Official 4BR Tier List v1.0 - Competitive Impressions

[Appledees]

To be honest I still haven't seen any real evidence to really think that Megaman actually beats Diddy. At worst it would be like 45:55 with Mega winning but Diddy just has too many options where I find it hard to believe that Diddy actually loses.

 

[bc1910]

Meta Knight cannot ladder Mewtwo and kill him on Final Destination or Battlefield with DI without rage. It might be possible on Town & City, or maybe with Battlefield platform assists.

Also, Greninja will die to a fall off neutral air if he fails to tech, or Meta Knight can fish for the 2F on Hydro Pump with forward smash with no risk. If Greninja opts to go over it, Greninja is eating a punish. What other options does he have? Shadow Sneak? If Greninja is ever below the stage line, even with his double jump, he's in trouble.

In that case I would think M2 beats Meta Knight, possibly depending on the stage.

Surely MK can fish for the 2F on any up B, with no risk? Fsmash is disjointed after all, so he doesn't care about hitboxes. And you're talking about a move with 1 active frame. 2F punishes aren't consistent at the best of times, so good luck hitting it with that. Stage spike Nair is not a consistent option either, again this would kill any character even if MK trades and you should be teching it.

MK isn't fast enough to catch Greninja if he Hydro Pumps over him completely horizontally unless he predicts it. That's true for pretty much everyone except Sonic. Greninja's other recovery options include Hydro Pumping horizontally to the ledge (hard to cover without reading it) and simply drifting back to a point where his huge double jump will let him grab the ledge, covering himself with Uair if necessary. Shadow Sneak is a useful mixup if MK goes offstage.

 

[Ulevo]

In that case I would think M2 beats Meta Knight, possibly depending on the stage.

Surely MK can fish for the 2F on any up B, with no risk? Fsmash is disjointed after all, so he doesn't care about hitboxes. And you're talking about a move with 1 active frame. 2F punishes aren't consistent at the best of times, so good luck hitting it with that. Stage spike Nair is not a consistent option either, again this would kill any character even if MK trades and you should be teching it.

Meta Knight cannot fish for the 2F on any up special because not all up specials are vulnerable on the 2F. It is depending on hurtbox size, and of course whether or not the enemy up special has a hitbox. You cannot 2F Sheik for instance because she is too low. You cannot 2F Peach because the Parasol is disjointed and will hit you through the stage. The fact remains that Meta Knight loses nothing for doing this, and can be done semi-consistently with a really high reward. And again, you cannot challenge any up special you want with neutral air either because some up specials have varying levels of priority. Trying it against Greninja is worth it, trying it against Bayonetta is not.

MK isn't fast enough to catch Greninja if he Hydro Pumps over him completely horizontally unless he predicts it.

I guarantee you Meta Knight can punish Greninja if he is below the stage line and decides to go over him. Forward smash has next to no cool down and Meta Knight's run speed is more than capable.

 

[FallofBrawl]

Luigi was the antimeta character during Diddy Kongs reign. Just because Luigi isn't that strong of a character overall doesn't mean he doesn't have the tools vs. a top tier automatically (same reason why people just put Zelda, Jiggs, Ganon in winning MUs when they haven't faced any because why not?)

Luigi slide when he slips on banana makes it hard for diddy to get a punish. Luigi's cqc also helps him get out of vortex situations diddy puts his opponents in with banana. Luigi crawl and upsmash both work well against Diddy's monkey flip. Both wreck each other hard offstage.

Luigi barely wins the MU imo. There are just barely any top level Luigis around. Hence why Diddy's running rampant.

 

[bc1910]

Meta Knight cannot fish for the 2F on any up special because not all up specials are vulnerable on the 2F. It is depending on hurtbox size, and of course whether or not the enemy up special has a hitbox. You cannot 2F Sheik for instance because she is too low. You cannot 2F Peach because the Parasol is disjointed and will hit you through the stage. The fact remains that Meta Knight loses nothing for doing this, and can be done semi-consistently with a really high reward. And again, you cannot challenge any up special you want with neutral air either because some up specials have varying levels of priority. Trying it against Greninja is worth it, trying it against Bayonetta is not.



I guarantee you Meta Knight can punish Greninja if he is below the stage line and decides to go over him. Forward smash has next to no cool down and Meta Knight's run speed is more than capable.

There are plenty of no-risk edgeguard options (Hydro Pump being one of them) that don't always work. It's like the Sonic Fsmash 2frame, where you have to be aware of it but it's not gonna work every time, except this is even worse because Sonic's Fsmash has 3 active frames. Hell, Greninja can do it with Dsmash.

I don't think Greninja's recovery is insanely hard for MK to edgeguard but I don't see it being a MU-defining point. Especially since these edgeguard setups only work if Greninja doesn't opt to Hydro Pump straight to the ledge after getting hit offstage, or if he doesn't opt to recover high.

 

[juddy96]

GOML pools are out, here's some of the more interesting winners finals matches (imo)

DarkAura vs. PikaPika!
Mr. E vs. KingKong or c-lu
False ? vs. Stroumbert
Blacktwins vs. Croi
Alphicans ? vs. JPeds
Poke vs. Nom
C3PO vs. 2ManyCooks
V115 vs. Tarex
Raziek vs. SpaceDong or Khal
Iceninja vs. Firefly

 

[zeldasmash]

Little Mac, 3 Marth's (!!!), Dr. Mario, Palutena, etc.

