Are Young Link and Dr. Mario kinda like Melee Link & Mario?

[Door Key Pig]

I remember RelaxAlax suggesting Smash 5 have both "new" and "old" versions of Mario and Link, keeping around some "old" (Melee era or preceding Smash 5) versions of the characters to make veterans happy or something. And seeing as Ultimate has both of their Melee clones alongside varying-levels-of-updated Mario and Link, does this statement ring true in having YL and Dr. kinda like Melee Link and Mario in playstyle? At the very least Dr. has Mario's older down special and YL of course has the older Link bombing move.

 

[mbvswb]

yes but unfortunately Mario is more Sunshine Mario than Oddysey Mario. I'll never get why they went and stuck with flood over a galaxy based moveset or anything else

 

[lucasla]

yes but unfortunately Mario is more Sunshine Mario than Oddysey Mario. I'll never get why they went and stuck with flood over a galaxy based moveset or anything else

Yeah... they could easily change the FLUDD of Mario Sunshine to a throw of the hat that could have a similar effect of push enemies back, updating Mario's moves and references to a more recent game. At least would feel a bit more refreshing.

 

[Quillion]

If that's the case then they're not good enough. FLUDD ruined Mario for me, and the BotW changes are ruining Link for me.

God, what is it with them changing perfectly good moves and animations?

 

[Mogisthelioma]

They're clones, so I really don't see them any differently.

 

[osby]

yes but unfortunately Mario is more Sunshine Mario than Oddysey Mario. I'll never get why they went and stuck with flood over a galaxy based moveset or anything else

Wasn't Super Mario Galaxy like ten years ago? What sense does it making Mario's moveset completely inspired from that game? Plus, I don't remember Mario having Cappy in Sunshine.

 

[Wyoming]

If that's the case then they're not good enough. FLUDD ruined Mario for me, and the BotW changes are ruining Link for me.

God, what is it with them changing perfectly good moves and animations?

Veterans need to freshen up too, y'know.

If they were always the same people would get bored of them. Some changes weren't beneficial while others were, but it's a part of game design.

 

[Mogisthelioma]

Wasn't Super Mario Galaxy like ten years ago? What sense does it making Mario's moveset completely inspired from that game? Plus, I don't remember Mario having Cappy in Sunshine.

So? We've had Sunshine Mario since Melee, I think we'd all like something else.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

Veterans need to freshen up too, y'know.

If they were always the same people would get bored of them. Some changes weren't beneficial while others were, but it's a part of game design.

Unfortunately, movesets typically aren't changed much to not alienate people that are used to them.

Hell, it's a wonder finally got the Poltergust as a grab after 17 years.

 

[Quillion]

Veterans need to freshen up too, y'know.

If they were always the same people would get bored of them. Some changes weren't beneficial while others were, but it's a part of game design.

Do YOU want Mario to use his hammer and Zelda to use her Light Bow?

No, you don't. Changing moves only manages to piss people off.

 

[osby]

Do YOU want Mario to use his hammer and Zelda to use her Light Bow?

No, you don't. Changing moves only manages to piss people off.

Yeah, changing Pit, Bowser and Sheik's side specials pissed off so many people.

 

[MrSmashFour]

Wasn't Super Mario Galaxy like ten years ago? What sense does it making Mario's moveset completely inspired from that game? Plus, I don't remember Mario having Cappy in Sunshine.

And I don't remember Mario having FLUDD in Odyssey.

Your point?

 

[Wyoming]

Do YOU want Mario to use his hammer and Zelda to use her Light Bow?

No, you don't. Changing moves only manages to piss people off.

Zelda using a Light Bow, eh?

Interesting...

 

[osby]

And I don't remember Mario having FLUDD in Odyssey.

It seems we both have exceptionally good memories.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

Okay, am I the only one in this thread who recalls that FLUDD got in Smash via Brawl? And didn't mix up Mario's gimmicks with the wrong games?



That being said, Odyssey came out too late to have Mario use Cappy in Smash, so maybe next time. At least we got Wedding Mario out of this.

 

[meleebrawler]

Mario's not getting Galaxy stuff because Rosalina has all of that game covered. And all he got in that game was a boring spin that he does in many other games.

 

[Quillion]

Zelda using a Light Bow, eh?

Interesting...

It's still a dumb idea. How would that fit into Zelda's slow grace?

 

[Sabertooth]

She would slowly and gracefully fire a light arrow.

 

[1FC0]

So? We've had Sunshine Mario since Melee, I think we'd all like something else.

Actually we only had him since SSBB. Anyway I like FLUDD and I hope that it stays. Mario Sunshine IMO was much better than Galaxy. I guess the Galaxy box is right about it's players.

 

[Grunky Peep]

If that's the case then they're not good enough. FLUDD ruined Mario for me, and the BotW changes are ruining Link for me.

God, what is it with them changing perfectly good moves and animations?

How dare they make Link a better character.

 

[1FC0]

I dislike the new Link as well but at least we get Young Link which makes up for it.

 

[NintendoKnight]

It's still a dumb idea. How would that fit into Zelda's slow grace?

She would slowly and gracefully fire a light arrow.

For example:

Yeah, this isn't freaking difficult.

Zelda has been poorly designed in every Smash Bros until Ultimate, so this slow grace has been terrible for her since the very beginning.

Also fun fact, Zelda has ACTUALLY USED light arrows in her own games. Tell me where she learned Farore's Wind, Nayru's Love, and Din's Fire in Ocarina of Time.

 

[Syntherios]

yes but unfortunately Mario is more Sunshine Mario than Oddysey Mario. I'll never get why they went and stuck with flood over a galaxy based moveset or anything else

Because Sunshine was the better game.

