Ask a Qusestion. Get an Answer.

[BakiThaG]

^ that
approaching isnt a good thing for falco, we do much better if the person approaches us

 

[Hawks go Caw]

If you're always getting shield grabbed, just approach with a grab yourself . . . .

 

[#HBC | ZoZo]

If you're always getting shield grabbed, just approach with a grab yourself . . . .

If you approach from the ground he can easily spotdodge you, which should also cover dash attack.

Also, there's a typo in the topic name.

 

[Jon?]

Assuming we get shield grabbed 100% of the time we approach, how do we kill?

If you are are getting shield grabbed a lot, run back and SHL/SHDL. Force them to approach you and it open up options.

 

[Tommy_G]

Yes baiting and punishing when others approach works well, but to be really good, you need to be able to mix up and approach when the time is right This includes using fake out approaches and check mate approach setups. A lot of people get that wrong for many reasons ( approach with the wrong attack, approach when opponent is baiting, approach from above when they should have approached from the floor)

My point by saying about the 100% shield grab is that no one is right 100% of the time. Approaching does work, as long as you don't rush into it.

Btw, there is no typo in the topic name.

 

[Blad01]

If you are are getting shield grabbed a lot, run back and SHL/SHDL. Force them to approach you and it open up options.

In theory, if they are at 130%, they shouldn't approach at all, even if you make their % rise to 300%

 

[#HBC | ZoZo]

In theory, if they are at 130%, they shouldn't approach at all, even if you make their % rise to 300%

If they dont approach at all you can just rise them to 999% with lasers and kill it with a jab

 

[Juno McGrath]

im having a lot of trouble short hopping dub lasering. i can do it. i just cant do it whilst moving forward or backward like everyone else does.

i always phantasm. ...frustration.

 

[Zesty_Chicken]

If you're having trouble with the SHDL, I suggest going to training mode and practicing it on lower speeds. Once you get the hang of it on one speed (let's say 1/2), go the the next speed level(2/3) and keep practicing until you get to normal speed (1).

Otherwise, just try not to hold forward when you shorthop. That's probably the cause of your problem.

 

[#HBC | ZoZo]

If you're having trouble with the SHDL, I suggest going to training mode and practicing it on lower speeds. Once you get the hang of it on one speed (let's say 1/2), go the the next speed level(2/3) and keep practicing until you get to normal speed (1).

Otherwise, just try not to hold forward when you shorthop. That's probably the cause of your problem.

This works with things like boost smash, but not with shdl.

Slower speed may *** up the input and it's all about getting the timing right, you can't practice the timing on lower speed

 

[victoriouS]

Hey guys, me again

And a few more questions, although thanks to the help earlier on fox I just won a tournament.

Q1: What are eays ways to get people in laser locks?

Q2: I need some good combos with the UTILT and DTILT, I come from playing mario and pikachu , and I use those alot and I can't find any good ones for falco

Q3: Stage counter-picks vs fox?

Q4: Some neat uses for falcos shine? (down b)

Q4: Finally, besides spiking, down-smashing, forward-smashing, and back airs, is there any other decent way to kill somone besides those?

If someone helps that would be great!

 

[Jon?]

Hey guys, me again

And a few more questions, although thanks to the help earlier on fox I just won a tournament.

Q1: What are eays ways to get people in laser locks?

Q2: I need some good combos with the UTILT and DTILT, I come from playing mario and pikachu , and I use those alot and I can't find any good ones for falco

Q3: Stage counter-picks vs fox?

Q4: Some neat uses for falcos shine? (down b)

Q4: Finally, besides spiking, down-smashing, forward-smashing, and back airs, is there any other decent way to kill somone besides those?

If someone helps that would be great!

Q1: There is a very descriptive thread about the ways to laser lock, but he ways I know are: 1) get up ledge attack to laser lock, 2) d-throw, jab to laser lock (% specific), 3) fast fall Nair to laser lock

Q2: For a combo to lead to an Utilt is fast fall Nair to Utilt. For Dtilt, you can do jab-cancel to Dtilt.