Interesting indeed.....

 

[Yikarur]

There is no way Diddy loses 0 matchups. He at the LEAST loses to Rosa, but there are multiple other matchups that both Diddy mains and players of those characters agree Diddy loses. Yikarur your opinion is running on bias and low evidence overall, which isn't exactly good to form competitive opinions...

You are basing your opinion on an outdated chart. Most recent reults are in favor of Diddy. How is that not an evidence?

Also Mr R and Void's results rival that of any Diddy player. Diddy has a better high/mid level presence because he's easy af to play but top level results indicate Sheik is better.

How is Diddy Kong easy to play? He is one of the more technical characters and you have to optimize a lot of things for him to be a threat. You have to know match-ups and you have to be a really good player to make the good plays with Diddy. If anything those "Diddy loses against so many characters" is indicative that the average Diddy player is just not good or that they have a biased opinion. MVD for example is still telling people that Diddy is like 18th in the tier list 8)

Yes I'm a little biased. I'm absolutely convinced that Diddy Kong is that good and I try to discuss with people about it. Diddy is imo Top3 for sure. If he is the best is hard to tell. Resultwise Bayonetta is clearly the winner.

 

[ShadowGuy1]

2 users in that, though both have secondaries. Still should be quite interesting, hope both make top 32(I can dream ok?)

 

[Jams.]

Something I've been wondering is how bunch Bayonetta's Witch Time nerf affected her in practice. I've seen lots of Bayonettas recently struggle to convert a kill or a large amount of damage off of a low or mid percent Witch Time, whereas I feel this was commonplace before. Is it just due to awkward positioning and people learning to (S)DI, or were the nerfs actually impactful?

GOML pools are out, here's some of the more interesting winners finals matches (imo)

DarkAura vs. PikaPika!
Mr. E vs. KingKong or c-lu
False ? vs. Stroumbert
Blacktwins vs. Croi
Alphicans ? vs. JPeds
Poke vs. Nom
C3PO vs. 2ManyCooks
V115 vs. Tarex
Raziek vs. SpaceDong or Khal
Iceninja vs. Firefly

I'm really curious how the different Canadian provinces stack up, since this will be the first time many of these scenes will interact with each other. Some of the provinces (MB, NB, NL, sort of NS and QC) got shafted with seeding though.

Hoping AB isn't fraudulent. =V

 

[juddy96]

Something I've been wondering is how bunch Bayonetta's Witch Time nerf affected her in practice. I've seen lots of Bayonettas recently struggle to convert a kill or a large amount of damage off of a low or mid percent Witch Time, whereas I feel this was commonplace before. Is it just due to awkward positioning and people learning to (S)DI, or were the nerfs actually impactful?



I'm really curious how the different Canadian provinces stack up, since this will be the first time many of these scenes will interact with each other. Some of the provinces (MB, NB, NL, sort of NS and QC) got shafted with seeding though.

Hoping AB isn't fraudulent. =V

GL beating Leo in your pool lol, I hope Canada does well.

 

[Djent]

If has evenish matchups against (and going by results I think he does), a advantage shouldn't come as much of a surprise. Though obviously it could still do with some more empirical support.

/ seem to have a slight edge results-wise, but they could also be even and my knowledge here might be outdated.

 

[Illuminose]

You are basing your opinion on an outdated chart. Most recent reults are in favor of Diddy. How is that not an evidence?

I'm not really basing my opinion on Zinoto's chart, mainly looked at his chart to see what his opinion is and confirm some ideas so I'm not just coming out of left field. There's no real 'most recent results' at play here. There is one tournament result that stands out as a massive anomaly given the huge amount of data refuting its implications, including two sets from one month earlier than the piece of data being used in which Dabuz dominated Zinoto (Dismantle 2) and Nietono (Genesis 3). The difference between 3 and 4 months ago is negligible.

I can also assure you with relative confidence that Diddy vs Olimar, Luigi, Mega Man, and Pikachu did not change significantly in the past two months (Zinoto posted his matchup chart in March). Results (outside Pikachu because again, virtually no sample size) tend to indicate slight disadvantages for Diddy Kong against all of these characters. If you look at results I could see Diddy vs Cloud being arguable, although I think Diddys in general still tend to believe that Cloud wins the matchup.

How is Diddy Kong easy to play? He is one of the more technical characters and you have to optimize a lot of things for him to be a threat. You have to know match-ups and you have to be a really good player to make the good plays with Diddy. If anything those "Diddy loses against so many characters" is indicative that the average Diddy player is just not good or that they have a biased opinion. MVD for example is still telling people that Diddy is like 18th in the tier list 8)

Diddy is one of the easiest top tiers to pick up, probably the easiest not named Mario or Cloud. I have, like, a pocket Diddy and I can do a lot of his standard tech without much practice. None of his tech is really that difficult and the character has a lot of really easy options to use, especially against players that aren't as good. This is because players who aren't as good tend to react poorly to banana pressure and lack the tact to deal with many of Diddy's basic options, especially forward air and down tilt. In general though -- Diddy is not a character that requires huge investment to succeed; you can accomplish a lot with fundamentals and decent item play because his kit is intuitive and most of his game isn't that complicated...space forward airs, get your grabs and punishes, use banana, pressure with dtilt...most of this is stuff you can do with raw fundamentals and a little bit of practice. You can push aspects of the character, but Diddy doesn't really need all that to be a good character.

