both just noticeable patterns and at the end of the day, patterns are not something one should take seriously.

This is why I don't really consider Steve nor Banjo a lock whatsoever as playable. They're both highly viable. Steve has a bit of an advantage, but I wouldn't call it a huge one either. At one point, sure. But now? Not so much. Now, if Microsoft is involved, you can bet Steve will show up in some form. Besides the most recognizable Minecraft character by far(no, Creeper is not as well known. Come on, people. He's not the mascot whatsoever. He's the most recognizable monster in the game instead), he's a huge gaming icon. Why wouldn't he at least cameo via a costume or spirit if he's not playable? I firmly believe Master Chief will appear in a cameo sort of way too(of course, I can be wrong, but as I said, I don't consider that tweet meaningful. Especially since if it means anything, Master Chief cannot appear in any possible way in order to fit the context. But since I highly doubt he'll be ignored at all, he's a pretty safe prediction for me to be an NPC role). I also believe Banjo would show up in some way too(and obviously when I say Banjo, I do mean Banjo & Kazooie in total). So basically, if Microsoft is involved, Banjo, Master Chief, and Steve are going to show up, imo. They're the biggest characters they own right now that have the requests to justify it. Sure, only two are major gaming icons, but it's not like that's a requirement to cameo either. As Geno proved ages ago.

 

[Mr. Stagg]

I feel like I keep getting baited because there is stuff I want to say but it will just keep the argument going longer, it's all stuff everyone has heard before, and it will all be considered null and void because "Minecraft is more relevant".

Kinda hard to speculate and have a little fun when one or two people come around to step on everyone's toes. Shame that the Relevance argument continues when K.Rool, Simon and Ridley utterly destroys it. Best to ignore it and move on.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Kinda hard to speculate and have a little fun when one or two people come around to step on everyone's toes. Shame that the Relevance argument continues when K.Rool, Simon and Ridley utterly destroys it. Best to ignore it and move on.

None of these destroy it. Castlevania, Donkey Kong Country, and Metroid are highly relevant series. Ridley literally has been showing up for years.

The games being still relevant is a big deal for these characters. Every single character in Ultimate can be tied to a fully relevant series, so the relevancy argument doesn't do anything good for Banjo at all. Not that it matters much, since it's a guideline, not a key factor in them getting in. If anything, relevancy can affect who gets in before another, which can be why Golden Sun has no one in Ultimate compared to more relevant series. Yet they still got tons of content, so clearly relevancy isn't the entire point. Besides that, relevancy has mainly been used in context of veterans and 1st parties only, so it's meaningless for 3rd parties(though coincidentally every 3rd party franchise in Ultimate has been from highly relevant series, so...)

 

[Guynamednelson]

Every single character in Ultimate can be tied to a fully relevant series, so the relevancy argument doesn't do anything good for Banjo at all.

Regardless of how relevant the franchise is, Xbox Ones bundled with Game Pass show Banjo on the box art.

It's Nuts and Bolts Banjo, but it still helps people get exposed to Banjo.

 

[Dinoman96]

Honestly I don't think it's simply just about "relevancy". I think it's also about "legacy".

One could say that characters Geno and Krystal, while irrelevent characters themselves, are also tied to relevant series (Star Fox isn't in the best of shape but it's not exactly F-Zero tier of dead, it had Zero and for the first time SF2 come out recently, as well as a elaborate crossover appearance in Starlink. Even after Zero flopped, Miyamoto still expressed his desire to make SF as well as Pikmin into household names) and yet despite being popular candidates, neither of them made it in, while K. Rool did. I think that's because, in comparison to other fan favorites, K. Rool's credentials are far greater, despite not appearing in a long time as well.