 

[Mogisthelioma]

Actually we only had him since SSBB. Anyway I like FLUDD and I hope that it stays. Mario Sunshine IMO was much better than Galaxy. I guess the Galaxy box is right about it's players.

I just want Mario's spin attack from Galaxy to be his nair....

 

[Sudz]

Dr Mario has been Dr Mario since Melee, and has always played quite a bit different than Mario imo, so I'm going to go with a soft no considering he's even more differentiated in Ultimate

 

[ZephyrZ]

Do YOU want Mario to use his hammer and Zelda to use her Light Bow?

No, you don't. Changing moves only manages to piss people off.

Speak for yourself, I'm personally hyped for Link's new remote bombs.

 

[Quillion]

How dare they make Link a better character.

What makes you think they couldn't just ordinarily buff the classic moveset instead of changing it into the thing it is now?

 

[Grunky Peep]

What makes you think they couldn't just ordinarily buff the classic moveset instead of changing it into the thing it is now?

I mained Link in Smash 4 for the longest time. These changes are good for him. If you miss the old Link then you can still play as Young Link, who I hear has also been buffed a lot and is probably better then the other Links. But I do agree that the FLUDD should be replaced with something that represents Mario as he is today.

 

[Quillion]

I mained Link in Smash 4 for the longest time. These changes are good for him. If you miss the old Link then you can still play as Young Link, who I hear has also been buffed a lot and is probably better then the other Links. But I do agree that the FLUDD should be replaced with something that represents Mario as he is today.

Young Link is too light and weak for me to be my Link, though. Nothing less than OoT/TP Link being their own character with the old moveset will satisfy me.

 

[meleebrawler]

Young Link is too light and weak for me to be my Link, though. Nothing less than OoT/TP Link being their own character with the old moveset will satisfy me.

Just play the old games if you're so allergic to change. Would this be a problem had Link used remote bombs from the beginning?

 

[NintendoKnight]

Young Link is too light and weak for me to be my Link, though. Nothing less than OoT/TP Link being their own character with the old moveset will satisfy me.

Then dissatisfied you shall remain.

This isn't Burger King, you can't always have it your way.

 

[Big-Cat]

If that's the case then they're not good enough. FLUDD ruined Mario for me, and the BotW changes are ruining Link for me.

God, what is it with them changing perfectly good moves and animations?

Link has consistently been low if not bottom tier depending on the game. If anyone needed a rework, it was Link (and Zelda).

 

[Sabertooth]

Young Link is a great compromise for those who want to use Link's old moveset. It's a brilliant game design choice that should satisfy everyone, really, and one I wish they'd take with other characters. Alph could have Olimar's Brawl moveset for example, and you could pretty much do the same for anyone whose moveset has changed over the years as long as they have a suitable Echo fighter in the wings.

 

[osby]

Young Link is a great compromise for those who want to use Link's old moveset. It's a brilliant game design choice that should satisfy everyone, really, and one I wish they'd take with other characters. Alph could have Olimar's Brawl moveset for example, and you could pretty much do the same for anyone whose moveset has changed over the years as long as they have a suitable Echo fighter in the wings.

Olimar's Brawl moveset was pretty much just a different up special and more Pikmin. More Pikmin is obviously out of question (since he was pretty broken and it might create issues with 8 player Smash in handheld mode) and Pikmin chain is nigh-useless with just three Pikmin.

 

[SmashShadow]

Yeah, changing Pit, Bowser and Sheik's side specials pissed off so many people.

To be fair, I don't think anybody really liked those moves much to begin with.

 

[osby]

To be fair, I don't think anybody really liked those moves much to begin with.

Yeah, but it was a response to this: "Changing moves only manages to piss people off." (emphasis is mine)

Changing moves can be a good thing, but it should be done with caution, like how Phantom Slash was initially a pretty useless move.

 

[SmashShadow]

Yeah, but it was a response to this: "Changing moves only manages to piss people off." (emphasis is mine)

Changing moves can be a good thing, but it should be done with caution, like how Phantom Slash was initially a pretty useless move.

Oh I get that. If say Mewtwo's shadow ball was removed I would be livid but I would have no problem with say DK's side B being changed. Certain moves just have a sort of iconic nature to them with their character.

 

[1FC0]

I just want Mario's spin attack from Galaxy to be his nair....

I think that Galaxy is not represented in Mario's moveset because it already got a whole character to represent it. Sunshine only got one move. This means that Galaxy has much more representation than Sunshine in Smash already. I wuld like it better if they used all of Mario's moves to represent the important parts of his history that would otherwise go without representation in the roster instead of dedicating them to the part of his history which already has a complete character devoted to it.

 

[meleebrawler]

Link has consistently been low if not bottom tier depending on the game. If anyone needed a rework, it was Link (and Zelda).

The writing was on the wall since Brawl: Toon Link has always been much better than Link thanks to his greater mobility making converting off of his projectiles much easier. You need speed to pull Link's old gameplan off well. Conversely, being a slow, heavy hitter works better when you have stuff that limits options like a remote-detonated bomb with a big blast.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

I think that Galaxy is not represented in Mario's moveset because it already got a whole character to represent it. Sunshine only got one move. This means that Galaxy has much more representation than Sunshine in Smash already. I wuld like it better if they used all of Mario's moves to represent the important parts of his history that would otherwise go without representation in the roster instead of dedicating them to the part of his history which already has a complete character devoted to it.

Still beats Wario, who only has a handful of normal moves from Wario Land/World and only one actual non-FS special move that directly references Wario Ware.

And yet I don't mind it anyway.