---
Djent is also correct that Sonic has a general advantage over Diddy results-wise (both Zinoto and MVD think Diddy loses the matchup as well), and Fox probably has a slight advantage too by results.

 

[HoSmash4]

Diddy and Bayo are very similar in the regard that they both have really good mid-high level results but aren't as dominant at top level.

 

[C0rvus]

Once Zero recovers, that statistic should be a thing of the past. He always said Diddy was his favorite character to play, so let's see if he puts his monkey back in the spotlight. Not that he wouldn't do just as well with a continued focus on Sheik, but his Diddy is really strong. Now he has an environment where his Diddy could probably strive even as a solo main.

 

[Shady Shaymin]

Diddy is one of the easiest top tiers to pick up, probably the easiest not named Mario or Cloud. I have, like, a pocket Diddy and I can do a lot of his standard tech without much practice. None of his tech is really that difficult and the character has a lot of really easy options to use, especially against players that aren't as good. This is because players who aren't as good tend to react poorly to banana pressure and lack the tact to deal with many of Diddy's basic options, especially forward air and down tilt. In general though -- Diddy is not a character that requires huge investment to succeed; you can accomplish a lot with fundamentals and decent item play because his kit is intuitive and most of his game isn't that complicated...space forward airs, get your grabs and punishes, use banana, pressure with dtilt...most of this is stuff you can do with raw fundamentals and a little bit of practice. You can push aspects of the character, but Diddy doesn't really need all that to be a good character.

You just described like, 90 percent of the tourney viable characters in smash 4

 

[Jehtt]

Raziek vs. SpaceDong or Khal

Just a minor thing, but Khal is a solo Ryu main now. He dropped Bayo a little while ago.

 

[Das Koopa]

The more Bayos that get dropped, the stronger I become.

Cmon 9B go back to Ryu ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

Speaking of, I'm gonna be counting up all the results from this weekend. Bayonetta took up around 9% of all tops from March 15th-April 15th, but I suspect that number will go down a bit by the end of May. Maybe.

 

[wedl!!]

You just described like, 90 percent of the tourney viable characters in smash 4

Following the path of least resistance is just human nature.

This is nothing new.

 

[ZSaberLink]

There are 8 tournies I'm documenting this weekend. Here are the Top 16 results for each, compiled:


Battle Arena Melbourne 8 (May 13th-15th) (Australia) (260 Entrants) (Category 2)

Spoiler

1st: Mr. R
2nd: Abadango ,
3rd: 9B
4th: Umeki
5th: Waveguider ,
5th: Ghostbone , ,
7th: Jaice , , ,
7th: Jezmo
9th: Extra
9th: Earl
9th: Nikes
9th: MM
13th: Boozer
13th: Poppt1
13th: Elegant ,
13th: Duon

LEVEL UP EXPO (May 14th-15th) (Las Vegas) (172 Entrants) (Category 2)

Spoiler

1st: Nairo
2nd: VoiD
3rd: Larry Lurr
4th: Scatt ,
5th: Tyrant ,
5th: Saiki
7th: K9
7th: Falln
9th: FOW
9th: Xzax
9th: Z
9th: Doomlion
13th: Lycan
13th: Calculus
13th: JK
13th: Horse

TLOK 1K May (May 14th) (Dallas-Fort Worth) (136 Entrants) (Category 1)

Spoiler

1st: Cosmos
2nd: Aerolink
3rd: JaySon
4th: Johan
5th: Awestin
5th: Karna
7th: BC
7th: Sethlon
9th: P2P With Gibus
9th: YelloRello
9th: Dakpo ,
9th: Sassy
13th: Weegee
13th: Hakii ,
13th: BB SM Army
13th: iiGGy

Battle of BC (May 14th) (British Columbia) (133 Entrants) (Category 1)

Spoiler

1st: Anti , ,
2nd: Big D , ,
3rd: Len ,
4th: Locus
5th: Captain L
5th: Angis ,
7th: Masai
7th: Firefly
9th: Focus , ,
9th: Ty
9th: Choi
9th: Espeon CH
13th: Mono
13th: Lief
13th: BSM
13th: Cadence ,

Deluge (May 14th) (Midwest) (117 Entrants) (Category 1)

Spoiler

1st: Zinoto
2nd: Tyroy
3rd: Nite
4th: Ned
5th: JJROCKETS
5th: Ksev
7th: MVD
7th: Demitus .
9th: Komota
9th: H-Man
9th: Katakiri ,
9th: Dan
13th: Darkshad
13th: LCC JDB
13th: Yoshi Kirishima ,
13th: Shel

