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AGT Downwards to save on Boosts?

ECHOnce

Smash Lord
Joined
Feb 22, 2014
Messages
1,191
Location
Bellevue, WA
It's fun to go deep for kills with ROB, but if we mess an edgeguard up or overextend, we're dead.

I suck at AGT so I haven't experimented with this much myself, but I've been wondering why I never see ROBs AGT downwards to save on a boost. It's obviously situational (high/low recovery, etc.) but most edgeguards are.

The following are all just theory follow-up flowcharts:

If the opponent is recovering straight up:
> AGT down, Gyro thrown down.
> > Read DI.
> > > Boost up to grab ledge.
> > > Jump/boost Dair
> > > Dair
> > > Bair into stage (if walled).
If the opponent is recovering diagonally up (45ish degrees):
> AGT down, Gyro thrown forward.
> > Read DI.
> > > [Jump and] Boost up Fair/Dair/laser (jump before boosting if they're further up)
> > > [Jump and] Turnaround boost up Bair/Uair
If the opponent is recovering horizontally:
> AGT up (still above stage), Gyro thrown forward.
> > Read DI.
> > > Boost forward.
> > > > Wavebounce laser
> > > > > Double jump forwards (don't get caught under non-walled stages), then boost up
> > > > Boost back to ledge (mixup)
> > > > > Haxdash to refresh recovery tools (if you have time)
> > > > Fair/Uair/Bair
If the opponent is recovering from in front+above you:
> AGT up (still above stage), Gyro thrown up (forces a lower recovery closer to stage level).
> > Boost forwards
> > > [Jump and] Boost up Uair/Fair
> > > [Jump and] Turnaround boost up Uair/Bair
> > > > Boost back to ledge
> > > > > Haxdash to refresh
> > > > > Waveland on stage, observe reaction to gyro zoning (punish?)
> > > B-reverse Gyro cancel
> > > > Jump/boost up to grab ledge
> > > > > Haxdash to refresh
> > > > > Waveland on stage, observe reaction to gyro
> > > > Jump/boost up, purposely missing sweetspot (if they're close)
> > > > > Wait for Gyro to hit or for them to Air Dodge/avoid it
> > > > > > Boost up Bair/Uair
Another edgeguard that sorta follows a similar flowchart that I use (and haven't seen on streams before) as a mixup to the usual forward boost falling Dair, or forward boost falling Fair into jump Fair, is Boost Nair downwards into turnaround boost+jump Bair/Uair. Haven't really tried out the theory flowcharted ones, but I know this one works for sure (and just based the others around it).

Off the top of my head, quick benefits it may offer over Boost forward+down into Fair/Dair could be (1) your hurtbox isn't hurtling towards them, (2) if they DI away they're probably dead, (3) but if they DI in or up you can still react with one of the above flowchart options, and (4) where normally you'd have to use two recovery tools to Boost Fair and Jump Fair to confirm the kill on hit, you'd only have to use one here. Could this work well as a mixup at least?
 
Last edited:

Sneez

Smash Apprentice
Joined
May 11, 2014
Messages
105
not sure what you're getting at with agt downwards saving boosts, you don't have to boost to fall down. and agt down on vertical recoveries is probably gonna get you stage spiked, better to just throw the top down or agt up while throwing down. maybe try making a video to express your ideas better. if you can't get it to work on a cpu its probably not gonna work on a real person. also, boost nair on opponents offstage used to be good against floatier chars at high percents cuz it could kill off the top, now in most situations you're just gonna help them survive and not be able to follow up.
 
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