He was the main villain and final boss of several critically and commercially successful Donkey Kong platforming games back in the 90s. Even Donkey Kong 64, which is mostly maligned these days, was a blockbuster hit for the N64, selling over five million copies. K. Rool was also a main character in that wack CG cartoon, which, believe it or not, was actually popular in Japan and France. Geno on the other hand was just a supporting character in one (well regarded) Mario RPG spinoff from years ago...and that was kind of it. Krystal was a supporting character in three not super well regarded Star Fox games (Out of Adventures, Assault and Command, only the former cracked a million units), and the game she debuted in wasn't even really a Star Fox game to begin with, which is why I feel it's not so surprising that she wasn't a high priority for Brawl's roster and that Wolf got in over her because he could work as a hacked together semi-clone with several borrowed animations from other characters. Both those characters have their fans and I wouldn't be against them being included, but objectively speaking, they just don't really mean very much to their respective series. K. Rool on the other hand is integral to the legacy of DKC, in-spite of not appearing in the Retro Studios games.

In regards to Golden Sun, it's just not as big of a deal as its fans make it out to be. It had two popular games from the early 2000s, a third game that came out several years later that no one liked, and that was it. It didn't really leave much of an impact on anything, and it's not one of those old classic in-house games that Nintendo likes to celebrate with re-releases and references. It's just kind of a middling, abandoned franchise. It's not so hard to see why Isaac wasn't prioritised over K. Rool, Ridley and Simon, the three non-echo newcomers that Sakurai claims he took from the ballot.

As for Banjo & Kazooie, I do think there's a good enough legacy there. Their games didn't sell as much as a lot of the other third parties present in Smash, but the brand definitely still has huge historical ties to Nintendo in that it basically was, at some point in time, a Nintendo franchise itself. It's always kind of sad to look at old N64 commercials/ads and see Banjo promintently featured among Nintendo's cast.

I don't want to get my hopes too high, but I hope those MCC on Switch rumors from king zell come to fruition, as it could pave the way for more collaborations with Nintendo and Microsoft, which in turn could lead to Banjo and other MS characters possibly making the cut at some point in the future.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Regardless of how relevant the franchise is, Xbox Ones bundled with Game Pass show Banjo on the box art.
View attachment 199576
It's Nuts and Bolts Banjo, but it still helps people get exposed to Banjo.

Yeah, that sounds about right.

Though as I said, relevancy isn't a factor for 3rd parties anyway. It was never an issue related to Banjo. Relevancy has only been applied to vets and 1st parties, and we know it's not the only factor not is it a necessity. Sure, it has affect some(Isaac, poor guy), but that happens. Meanwhile relevant franchises still got characters in Ultimate otherwise.

To say the least, Sakurai probably would want Banjo's more known design anyway, not unlike what he did with Pac-Man. It's a way more popular version too.

 

[N3ON]

Relevancy... legacy... iconography... argue over those terms if you want, but it's almost missing the forest for the trees here. Because, labels aside, when you sell 150 million units you're a big name in the industry, and that's what Smash looks for.

It's true that the series resonates more than the character, but the series coming before the rep is not new nor irregular for third-parties. Happened both with Cloud and Simon. Because sometimes the series is most salient.

On the other hand, Banjo has very close ties with Nintendo. That seems less important than it used to be, but it has enabled him to receive a very notable amount of demand from within the fanbase, which serendipitously kicked off during the ballot. That is something which has, in the past, proved important towards inclusion as well; Smash also looks for that. Or, at least Sakurai does. Plus the timing was fortuitous.

The characters don't really have much overlap when it comes to merits, their strengths almost lie at opposite ends, but either one being included is plausible, and not without reason. Bellyaching won't change that. Who knows, maybe we'll get both.

 

[TheAnvil]

Don't know why people downplay Minecraft so much. You are blind if you can't see how monumental the game has been to the industry, how huge it is, etc. Unfortunately, Banjo does not hold a candle to Minecraft's legacy.

Nobody's downplaying Minecraft, they're simply pointing out that certain individuals are conflating Minecraft's success with the interchangeable default skin.

 

[NonSpecificGuy]

In my opinion, going by the majority of the inclusions in the base game of Ultimate, I'd say Banjo is a more likely candidate. Strictly because of the fact that K. Rool, Ridley, Simon, Isabelle, and even the echoes like Daisy, Dark Samus, and Chrom were all picked solely off a fan demand despite whether they were relevant or iconic.