Gwinnett Brawl May (May 14th) (Georgia) (115 Entrants) (Category 1)

Spoiler

1st: TheReflexWonder ,
2nd: Fatality
3rd: LordMix
4th: Copycat
5th: Gadliel
5th: Limbs
7th: Loco
7th: OrcatheHuman
9th: FlaminRoy
9th: Hyper
9th: Neos
9th: P2W Doom Bot
13th: KDK
13th: Micaelis
13th: Wrath
13th: Newk

GoTE 4 the Kids 2016 (May 14th) (Florida) (94 Entrants) (Category 1)

Spoiler

1st: Prince Ramen
2nd: 8BitMan
3rd: JaK
4th: Prodigy
5th: Degree of Fear
5th: Cashmere
7th: Purple Guy
7th: Riot
9th: Rideae
9th: Ewok41
9th: EvilGoku
9th: Static Manny
13th: BlueBeast
13th: Kazu
13th: Wingey
13th: Poltergust

Smashadelphia (May 15th) (Philadelphia) (128 Entrants) (Category 1)

Spoiler

1st: James ,
2nd: LingLing
3rd: Apple
4th: BlazingPasta
5th: Hooded
5th: GWJ
7th: Seagull Joe
7th: 6WX
9th: Crowdingmovie
9th: C3PO
9th: Ninja
9th: BC Luck
13th: Daenerys
13th: Odon
13th: Ten
13th: Redeemer Z ,

Cannot assure 100% accuracy on FlaminRoy, EvilGoku, Dakpo, Hyper, or StaticManny.

-FlaminRoy used Sheik some a couple of months ago; This may be outdated.
-EvilGoku seems to use a lot of characters, but Youtube VODs indicate he primaries Ganondorf.
-Hyper seems to use Falcon. Can't totally be sure.
-Static Manny/All Might may have used Roy and not Sonic, but VODs indicate he's mostly stuck with Sonic in the last month.
-Dakpo uses ZSS but not in the Twitch VODs for the tourney in question, only Luigi.

Only included GoTE because it's juuuuust shy of my 96 minimum and includes several noteworthy players.

Bonus question: What were Gwinnett's custom rules? A 1111 Mii Brawler getting 5th at a tourney with a few of Florida's better players would be something noteworthy.

Thanks for compiling this! Loving the character variety here. 44 different characters in the top 16 of various tournaments this weekend!!!!

List of tournaments, abbreviations used, locations, # of entrants and notable players

Spoiler

BAM = Battle Arena Melbourne 8 (Australia) - 260 Entrants
Notable Players/Names:
Mr. R, Abadango, 9B, Umeki, Australia's finest (Waveguider, Ghostbone, Jaice, Jezmo)

BBC = Battle of British Columbia (British Columbia) - 133 Entrants
Notable Players/Names:
Anti, Big D, Captain L, Firefly, rest of BC's finest

DEL = Deluge (Midwest) - 117 entrants
Zinoto, Tyroy, MVD

GoTE = GoTE 4 the Kids 2016 (Florida) - 94 entrants
Notable Players/Names:
Prince Ramen, 8Bitman, StaticManny, Riot

GWIN = Gwinnett Brawl May (Georgia) - 115 entrants
Notable Players/Names:
TheReflexWonder, Fatality

LVL = Level Up Expo (Las Vegas) - 172 Entrants
Nairo, VoiD, Larry Lurr, Scatt, Tyrant, K9, Falln, FoW, Xzax

SMPA = Smashadelphia (Philadelphia) - 128 Entrants
Notable Players/Names:
LingLing, Seagull Joe, 6WX, C3PO

TLOK = TLOK 1K May (Dallas-Fort Worth) - 136 Entrants
Notable Players/Names:
Cosmos, Aerolink, Rest of Texas's finest

Compiled by character:
Diddy: 12
- Zinoto (DEL 1) - Solo
- Anti (BBC 1) - Secondary
- Abadango (BAM 2) - Secondary (mostly against Bayo)
- JaK (GoTE 3) - Solo
- Apple (SMPA 3) - Solo
- Prodigy (GoTE 4) - Solo
- JJRockets (DEL 5) - Solo
- MVD (DEL 7) - Solo
- Jezmo (BAM 7) - Solo
- C3PO (SMPA 9) - Solo
- Lycan (LVL 13) - Solo
- Cadence (BBC 13)

Bayonetta: 11
- Aerolink (TLOK 2) - Solo
- Tyroy (DEL 2) - Solo
- 9B (BAM 3) - Solo
- Ghostbone (BAM 5)
- GWJ (SMPA 5) - Solo
- Gadliel (GWIN 5) - Solo
- Riot (GoTE 7) - Solo
- Jaice (BAM 7) - Tertiary
- Calculus (LVL 13) - Solo
- JK (LVL 13) - Solo
- iiGGy (TLOK 13)

Sheik: 11
- Mr. R (BAM 1) - Solo
- VoiD (LVL 2) - Solo
- Len (BBC 3)
- Saiki (LVL 5) - Solo
- Karna (TLOK 5) - Solo
- Tyrant (LVL 5) - Secondary
- K9 (LVL 7)
- Focus (BBC 9)
- Choi (BBC 9) - Solo
- FlaminRoy (GWIN 9) - Solo?
- Elegant (BAM 13)