Q3: I don't have much experience in the Falco/Fox matchup. If it were me, I'd just chose Final D or a stage with a high ceiling like Japes

Q4: Uair is good way to kill people. Other than that, you listed all the ways to kill with Falco.

 

[#HBC | ZoZo]

Q1: What are eays ways to get people in laser locks?
On some stages you can actually get a guarenteed laserlock, and on some characters too. From my head theres the footstool > platform cancel > silent laser > laserlock on some stages, theres utilt out of CG on luigis mansion, theres ftilt, firebird, ledge attack <100%, phantasm, splat laserlock.

Q2: I need some good combos with the UTILT and DTILT, I come from playing mario and pikachu , and I use those alot and I can't find any good ones for falco
Dtilt to jab cancel to Dtilt to jab to grab etc.
Utilt is a good setup for aerial combat as it has nice priority and great speed, but only combos into itself on lower percentages.

Q3: Stage counter-picks vs fox?
JJ, and any stage where getting grabs is reasonably easy to edgeguard him after spike.
Look at Fox's weaknesses and then exploit those by counterpicking an adequate stage (i.e. fox mainly kills upwards, cp high ceiling (JJ))

Q4: Some neat uses for falcos shine? (down b)
Falcos shine is usefull for reflecting things

Q4: Finally, besides spiking, down-smashing, forward-smashing, and back airs, is there any other decent way to kill somone besides those?
Usmashing, Uair.

 

[Hawks go Caw]

1. Easiest way to laser lock is probably just Ftilt at around 70%-85%.

2. I never use Dtilt. Not that good. I use Utilt a lot, but not really for combos. If I whiff an aerial and my opponent is above me is usually when I pull it out.

3. Uhhh . . . FD? Your lasers are better than his.

4. Not much. Goes through walls.

5. I personally find Usmash, Dair, Bair, then Fsmash to be the most reliable in that order.

 

[Elyssa Xey Hexen]

Hey guys, me again

And a few more questions, although thanks to the help earlier on fox I just won a tournament.

Q1: What are eays ways to get people in laser locks?

Q2: I need some good combos with the UTILT and DTILT, I come from playing mario and pikachu , and I use those alot and I can't find any good ones for falco

Q3: Stage counter-picks vs fox?

Q4: Some neat uses for falcos shine? (down b)

Q4: Finally, besides spiking, down-smashing, forward-smashing, and back airs, is there any other decent way to kill somone besides those?

If someone helps that would be great!

1) In my opinion there is no easy way to LL anyone . But listen to what the other 3 said on the subject.

There are a few combo induced ones with pictochat on DDD and TL (CG to the edge, but finish on a boost pivot grab, dthrow at ~45% and LL away; MK on luigi's mansion. (Dthrow > footstool at about ~30%?). Also, DDD has a good combo that sets-up strongly for a LL, {CG till ~43% > FH Dair DDDs landing > FF a laser > LL away}

2) Get out of the habit of dtilting when using falco. It sets up, but there are no guranteed combos and it's pretty situational. Ftilt is just always better than dtilt. Puts more pressure on the person.

I use uptilt a lot actually. I'm not sure why, I guess I just know the timing for it. But the one I notice I am using a lot is a SH Dair > FF > Uptilt. I find it a good attack chain. SH dair approaches are relatively safe. I find if you hit with the spike of the Dair below 0%-70% then FF uptilt has pretty good chance of hitting the person before they recover as it hits on boths sides of falco on frames 4 and 12 (If the SH approach doesn't hit you don't have to follow up with the FF). So even if they get behind you when you FF, the attack will still it. Also, uptilt set-ups for some good options then. SH/FH Bair or Nair. Maybe another uptilt if it's a fast faller. You can even try to shield and if they try to attack you by coming down you can possibly grab them or hit OoS. And even i

3) Not really sure any stage counter picks for fox. Fox and Falco do pretty much the same on any stage it seems. FD/JJ I think would be the best stage. No platforms for Fox to be on in FD, and I think fox does better than falco with platforms. On JJ we make better use of the stage than he does. Even though he can semi-simulate the stuff we can do with phantasm.