If Sakurai and Nintendo are going off of that same mindset they had for the base game when choosing a potential Microsoft character it's likely THEY would go for Banjo because of fan demand. However, that's not to say that Microsoft won't push for Steve to be in instead. Despite that I think they wouldn't push too hard for Steve. I think Phil Spencer, PR talk or not, has made an image of himself as a sort of face for the Banjo fanbase. I figure he'd probably try and do right by what he KNOWS people want but I guess we'll see.

 

[EricTheGamerman]

I don’t think I’ve posted here since Ultimate actually released, but I thought I’d come here to see some renewed hope for Banjo based upon The Master Chief Collection showing up on Steam and Newell crediting Phil Spencer in that endeavor. It’s not directly Nintendo/Microsoft related, but it is an unprecedented level of cooperation between Microsoft and another company, which I would think should only breed more optimism in this thread. I’m a little sad that doesn’t seem to be completely the case (I’ve only gone through a few of the more recent pages, so I may not be super well informed either).

But I’ll also add my two cents to the whole situation and say that Mojang practically acts as an independent arm of Microsoft, so I don’t really see a Steve in competition with Banjo in a traditional sense. I think they’re pretty different situations and would be chosen for entirely different reasons because they’re so far removed from one another. I’m surprised some fans remain as territorial about them as they do to be completely honest given that besides being under the umbrella of Microsoft, they just don’t have much overlap at all.

It’s just going to come down to whoever Nintendo and Sakurai picked if we even have a Microsoft related rep. If we do get one, I doubt there was any competition between the two and more just a decision made to go for a character and that character realized.

I really hope Banjo shows up, as I think he’s just an amazing all around next step for Smash in terms of cooperation and legacy building for the franchise itself in addition to my own personal enjoyment of his character. But I’ve never been completely convinced of him as even close to a lock. He was impossible until a couple years ago, and I still don’t see him as super likely in the grand scheme of things. But I think he’d be something truly special if the parties involved decide to make him happen.

 

[TheAnvil]

In my opinion, going by the majority of the inclusions in the base game of Ultimate, I'd say Banjo is a more likely candidate. Strictly because of the fact that K. Rool, Ridley, Simon, Isabelle, and even the echoes like Daisy, Dark Samus, and Chrom were all picked solely off a fan demand despite whether they were relevant or iconic.

If Sakurai and Nintendo are going off of that same mindset they had for the base game when choosing a potential Microsoft character it's likely THEY would go for Banjo because of fan demand. However, that's not to say that Microsoft won't push for Steve to be in instead. Despite that I think they wouldn't push too hard for Steve. I think Phil Spencer, PR talk or not, has made an image of himself as a sort of face for the Banjo fanbase. I figure he'd probably try and do right by what he KNOWS people want but I guess we'll see.

It really depends on their approach.
Mega Man was the first Capcom character, chosen before a far more successful character Ryu due to sheer fan demand and legacy with Nintendo. And before Monster Hunter content despite MH being a massive modern success story.

If I see any parallel between Steve/Banjo, it's that Minecraft is Microsoft's Monster Hunter, but Banjo is their Mega Man.

Again when it came to adding a Castlevania character, Sakurai professed that most players were more FAMILIAR with Alucard, but chose the Belmonts because Smash fans would PREFER them, even though they haven't been in games for a while.

However when it came to adding a Square rep, we got Cloud over Geno. That could be to do with licensing issues and Square being awkward to deal with. But even so, Sakurai went with the fan favorite Cloud, over a more recent character like Noctis.

 

[Mr. Stagg]

It really depends on their approach.
Mega Man was the first Capcom character, chosen before a far more successful character Ryu due to sheer fan demand and legacy with Nintendo. And before Monster Hunter content despite MH being a massive modern success story.

If I see any parallel between Steve/Banjo, it's that Minecraft is Microsoft's Monster Hunter, but Banjo is their Mega Man.