Fox: 9
- Larry Lurr (LVL 3) - Solo
- JaySon (TLOK 3) - Solo
- Ghostbone (BAM 5) - Tertiary
- Ksev (DEL 5) - Solo
- Xzax (LVL 9) - Solo
- Lief (BBC 13) - Solo
- Duon (BAM 13) - Solo
- Kazu (GoTE 13)
- Ten (SMPA 13)

Mario: 8
- Anti (BBC 1) - Secondary
- Big D (BBC 2) - Secondary
- Dan (DEL 9) - Solo
- Weegee (TLOK 13) - Solo
- CrowdingMovie (SMPA 9) - Solo
- Ninja (SMPA 9) - Solo
- LCC JDB (DEL 13) - Solo
- Redeemer Z (SMPA 13)

Cloud: 7
- James (SMPA 1) - Secondary
- Ned (DEL 4) - Solo
- Scatt (LVL 4) - Secondary
- Doomlion (LVL 9) - Solo
- Ewok41 (GoTE 9)
- Focus (BBC 9) - Secondary
- Elegant (BAM 13) - Secondary

Zero Suit Samus: 6
- Nairo (LVL 1) - Solo
- Anti (BBC 1)
- Degree of Fear (GoTE 5) - Solo
- Dakpo (TLOK 9) - Secondary?
- BSM (BBC 13) - Solo
- Wingey (GoTE 13) - Solo

Captain Falcon: 6
- Fatality (GWIN 2) - Solo
- Big D (BBC 2) - Secondary
- Copycat (GWIN 4) - Solo
- Cashmere (GoTE 5)
- Demitus (DEL 7)
- Odon (SMPA 13)

R.O.B.: 6
- 8BitMan (GoTE 2)
- Loco (GWIN 7)
- Sassy (TLOK 9) - Solo
- Focus (BBC 9) - Secondary
- Cadence (BBC 13) - Secondary
- Redeemer Z (SMPA 13) - Secondary

Ness: 5
- BlazingPasta (SMPA 4) - Solo
- Awestin (TLOK 5) - Solo
- FOW (LVL 9) - Solo
- Poppt1 (BAM 13) - Solo
- Horse (LVL 13) - Solo

Mewtwo: 5
- TheReflexWonder (GWIN 1) - Secondary
- Abadango (BAM 2)
- Jaice (BAM 7) - Secondary
- Demitus (DEL 7) - Secondary
- Katakiri (DEL 9)

Rosalina: 4
- Nite (DEL 3) - Solo
- Falln (LVL 7) - Solo
- Jaice (BAM 7)
- Neos (GWIN 9) - Solo

Ryu: 4
- Locus (BBC 4) - Solo
- Hooded (SMPA 5) - Solo
- Earl (BAM 9) - Solo
- Darkshad (DEL 13) - Solo

Luigi: 4
- James (SMPA 1)
- Dakpo (TLOK 9) - Solo?
- Shel (DEL 13) - Solo
- BC Luck (SMPA 9) - Solo

Sonic: 4
- Seagull Joe (SMPA 7) - Solo
- 6WX (SMPA 7) - Solo
- StaticManny (GoTE 9) - Solo?
- Wrath (GWIN 13) - Solo

Yoshi: 4
- Firefly (BBC 7) - Solo
- Nikes (BAM 9) - Solo
- YelloRello (TLOK 9) - Solo
- Poltergust (GoTE 13) - Solo

Palutena: 4
- Prince Ramen (GoTE 1) - Solo
- MM (BAM 8) - Solo
- Yoshi Kirishima (DEL 13)
- Z (LVL 9) - Secondary

Wario: 3
- TheReflexWonder (GWIN 1)
- Micaelis (GWIN 13) - Solo
- Newk (GWIN 13) - Solo

Metaknight: 3
- Tyrant (LVL 5)
- Ghostbone (BAM 5) - Secondary
- OrcaTheHuman (GWIN 7) - Solo

Bowser: 3
- LordMix (GWIN 3) - Solo
- Angis (BBC 5) - Secondary
- Boozer (BAM 13) - Solo

Roy: 3
- Sethlon (TLOK 7) - Solo
- Hyper (GWIN 9) - Solo
- Katakiri (DEL 9) - Secondary

Pikachu: 3
- Captain L (BBC 5) - Solo
- Z (LVL 9)
- Rideae (GoTE 9)

Corrin: 3
- Cosmos (TLOK 1) - Solo
- Mono (BBC 13) - Solo
- Bluebeast (GoTE 13) - Solo

Lucas: 2
- Ewok41 (GoTE 9) - Secondary
- Hakii (TLOK 13)