4) For the shine.. There really isn't much. SH reflector can give good spacing against people with projectiles. Diddy is a good example. If you are facing a Diddy with a banana they some times will fake a glide toss and run after you trying to punish the reflector, but if you SH reflector and move backwards in the SH then Diddy has to cover more ground. If you do reflect the banana at him, then all the same.

5) You are forgetting Upsmash as a killing move. It's one of Falco's most reliable. A DACUS (or Boost Smash) is an excellent way to catch people off guard and get a KO. Plus, due to hitting on frame 7, you can reliably link a laser into an upsmash. But becareful to not over use it when trying to kill someone when they are in percent range, they will expect you to always dash at them and then upsmash and then punish. It's better to play falco with tilts, jabs, lasers, and all the other stuff and go for the kill when you think you can safely get one. I've lost too many matches when I got TOO focused on the kill.

Edit: I think victorious's questions have been 90% answered to completion with 4 people now. Anyone else got anything to add xP

 

[Juno McGrath]

thank you. one more question from a new falco main. how exactly do you boost pivot grab?

also, how do you do a silent laser?

 

[Elyssa Xey Hexen]

Silent laser is all about timing. And pros have hard times getting it all the time. The ultimate goal is to hit kirby when kirby is standing. You achieve that, your lasers are pretty good. Silent laser is all the better though. Sort of the Perfect out of great situations.

Boost Pivot Grab is done like this Dash > Back > Down C-stick > Grab Button. It can be down without C-stick like using the A button, but down on the c-stick is better. It elimnates the chance you might do a studder steped fsmash by mistake.

 

[Juno McGrath]

ah. i see now. thanks.

 

[Tommy_G]

Silent laser is all about timing. And pros have hard times getting it all the time. The ultimate goal is to hit kirby when kirby is standing. You achieve that, your lasers are pretty good. Silent laser is all the better though. Sort of the Perfect out of great situations.

Boost Pivot Grab is done like this Dash > Back > Down C-stick > Grab Button. It can be down without C-stick like using the A button, but down on the c-stick is better. It elimnates the chance you might do a studder steped fsmash by mistake.

Not to discredit your knowledge, but I thought the full slide pivot boost grab was dash-> C stick down-> back-> grab.

You can slide pivot grab without the dash attack but it doesnt slide as far as if you do it by canceling the dash attack with the turnaround(pivot), as in you don't even see the dash attack but from the slide you'll know if you did it right.

Do you get the same result by doing run->back->grab but without holding back(back must be let go before the grab)?

 

[Elyssa Xey Hexen]

Not to discredit your knowledge, but I thought the full slide pivot boost grab was dash-> C stick down-> back-> grab.

You can slide pivot grab without the dash attack but it doesnt slide as far as if you do it by canceling the dash attack with the turnaround(pivot), as in you don't even see the dash attack but from the slide you'll know if you did it right.

Do you get the same result by doing run->back->grab but without holding back(back must be let go before the grab)?

It's been awhile since I told anyone about the Boost Pivot Grab inputs, so I might have gotten the order mixed up a bit. Although, now that I think about it, this would throughly explain why I have been doing a pivoted Dsmashed recently xD I'll have to check that next time I get the chance.

And Dash > Back > Grab. That sounds like a normal input for a pivot grab.

 

[Jon?]

I remember doing the other method for boost pivot grab.
It's: Dash > Back, Shield Grab. The boost isn't as far, but it still works and the timing isn't as easy to pull off.

 

[Juno McGrath]

can you shine lucas and ness when they are thundering towards you to stop them?

 

[Jon?]

can you shine lucas and ness when they are thundering towards you to stop them?

No, they are immune to the reflector while in their pk thunder recovery.

 

[Tommy_G]

It's been awhile since I told anyone about the Boost Pivot Grab inputs, so I might have gotten the order mixed up a bit. Although, now that I think about it, this would throughly explain why I have been doing a pivoted Dsmashed recently xD I'll have to check that next time I get the chance.

And Dash > Back > Grab. That sounds like a normal input for a pivot grab.

Well there's a difference between dash> back> grab and dash> back> grab after you let go of back. One of them does a pseudo boost pivot grab but doesn't go the full distance and the other does a stopping pivot grab.