Again when it came to adding a Castlevania character, Sakurai professed that most players were more FAMILIAR with Alucard, but chose the Belmonts because Smash fans would PREFER them, even though they haven't been in games for a while.

However when it came to adding a Square rep, we got Cloud over Geno. That could be to do with licensing issues and Square being awkward to deal with. But even so, Sakurai went with the fan favorite Cloud, over a more recent character like Noctis.

Can't forget that at the time, Mega Man was considered a "Dead Franchise". No new game in sight with the meme going on that Capcom hates Mega Man.

 

[Quick Gaming (QG)]

Mega Man before any other more relevant Capcom rep
Cloud before a more relevant Square Enix rep
Joker before a more iconic Shin Megami Tensei/Persona character

It’s really a coin toss between Banjo and Steve at this point. My hope is that the coin lands on its side and we get both of them, but that’s not very likely. Hoping Banjo and expecting Steve, lets see what happens

 

[osby]

Joker before a more iconic Shin Megami Tensei/Persona character

I'm sure Joker is the most iconic Persona character at this point.

 

[Llort A. Ton]

Can't forget that at the time, Mega Man was considered a "Dead Franchise". No new game in sight with the meme going on that Capcom hates Mega Man.

This is important. Mega Man Legends 3 was just hot of the cancellation, Mega Man oddly wasnt even in UMVC3 despite 2 of his own characters being in, and the famous fatass bad boxart Mega Man was a character for Street Fighter X Tekken. A very bad time to be a Mega Man fan, but he still made it! And now MM is a relevant franchise again because of Smash.

 

[Pyra]

I'm sure Joker is the most iconic Persona character at this point.

I second this notion.
P5 had great timing and accessibility and it became massively popular because of it as far as I'm aware

 

[TheAnvil]

Joker is a weird one, because Persona is a fairly niche IP in of itself. It received critical acclaim but didn't do as well in terms of sales as you'd think based on the hype. Plus it's in the same family of games as SMT, and really Jack Frost is the more prevalent character. He could be a case of Sakurai going with what fans prefer, or he could be going with what's more current.

Can't forget that at the time, Mega Man was considered a "Dead Franchise". No new game in sight with the meme going on that Capcom hates Mega Man.

Mega Man didn't even make it into Tatsuoko vs. Capcom or Marvel vs. Capcom 3. That's how dead he was.

-------------------------------------------------------

If Erdrick gets into Smash, it'd again be a case of Sakurai going for a more popular character than a prevalent (current) one.

 

[Dinoman96]

Mega Man didn't even make it into Tatsuoko vs. Capcom

Right there in the back.

 

[TheAnvil]

...That's Volnutt.

 

[osby]

Joker is a weird one, because Persona is a fairly niche IP in of itself. It received critical acclaim but didn't do as well in terms of sales as you'd think based on the hype. Plus it's in the same family of games as SMT, and really Jack Frost is the more prevalent character. He could be a case of Sakurai going with what fans prefer, or he could be going with what's more current.

Jack Frost is hardly a prevalent character, he's just a mascot.

 

[Dinoman96]

...That's Volnutt.

Yes, but Tatsunoko still had a Mega Man. Unlike Marvel 3.

If MVC3 or UMVC3 had say, Mega Man Exe, there wouldn't have been any big riots because the game would of at least had some form of MM, even if it wasn't Classic. I think that was the crux of the issue. Even Marvel Infinite got that right by including X.

 

[TheAnvil]

Yes, but Tatsunoko still had a Mega Man. Unlike Marvel 3.

If MVC3 or UMVC3 had say, Mega Man Exe, there wouldn't have been any big riots because the game would of at least had some form of MM, even if it wasn't Classic. I think that was the crux of the issue.

I don't believe that to be the case, people wanted Mega Man, and they also wanted X. They both always ranked high in the various ballots and polls. Saying Volnutt served as some sort of proxy for the classic Mega Man would almost be like saying Ken is in Tatsunoko vs. Capcom too, just because Ryu is.

Frank and Zero both had Mega Man costumes in MvC3. Hell, Zero had his own series called Mega Man Zero.