Samus: 2
- H-Man (DEL 9) - Solo
- Hakii (TLOK 13) - Secondary

Robin: 2
- Johan (TLOK 4) - Solo
- Masai (BBC 7) - Solo

Greninja: 2
- Waveguider (BAM 5) - Secondary
- P2P With Gibus (TLOK 9) - Solo

Peach: 2
- Umeki (BAM 4) - Solo
- LingLing (SMPA 12) - Solo

Olimar: 2
- Jaice (BAM 7)
- BB SM Army (TLOK 13) - Solo

Link: 2
- Ty (BBC 9) - Solo
- Espeon CH (BBC 9) - Solo

Zelda: 2
- Purple Guy (GoTE 7) - Solo
- Daenerys (SMPA 13) - Solo

Game & Watch: 1
- Extra (BAM 9) - Solo

Wii Fit Trainer: 1
- Waveguider (BAM 5)

Megaman: 1
- Scatt (LVL 4)

Charizard: 1
- Angis (BBC 5)

Villager: 1
- BC (TLOK 7) - Solo

King Dedede: 1
- Big D (BBC 2)

Dr. Mario: 1
- Len (BBC 3) - Secondary

Kirby: 1
- Komota (DEL 9) - Solo

Lucina: 1
- Yoshi Kirishima (DEL 13) - Secondary

Mii Brawler: 1
- Limbs (GWIN 5) - Solo

Marth: 1
- P2W Doom Bot (GWIN 9) - Solo

Donkey Kong: 1
- KDK (GWIN 13) - Solo

Ganondorf: 1
- Evil Goku (GoTE 9) - Seems like he used secondaries, primary was Ganondorf though


Characters missing from top 16 this weekend were:

Spoiler

Toon Link (weird...)
Ike (really?)
Pit & Dark Pit (really???)
Lucario
Mii Gunner
Mii Swordfighter
Jigglypuff (...)
Bowser Jr.
Duck Hunt
Falco
Little Mac
Pac-Man
Shulk

 

[Amadeus9]

For what it's worth I'm trying to think of things I disagree with, with Ulevo 's mu spread... Can't say I disagree with much of it at all. I think mk v luigi is mk favored but otherwise yeah

edit: well i have other minor nitpicks but you know, opinions and all that

 

[L9999]

GOML pools are out, here's some of the more interesting winners finals matches (imo)

DarkAura vs. PikaPika!
Mr. E vs. KingKong or c-lu
False ? vs. Stroumbert
Blacktwins vs. Croi
Alphicans ? vs. JPeds
Poke vs. Nom
C3PO vs. 2ManyCooks
V115 vs. Tarex
Raziek vs. SpaceDong or Khal
Iceninja vs. Firefly

Canada is a weird place. Also, has anyone noticed that there have been good Pikachu placings lately and no ESAM?

 

[NegaNixx]

Das Koopa & Z ZSaberLink

Hyper apparently went pure Roy at Gwinnett.

 

[ZSaberLink]

Das Koopa & Z ZSaberLink

Hyper apparently went pure Roy at Gwinnett.

Ooh, good to know. I'll correct that. Thanks!

 

[KamikazePotato]

The characters missing were:
Toon Link (weird...)
Pit & Dark Pit (really???)
Mii Gunner
Mii Swordfighter
Jigglypuff (...)
Bowser Jr.
Duck Hunt
Falco
Little Mac
Pac-Man
Shulk

Ike is missing too.

Also, as much as people debate Diddy/Bayo/Sheik, no one seems to be saying much about Fox's gradual yet consistent rise in the meta.

 

[Ninety]

Canada is a weird place. Also, has anyone noticed that there have been good Pikachu placings lately and no ESAM?

Has ESAM even been attending tournaments lately?

 

[ZSaberLink]

Ike is missing too.

Also, as much as people debate Diddy/Bayo/Sheik, no one seems to be saying much about Fox's gradual yet consistent rise in the meta.

Fixed. Thanks!

Agreed about Fox. And despite all the talk about Marcina, their representation was surprisingly low this weekend. I guess Mr. E / Pugwest didn't play.

 

[Y2Kay]

Ulevo

M2 should be moved up into the 0 tier. MK's neutral is centered on his grounded options and he lacks range, making Shadow Ball camping and M2's overall spacing quite annoying. The ladder is only reliable with enough rage on MK, but MK dies relatively early due to M2's high kill power with fair and his kill throws, so MK shouldn't be able to abuse rage very much, though MK's own great KOing ability allows him to keep up. While MK has the better disadvantage state, on a per-confirm basis they hit roughly just as hard. His multi-jumps make it easier for him to avoid Shadow Ball landing traps, and with M2 generally having a harder time landing, I believe MK has a slight edge in overall damage racking. I just can't see how this could be in MK's favor, though, given how difficult it can be for him to approach a good M2.

Edit: Also as mentioned above by corvus, Sheik is not a 0-tier MU for MK. Her neutral is still quite oppressive, and she racks up damage better than him not just because MK has weaker combo set-ups at mid-percents, but because while MK's disadvantage is very good, Sheik's is probably even better with her faster aerial mobility and aerials (she actually has a combo-breaker). MK's only notable advantage is KOing, but even with the ability to abuse rage and KO Sheik with DA -> SL at 60%, getting a good Sheik to that percent can be quite difficult.

after watching game 1 I have a hard time seeing this worse than even for Mewtwo. It could possibly slightly in Mewtwo's favor.

 

[Illuminose]

Has ESAM even been attending tournaments lately?

no

Fixed. Thanks!

