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10/3 presentation analysis

What tier do you think the Minecraft characters will be competitively?

  • Low tier

    Votes: 2 9.5%
  • Mid tier

    Votes: 3 14.3%
  • High-mid tier

    Votes: 6 28.6%
  • High tier

    Votes: 7 33.3%
  • Top tier

    Votes: 1 4.8%
  • Top 5

    Votes: 2 9.5%

  • Total voters
    21

Janx_uwu

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Hey there fellow blockheads! I really want to main Steve in a competitive enviorment, and after watching today's reveal trailer, I want to take a deeper dive into his moveset and overall mechanics during and after the presentation this Staurday the third. There were some notable things I noticed during the reveal trailer, but it doesn't matter much since we'll get a new presentation in just two short days. I want to look over his frame data, confirmed combos (ones that Sakurai himself does) and possible ones, percent done by all his different moves, etc. I would really appreciate some help, if you all are willing.
I'll post what I notice here probably later on Saturday evening, and if you guys want to add anything I would really appreciate it, and we can discuss the things we observe and potential theories on tier placement, combos, playstyle, etc. This is all for fun so feel free to contribute anything!
 
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Janx_uwu

Smash Champion
Writing Team
Joined
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Messages
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Faraway Avalon
I feel inclined to agree, but I’m more optimistic at this point. I think he’ll be a mid tier at best that, like you said, does good in a niche. In Steve’s case, probably setting up traps and quite literally building your battlefield on the stage. He will absolutely get messed up at close range unless he has a good OOSO we don’t know about yet.
At best he’ll be a high tier with the potential to mess up his opponents far and close up, with good frame data and being one of the best zoners in the game even rivaling Min Min.
Bit early to tell really, but I guess that’s why I started this thread in the first place :p
 

Janx_uwu

Smash Champion
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Joined
May 17, 2020
Messages
2,975
Location
Faraway Avalon
Ok, took me a while, today was hectic. But here are my thoughts, in no specific order (btw since the presentation was made in August I'm not looking at frame data or percent or knockback since that just kind of seems redundant):
His jab/ftilt/nair looks pretty cool. You essentially get to carry your opponent forward a bit. The usefulness of this will probably depend on whether or not it can combo into things like grab or up tilt (which can combo into up smash, which can probably combo into other stuff too). I'd assume the max amount of times it can hit your opponent would be three to four, probably a lot more on super heavyweights.
Down tilt might be his best normal, honestly. It's PK Fire, but with a shorter range, faster, doesn't need a hit to activate, and can edgeguard better. Honestly this will lead to some pretty cheesy kills. If it can combo into his forward smash and/or aerials, than we have an amazing tool on our hands.
Up tilt and up air looks like an upward-facing jab. Not much to say other than it combos into up smash, which looks like a pretty good move honestly. I think up smash can combo? I'll rewatch it here in a bit.
Then we have the dash attack. Just looks like a mediocre movement option that might be pretty strong with enough leveling up of materials. Maybe it's fast in the final product however.
Forward smash: It's strong and it's fast, not much more to say.
Down smash: It sends at a low angle and has high knockback. Even Sakurai showed us how we can use it as a very effective edgeguard in conjunction with Block. Will probably be used the most out of his smashes.
Up smash: If it can combo, then this is an amazing move. If not, then it's probably just a mostly inoffensive kill move. Will be nice to have an upwards attack that isn't the axe.
Forward air: On it's own, seems like a really good spike. But in conjunction with Block, or Minecart, or down throw-oh, this move will be amazing. Imagine sending your opponent off with Minecart and following them to spike them out of it and into the abyss.
Back air: Same thing but it's not as funny, yet probably the better move.
Down air: Seems like a decent move. Doesn't have a spike hitbox though, so generally it won't be worth the extra iron unless you're sure you can hit them.
Up throw: It's a kill move, apparently. You'll likely not want to use it until kill percent since Steve's anti-air options don't look good in the slightest.
Forward throw: Sends them offstage and at a low angle and it can kill. Probably his best throw since it seems like when Steve has the high ground he does super well.
Down throw: Unless Mr. Sakurai was lying (you cheeky son of a gun, you!), down throw combos into fair. I shouldn't need to tell you why that's amazing if you've read this far. Consumes iron but is most definitely worth it.
Back throw: Looks bad. Just puts them above you and isn't a kill throw, so why would you ever want to do it?
B (Mine): Lylat Cruise is now Steve's best stage, I guess. Yeah, seems as though the hardest part of this move will be knowing when to stop, you'll have to keep an eye on both your meter and your opponent. Looks good overall, too early to talk about the whole stage gimmick imo.
B (Craft): From what I could tell, you sit there for half a second and it makes your weapons better. Sounds like a good deal to me.
B (Block): Oh. My. God. This move is godlike. You can use it for:
Edgeguarding (invalidates slower, linear, and vertical recoveries)
Ledgetrapping (can force your opponent to jump, in which you can cover it with up air or use another block to jump up and fair/bair)
Mixups (basically playing a game of 2D Fortnite)
Landing (since his air speed and landing options seem poor, this helps a ton. You can even use it to walk to the other side of the stage and just drop to that ledge with canceled dair)
Zoning (place a wall to bait out a jump, place a few in front of you to defend against rushdown characters)
And most importantly-building L's, obscene hand gestures and other taunting images that can double as an edgeguard. If you can make suggestive images to win matches, then this might be the most insulting and rage-inducing character yet.
So yeah, his best move will be Block don't @ me
Down B: Yeah, to me it seems like this will be very useful in conjunction with Block to set up traps (yet again another reminder that Block is one of the best moves in the game). Damaging it also sets the TNT off, so like Pac's hydrant, we should find out the health of this object and which moves are best to detonate it, preferably with us not dying in the process.
Side B: Not sure if it's a command grab or a hit grab (won't grab through shields like Joker's grappling hook). Either way it will be very strong for burst options, since Steve's movement speed is not anything amazing. It will also be good for edgeguards with the grab.
Up B: They took out gliding in Sm4sh for the sole reason that it was OP, so if they're bringing it back they must have balanced it somehow. So yeah, not great on its own most likely, but since Block gives you back your double jump (which is amazing), they can work together pretty dang well.
Taunts: They look really cool. Although since I am a man of class, I'd rather flip the bird to my opponent using Block (like I said, amazing move).
Final Smash: Amazing range, but looks to be not as good for groups of people. Either way it's an amazing final smash.

So, what do I think of Steve and Alex overall?
Well I think they excel in lots of areas, namely edgeguarding, ledgetrapping, setting up traps, baiting, and annoying the opponent. However they seem like they won't do as great when it comes to other things. They are pretty slow and their jump and DJ are not very good at all, might even be worse than Snake's. Air speed may not seem like a big deal, but when you consider Kirby, a character who has a super slow air speed despite doing great in many other factors...yeah, let's just say tier lists don't do him any favors. This may be a mute point since things are bound to change, but since it's supposed to reflect the game as much as possible I doubt it. They also don't have a very good anti-air game, it seems like. However things like Block and Minecart are tools that can help them in these areas. So overall, they have potential to be top tier definitely, but we'll just have to wait and see.
 
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