Jack Frost is hardly a prevalent character, he's just a mascot.

Prevalent as in, more frequently used and exposed.

 

[weallfloatdownhere7]

Jack Frost is hardly a prevalent character, he's just a mascot.

Sorta like Steve?

(Sorry, I had to)

 

[osby]

Sorta like Steve?

(Sorry, I had to)

No, sorta like Pikachu. The character you play as can't be not prevalent.

 

[KingMinjo91]

No, sorta like Pikachu. The character you play as can't be not prevalent.

Well... nobody plays as him, because they just switch skins as soon as they start the game. There's nothing about him that makes him a "character" no matter how you look at it. Actually... mascot would be a better way to describe Steve. Wait, no... even then, the Creeper does that better.

Heh, yeah, couldn't help myself either.

 

[weallfloatdownhere7]

No, sorta like Pikachu. The character you play as can't be not prevalent.

You don’t even really play as “Steve” though

 

[EricTheGamerman]

It really depends on their approach.
Mega Man was the first Capcom character, chosen before a far more successful character Ryu due to sheer fan demand and legacy with Nintendo. And before Monster Hunter content despite MH being a massive modern success story.

If I see any parallel between Steve/Banjo, it's that Minecraft is Microsoft's Monster Hunter, but Banjo is their Mega Man.

Again when it came to adding a Castlevania character, Sakurai professed that most players were more FAMILIAR with Alucard, but chose the Belmonts because Smash fans would PREFER them, even though they haven't been in games for a while.

However when it came to adding a Square rep, we got Cloud over Geno. That could be to do with licensing issues and Square being awkward to deal with. But even so, Sakurai went with the fan favorite Cloud, over a more recent character like Noctis.

Monster Hunter wasn’t some massive success story in 2013-2014 though. There was no reason to pick it over the absolutely bigger IPs that Capcom has. It was successful and had seen decent sales overall, but Monster Hunter at the time had not taken off like it has now and we were still excited at getting those ports of 3 for 3DS and Wii U from what I remember.

Putting Minecraft in that same category is super misguided I feel like. Minecraft isn’t just another well selling IP that Microsoft owns. It’s a generation defining game that has sold 10 of millions of copies and merch. All from one continually updated game. Which again, touched upon the fact I don’t think you can use comparisons of past third parties when discussing Minecraft vs Banjo. It’s just so completely removed that we don’t have a precedent for something like this, especially when Mojang again barely functions as Microsoft proper in most cases.

I was also under the impression that Simon was chosen because he had a greater history with Nintendo as opposed to the specific fan demand? I could be wrong on that, but I remember that roughly from Sakurai’s discussion of Castlevania in Smash.

Additionaly, Cloud actually was the fan demanded character since he had the most support of a Final Fantasy character and Sakurai focused on representing that series first before he really focused in on Cloud specially. I also think that you almost HAVE to go for FF first in that situation. Despite Geno’s popularity and how much I want him, I think choosing him over FF would have been a complete misstep in choosing the first Square rep...

 

[BravadoMan_13]

While more newcomers come from third parties with big legacies i.e. Castlevania, Final Fantasy, Mega Man, Sonic, etc, Banjo & Kazooie's legacy is with the N64 titles. That's what makes them icons (while not the high level success of Mario, Pokemon and whatnot) who were heavily marketed in the N64 era alongside Mario, DK, and Pikachu. Sure it doesn't mean much like it did years ago, but the Nintendo All-Star factor shouldn't be forgotten. Legally yes, they are under Microsoft, but at heart Banjo & Kazooie are Nintendo characters who belong on the roster. They were all-stars back then and people haven't forgotten about that. Of course, the younger generation as a whole don't pay much attention to the B-K games as much as Minecraft and I have been around kids that do talk about Minecraft. But with a confirmation, kids will become attached to Banjo & Kazooie like they did with K. Rool ever since August 8.