Agreed about Fox. And despite all the talk about Marcina, their representation was surprisingly low this weekend. I guess Mr. E / Pugwest didn't play.

i mean honestly fox has trouble being used solo, just look at larrys sheik struggle despite the patch and his struggle with mario (as fox). unfavorable matchups against rosa (bad for fox, close enough to win if you outplay them but fox has to be pretty damn perfect in the mu overall), cloud (as demonstrated by some losses to cloud players worse than him by larry), and bayo don't help either. i think fox is probably a little overrated overall in the grand scheme of things though he's still extremely good. i just don't really think he's top 5 like some people are saying, more like 7-9 on the tier list.

 

[Das Koopa]

Ike is missing too.

also Lucario

 

[juddy96]

Mega Smash Mondays #50 is tonight streamed by 2GG. 126 entrants! http://challonge.com/msm50singles

 

[Das Koopa]

May 16th updated results:

Top 20, using Top 16s:

Spoiler

Bayonetta: 287.5
Diddy Kong: 251
Sheik: 232
Cloud: 176
Fox: 158
Zero Suit Samus: 144.5
Mario: 133
Sonic: 124.5
Rosalina & Luma: 104.5
Ness: 100
R.O.B: 93.5
Mewtwo: 88.5
Captain Falcon: 84
Luigi: 79.5
Meta Knight: 74
Toon Link: 68.5
Ryu: 67.5
Mega Man: 63
Corrin: 62.5
Yoshi: 61.5 [tie]
Peach: 61.5 [tie]

Top 20, using Top 8s:

Spoiler

Bayonetta: 164
Diddy Kong: 146
Sheik: 136
Cloud: 100
Zero Suit Samus: 88.5
Fox: 86.5
Mario: 77
Sonic: 61.5
R.O.B: 52.5
Mewtwo: 52.5
Meta Knight: 49
Rosalina: 47.5
Ness: 46
Captain Falcon: 38
Mega Man: 38
Ryu: 34
Donkey Kong: 33
Corrin: 32
Luigi: 31
Peach: 28

 

[valakmtnsmash4]

May 16th updated results:

Top 20, using Top 16s:

Spoiler

Bayonetta: 287.5
Diddy Kong: 251
Sheik: 232
Cloud: 176
Fox: 158
Zero Suit Samus: 144.5
Mario: 133
Sonic: 124.5
Rosalina & Luma: 104.5
Ness: 100
R.O.B: 93.5
Mewtwo: 88.5
Captain Falcon: 84
Luigi: 79.5
Meta Knight: 74
Toon Link: 68.5
Ryu: 67.5
Mega Man: 63
Corrin: 62.5
Yoshi: 61.5 [tie]
Peach: 61.5 [tie]

Top 20, using Top 8s:

Spoiler

Bayonetta: 164
Diddy Kong: 146
Sheik: 136
Cloud: 100
Zero Suit Samus: 88.5
Fox: 86.5
Mario: 77
Sonic: 61.5
R.O.B: 52.5
Mewtwo: 52.5
Meta Knight: 49
Ness: 46
Rosalina: 47.5
Captain Falcon: 38
Mega Man: 38
Ryu: 34
Donkey Kong: 33
Corrin: 32
Luigi: 31
Peach: 28

Quite interesting to see rob placing well in tourneys, he is consistent in his results as well. Never thought his top 8 results were better than mew2 tho, so this chart puts things in perspective

 

[ZSaberLink]

There are 8 tournies I'm documenting this weekend. Here are the Top 16 results for each, compiled:


Battle Arena Melbourne 8 (May 13th-15th) (Australia) (260 Entrants) (Category 2)

Spoiler

1st: Mr. R
2nd: Abadango ,
3rd: 9B
4th: Umeki
5th: Waveguider ,
5th: Ghostbone , ,
7th: Jaice , , ,
7th: Jezmo
9th: Extra
9th: Earl
9th: Nikes
9th: MM
13th: Boozer
13th: Poppt1
13th: Elegant ,
13th: Duon

LEVEL UP EXPO (May 14th-15th) (Las Vegas) (172 Entrants) (Category 2)

Spoiler

1st: Nairo
2nd: VoiD
3rd: Larry Lurr
4th: Scatt ,
5th: Tyrant ,
5th: Saiki
7th: K9
7th: Falln
9th: FOW
9th: Xzax
9th: Z
9th: Doomlion
13th: Lycan
13th: Calculus
13th: JK
13th: Horse

TLOK 1K May (May 14th) (Dallas-Fort Worth) (136 Entrants) (Category 1)

Spoiler

1st: Cosmos
2nd: Aerolink
3rd: JaySon
4th: Johan
5th: Awestin
5th: Karna
7th: BC
7th: Sethlon
9th: P2P With Gibus
9th: YelloRello
9th: Dakpo ,
9th: Sassy
13th: Weegee
13th: Hakii ,
13th: BB SM Army
13th: iiGGy

Battle of BC (May 14th) (British Columbia) (133 Entrants) (Category 1)