 

[Corrupted]

dash grab or sheild cancel grab?

 

[#HBC | ZoZo]

Hey guys.

Just 2 questions, and quick ones.

What is the timing on chaingrabbing GW and TL? I know it's the running, but it seems like theres a different timing wether they DI away or towards you.
Normally I have no problems chaingrabbing, I can CG Snake a good amount before he can pull a nade etcetera.

Tips or anything is appreciated

 

[superglucose]

Hey guys.

Just 2 questions, and quick ones.

What is the timing on chaingrabbing GW and TL? I know it's the running, but it seems like theres a different timing wether they DI away or towards you.
Normally I have no problems chaingrabbing, I can CG Snake a good amount before he can pull a nade etcetera.

Tips or anything is appreciated

I don't think we get full on TL or GW.

Edit:

Any tips versus ROB? That matchup is annoying as hell.

 

[#HBC | ZoZo]

I don't think we get full on TL or GW.

Edit:

Any tips versus ROB? That matchup is annoying as hell.

In Blads chaingrab thread it says we get a full one on TL and one till 36% on GW.

 

[Jon?]

The CG on TL and G&W is kinda weird sometimes. They can get out after the third grab and sometimes you can pull off the full CG.

The matchup against rob is annoying indeed. Just out camp him with lasers and reflect his gyro and laser.

 

[#HBC | ZoZo]

The CG on TL and G&W is kinda weird sometimes. They can get out after the third grab and sometimes you can pull off the full CG.

It's not a RNG thing, there has to be a cause

 

[Jon?]

It's not a RNG thing, there has to be a cause

I know, the G&W or TL player DI's a certain direction. I don't know which direction they DI.

 

[Hawks go Caw]

It's a walking CG.

 

[#HBC | ZoZo]

I know, the G&W or TL player DI's a certain direction. I don't know which direction they DI.

DI dependent? Mhm, thats weird, never heard that.

 

[Loops]

When is it the right time to use the boost pivot grab?
I try it but i can't find a good time to ever use it, and when i do i get punished. eh?
Lastly, what do i follow up after my lasers hit. I can never kill well but my overall game is good and i mastered lasers now.

 

[Emperor Time]

I usually use the BPG to grab my opponent when he's landing or get some distance from my opponent.
The reach is really deceptive, so I find it pretty useful.

Laser followups depend on how far you are from your opponent.
You can laser>DACUS,laser>Jab,laser>grab, etc.

Just try to apply these things to your game and stuff will come naturally.

 

[Jon?]

When is it the right time to use the boost pivot grab?
I try it but i can't find a good time to ever use it, and when i do i get punished. eh?
Lastly, what do i follow up after my lasers hit. I can never kill well but my overall game is good and i mastered lasers now.

Trying to incorporate Boost Pivot Grabbing into your gameplay is more about flashiness. But a good time I use it is to switch directions during a normal CG to get more damage racked up. Another way to use it is, SHL to Boost Pivot Grab and usually catches them off guard.

Good follow ups for a laser are:
-dash attack / DACUS
-Usmash / Boost Smash (Kill move)
-run in for grab / boost pivot grab
-dsmash or utilt (if you land close)
-dair (sets up for good tech chasing)

 

[Hawks go Caw]

I have a question.

Where have Denzi/Japu/Pure Awesome/Ozz/Vlade been? You guys better have found something super sexy for having not posted in days.

 

[#HBC | ZoZo]

It's a walking CG.

Toon Link
Walking Chaingrab : ?
Running Chaingrab : 0-45 % (5 times)

Mr. Game & Watch
Walking Chaingrab : ?
Running Chaingrab : 0-45 % (5 times)
Counters : Up B (36%) ?


If this information is false I'd love the chaingrab breakdown thread to be updated

 

[Teran]

I have a question.

Where have Denzi/Japu/Pure Awesome/Ozz/Vlade been? You guys better have found something super sexy for having not posted in days.

They're all dead.

You'll have to make do with me.

Oh wait, I'm not posting either. =D

 

[Vlade]

Lol I'm just super busy these days with exams and **** coming up all the time.