 

[Mr. Stagg]

While more newcomers come from third parties with big legacies i.e. Castlevania, Final Fantasy, Mega Man, Sonic, etc, Banjo & Kazooie's legacy is with the N64 titles. That's what makes them icons (while not the high level success of Mario, Pokemon and whatnot) who were heavily marketed in the N64 era alongside Mario, DK, and Pikachu. Sure it doesn't mean much like it did years ago, but the Nintendo All-Star factor shouldn't be forgotten. Legally yes, they are under Microsoft, but at heart Banjo & Kazooie are Nintendo characters who belong on the roster. They were all-stars back then and people haven't forgotten about that. Of course, the younger generation as a whole don't pay much attention to the B-K games as much as Minecraft and I have been around kids that do talk about Minecraft. But with a confirmation, kids will become attached to Banjo & Kazooie like they did with K. Rool ever since August 8.

Minecraft may have shaped a generation, but Banjo-Kazooie did as well for the previous one. Ask any gamer from the 90's and they'll tell you how Banjo-kazooie was at least known and fondly remembered.

 

[TheAnvil]

Monster Hunter wasn’t some massive success story in 2013-2014 though. There was no reason to pick it over the absolutely bigger IPs that Capcom has. It was successful and had seen decent sales overall, but Monster Hunter at the time had not taken off like it has now and we were still excited at getting those ports of 3 for 3DS and Wii U from what I remember.

Putting Minecraft in that same category is super misguided I feel like. Minecraft isn’t just another well selling IP that Microsoft owns. It’s a generation defining game that has sold 10 of millions of copies and merch. All from one continually updated game. Which again, touched upon the fact I don’t think you can use comparisons of past third parties when discussing Minecraft vs Banjo. It’s just so completely removed that we don’t have a precedent for something like this, especially when Mojang again barely functions as Microsoft proper in most cases.

I was also under the impression that Simon was chosen because he had a greater history with Nintendo as opposed to the specific fan demand? I could be wrong on that, but I remember that roughly from Sakurai’s discussion of Castlevania in Smash.

Additionaly, Cloud actually was the fan demanded character since he had the most support of a Final Fantasy character and Sakurai focused on representing that series first before he really focused in on Cloud specially. I also think that you almost HAVE to go for FF first in that situation. Despite Geno’s popularity and how much I want him, I think choosing him over FF would have been a complete misstep in choosing the first Square rep...

Monster Hunter had already sold 28 million units by March of 2014 (it's at 53 as of 2018). While Mega Man had more at that point (by about 2 or 3 million), it was a dormant IP, and one that had been around a hell of a lot longer than MH. It had absolutely taken off in a massive way.

Remember, it was seen as a massive oversight by Capcom fans that Monster Hunter was not included in Marvel vs. Capcom 3 which was out in 2011 (the MH team rejected Niitsuma's request to use it).

And no, Simon was chosen because fans wanted him more than Alucard according to Sakurai:
https://twitter.com/AllSourceGaming/status/1074584068291944448

 

[habibyo25]

I kind of like the fact that we have diverse opinions in this thread, I'm learning a lot about those who hold different view points than I do and it makes for a good healthy discussion. As someone who wants Banjo really bad, there have been a couple of things in this thread that have been bugging me. Minecraft is a huge game and we cannot simply write that success off just because we don't like Minecraft or don't want Steve in Smash. I also have seen people speaking on behalf of Minecraft fans and on behalf of gamers as a whole it seems. By saying that Minecraft fans don't even know who Steve is, is something I don't feel many of us can assess as we all typically are not Minecraft fans we don't know how that fanbase feels as a whole on Steve. Us gamers have different experiences when it comes to Minecraft, some of us may know who Steve is and some of us may not, but we cannot speak for all gamers because of an experience one of us has felt. I'm sure we would not appreciate it if people were putting words into our mouths, so it's really not cool to do that. We could point out that some are doing the same to us, but that doesn't matter as a Banjo-Kazooie fanbase we are for the most part, older than the fanbase of Minecraft. We should be setting an example, instead of stooping to the same levels as some who choose to act in an unfortunate way. I love Banjo and I love the support he has, but that support shouldn't turn into bashing a franchise that we may not like it's gotten old and tiring. It's also a bit childish. In a way, since right now Banjo-Kazooie are a inactive franchise we the fans are the representatives of the bear and bird duo, we should be acting mature and ignoring trolls. This is just how I feel, you all are free to disagree, but I personally think we need to go back to being a positive fanbase instead of turning into one of those where we fight others.