Spoiler

1st: Anti , ,
2nd: Big D , ,
3rd: Len ,
4th: Locus
5th: Captain L
5th: Angis ,
7th: Masai
7th: Firefly
9th: Focus , ,
9th: Ty
9th: Choi
9th: Espeon CH
13th: Mono
13th: Lief
13th: BSM
13th: Cadence ,

Deluge (May 14th) (Midwest) (117 Entrants) (Category 1)

Spoiler

1st: Zinoto
2nd: Tyroy
3rd: Nite
4th: Ned
5th: JJROCKETS
5th: Ksev
7th: MVD
7th: Demitus .
9th: Komota
9th: H-Man
9th: Katakiri ,
9th: Dan
13th: Darkshad
13th: LCC JDB
13th: Yoshi Kirishima ,
13th: Shel

Gwinnett Brawl May (May 14th) (Georgia) (115 Entrants) (Category 1)

Spoiler

1st: TheReflexWonder ,
2nd: Fatality
3rd: LordMix
4th: Copycat
5th: Gadliel
5th: Limbs
7th: Loco
7th: OrcatheHuman
9th: FlaminRoy
9th: Hyper
9th: Neos
9th: P2W Doom Bot
13th: KDK
13th: Micaelis
13th: Wrath
13th: Newk

GoTE 4 the Kids 2016 (May 14th) (Florida) (94 Entrants) (Category 1)

Spoiler

1st: Prince Ramen
2nd: 8BitMan
3rd: JaK
4th: Prodigy
5th: Degree of Fear
5th: Cashmere
7th: Purple Guy
7th: Riot
9th: Rideae
9th: Ewok41
9th: EvilGoku
9th: Static Manny
13th: BlueBeast
13th: Kazu
13th: Wingey
13th: Poltergust

Smashadelphia (May 15th) (Philadelphia) (128 Entrants) (Category 1)

Spoiler

1st: James ,
2nd: LingLing
3rd: Apple
4th: BlazingPasta
5th: Hooded
5th: GWJ
7th: Seagull Joe
7th: 6WX
9th: Crowdingmovie
9th: C3PO
9th: Ninja
9th: BC Luck
13th: Daenerys
13th: Odon
13th: Ten
13th: Redeemer Z ,

Cannot assure 100% accuracy on FlaminRoy, EvilGoku, Dakpo, Hyper, or StaticManny.

-FlaminRoy used Sheik some a couple of months ago; This may be outdated.
-EvilGoku seems to use a lot of characters, but Youtube VODs indicate he primaries Ganondorf.
-Hyper seems to use Falcon. Can't totally be sure.
-Static Manny/All Might may have used Roy and not Sonic, but VODs indicate he's mostly stuck with Sonic in the last month.
-Dakpo uses ZSS but not in the Twitch VODs for the tourney in question, only Luigi.

Only included GoTE because it's juuuuust shy of my 96 minimum and includes several noteworthy players.

Bonus question: What were Gwinnett's custom rules? A 1111 Mii Brawler getting 5th at a tourney with a few of Florida's better players would be something noteworthy.

Z in level up expo used Palutena as a secondary. Pulled her out against Scatt in game 3

 

[Das Koopa]

Palutena seriously has better results than Greninja lmao

 

[FullMoon]

May 16th updated results:

Top 20, using Top 8s:
Bayonetta: 164
Diddy Kong: 146
Sheik: 136
Cloud: 100
Zero Suit Samus: 88.5
Fox: 86.5
Mario: 77
Sonic: 61.5
R.O.B: 52.5
Mewtwo: 52.5
Meta Knight: 49
Ness: 46
Rosalina: 47.5
Captain Falcon: 38
Mega Man: 38
Ryu: 34
Donkey Kong: 33
Corrin: 32
Luigi: 31
Peach: 28

Wrong order or did you end up switching numbers?

 

[LiL.Will]

Wow 44 out of 58 characters in top 16 in the past weekend that puts a huge smile on my face.

 

[ZSaberLink]

Palutena seriously has better results than Greninja lmao

Do you have #s in particular to compare?

Also, Anti lost to the Charizard/Bowser player 3-1????? It doesn't look like it's on the twitch stream, but that's what the smash.gg bracket says.

Also ewok41 corrected his stat on Smashboards. He went Cloud the entirety of the tourney except for 2 games (probably the ones you saw) which he went Lucas.

Secondly, I think the Link "Espeon CH" is actually tagged "Iris Z". I think Espeon CH is his sponsor or something:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6gOnrpsNQUw

 

[C3CC]

HOLD ON FOR A SECOND

Palutena won a tournament?!?!

 

[Das Koopa]

fixed that

Do you have #s in particular to compare?

Also, Anti lost to the Charizard/Bowser player 3-1????? It doesn't look like it's on the twitch stream, but that's what the smash.gg bracket says.

Also ewok41 corrected his stat on Smashboards. He went Cloud the entirety of the tourney except for 2 games (probably the ones you saw) which he went Lucas.

Secondly, I think the Link "Espeon CH" is actually tagged "Iris Z". I think Espeon CH is his sponsor or something:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6gOnrpsNQUw

It's not significant (35 to 33 in Top 16) but it's definitely interesting how lackluster Greninjas' results are. Not as bad as Villager, at least.