 

[viras]

I have hope for banjo for sure. Has a legacy, was one of the most popular franchises on the n64 and is demanded by fans, Phil Spencer giving the okay for them doesn't mean everything but it makes it more plausible. Tbh i sort of doubt he will be i. But i have high hopes nonetheless.

 

[Mr. Stagg]

Monster Hunter had already sold 28 million units by March of 2014 (it's at 53 as of 2018). While Mega Man had more at that point (by about 2 or 3 million), it was a dormant IP, and one that had been around a hell of a lot longer than MH. It had absolutely taken off in a massive way.

Remember, it was seen as a massive oversight by Capcom fans that Monster Hunter was not included in Marvel vs. Capcom 3 which was out in 2011 (the MH team rejected Niitsuma's request to use it).

And no, Simon was chosen because fans wanted him more than Alucard according to Sakurai:
https://twitter.com/AllSourceGaming/status/1074584068291944448

If anything I hope the list provided by Nintendo helps to quash Sakurai Bias. This shows how this iteration of smash is more fan focused.

 

[BravadoMan_13]

Minecraft may have shaped a generation, but Banjo-Kazooie did as well for the previous one. Ask any gamer from the 90's and they'll tell you how Banjo-kazooie was at least known and fondly remembered.

I know. I was in elementary school when I first encountered Banjo in Diddy Kong Racing. Banjo-Kazooie & Banjo-Tooie still resonate with me 20 years later. That's why a lot of us 90's kids will always be attached to those two. I know there's some fans in the younger generation out there.

 

[EricTheGamerman]

Monster Hunter had already sold 28 million units by March of 2014 (it's at 53 as of 2018). While Mega Man had more at that point (by about 2 or 3 million), it was a dormant IP, and one that had been around a hell of a lot longer than MH. It had absolutely taken off in a massive way.

Remember, it was seen as a massive oversight by Capcom fans that Monster Hunter was not included in Marvel vs. Capcom 3 which was out in 2011 (the MH team rejected Niitsuma's request to use it).

And no, Simon was chosen because fans wanted him more than Alucard according to Sakurai:
https://twitter.com/AllSourceGaming/status/1074584068291944448

To be fair, a Monster Hunter missing in Marvel vs Capcom is a significantly bigger deal than not being included in Smash. Capcom has already done a really good job representing their characters in that series, so one missing makes a much bigger difference. Monster Hunter also hadn’t had the western breakthrough properly yet. Enough to be localized regularly, but not World’s runaway success story. Capcom was also going to always ride on Mega Man as a nostalgia factor even if they didn’t really put him in much. Plus, Mega Man 9 and 10 were kind of big deals just a couple years earlier (project plan would have been early 2012-ish. I don’t think Mega Man was nearly as dead as we make him out to be (though by actual release that had only worsened).

And I knew he was selected in part due to fan demand, but I went back and checked and in the DidYouKnowGaming video for Ultimate, it’s mentioned that he also chose Simon and Richter for whips and their iconic nature to Castlevania, so that also shows an additional consideration beyond just fan demand that I was initially thinking of when I made the post.

 

[GillyGrime]

CUPHEAAAAAD on Switch!!! That was nice of Microsoft wasn't it? "Our friend Microsoft"

 

[LogFrog]

CUPHEAAAAAD on Switch!!! That was nice of Microsoft wasn't it? "Our friend Microsoft"

I wonder if it’s a sign for things to come.

 

[GillyGrime]

I wonder if it’s a sign for things to come.

You'd have to be pretty cynical to see it as anything other than a good sign we are getting a Microsoft character. I also feel like Rare Replay has become increasingly likely. Hype cautiously gang.