1.1.5 Zelda Changes?

SM Mystic · Mar 15, 2016

Who knows, maybe Sakurai actually remembered to buff us. But don't expect much. The patch just rolled out, so we'll find more along the way. Some things I did notice that are likely placebo are...

Her Up Air comes out a few frames faster
Noticed a slightly faster run speed
Can react out of Fsmash faster.

There may be more, or there may be none, but like I said, be prepared for nothing.

Note: Cloud got a nerf.

buzzard · Mar 15, 2016

I also feel she is more mobile on land and maybe on air.

Her jab is doing 11% (8% before, last hit is now 5%) if the 3 hits connect. Maybe it has slower startup as well but not so sure about that.

Dash grab seems to have better range. Maybe it's because of the increased speed?

Jimster · Mar 15, 2016

Jab went from 8 to 11% Nair front side went from 11 to 15% (if all connected) and back side from 7 to 11% Dair: 14 to 16% Uair: 15 to 17%
Dthrow into uair seemed to be slightly more consistant? Please check. But it is nice to have a 23% simple dthrow into uair combo no matter what...

buzzard · Mar 15, 2016

DAir was already 16, UAir is nice. I think we have an improved hoo ha now.

MzNetta · Mar 15, 2016

Confirming that jab does 11% now.
Also Nair does 15% if you connect with the front hits.

SM Mystic · Mar 15, 2016

We're getting damage data in right now folks. Nair front hit went from 11 to 15 percent. Back hit went from 7 to 11 percent. Uair went from 15 to 17 percents and jab went from 8 to 11 percent.
~Zylach

KlicKlac · Mar 15, 2016

This damage increase to Nair (15%) seems huge. More damage should equate to more stun. This should mean that falling Nair will be easier to follow up and harder for the opponent to escape when you hit the ground. This might also mean more followups after Nair.

..and hello fellow zelda mains, this marks my first post here. I've been lurking here for months, and finally I feel like posting!

Rickster · Mar 15, 2016

THIS IS REAL?

THIS IS ACTUALLY HAPPENING?

Omg when I was reading all the posts above I actually started smiling so big I must've looked stupid lmao

KlicKlac · Mar 15, 2016

Rickster said:
THIS IS REAL?

THIS IS ACTUALLY HAPPENING?

Omg when I was reading all the posts above I actually started smiling so big I must've looked stupid lmao

I am a solo zelda main who has played over 9000 games with just zelda. I haven't even touched any other fighters.
I have been waiting for a buff like this for two years since smash 3DS came out.
I am ecstatic.

MOI-ARI · Mar 15, 2016

Along with Uair Dmg buffs. Seems like its hitbox is...bigger?

Im able to FastFall Uair on Mario, and have it HIT.

So Uair is either bigger, Faster or the hitboxe has been moved in 'some way'. Can't believe it was finally was messed with!

oh and 'obligatory 'Ftilt and utilt seem sparkley-er'

Darktundra · Mar 15, 2016

Hi KlicKlac you're the blessing we were waiting for
Pivot grab is jank
Din's fire
nair
u-air
movement in general

Jimster · Mar 16, 2016

Remember the FF nair into Farore's on Marth at 80% video? Well, now it works on FD at 74% in 3DS, but I don't really have the wii u data...

Rickster · Mar 16, 2016

Not feeling the run speed buffs.

Ftilt has much better startup.

The Jab and Uair damage buff easily confirmed already

Grab may have had its range buffed, need to test more

That's all I can find atm.

Edit: Oops forgot about the Nair thing

Also grab seems unchanged to me

SM Mystic · Mar 16, 2016

Zelda reps from the Facebook group are all noting Up Air comes out faster. And it looks visually bigger.

PGH_Chrispy · Mar 16, 2016

SM Mystic said:
Zelda reps from the Facebook group are all noting Up Air comes out faster. And it looks visually bigger.

Yoo what is this Facebook group you speak of

Jimster · Mar 16, 2016

Is anyone able to check landing lag changes? Because according to the Shieldstun page on Kurogane Hammer:http://kuroganehammer.com/Smash4/Shieldstun, as Zelda's fair does 20% damage, it should cause 13 frames of shield stune (If I understood it correctly) and Zelda's fair can have a landing lag smaller than 19% she might just be able to fair safely on shield, which in my opinion is FAIRLY reasonable considering Zelda's lack of safe options.

Rickster · Mar 16, 2016

There are no frame data changes to Uair. You can test the startup and endlag by full hop Uairing off the side of Dreamland. Zelda gets 4 in before dying just like before.

Come on guys Uair has been "getting bigger and faster" for three patches now.

Bunni · Mar 16, 2016

where were you when zelda was ban

I was creating an account here just to ****post out of sheer joy.

KlicKlac · Mar 16, 2016

Darktundra said:
Hi KlicKlac you're the blessing we were waiting for
Pivot grab is jank
Din's fire
nair
u-air
movement in general

Hi Darktundra. I actually have been lurking in this zelda subforum for quite a lot for the last 6 months or so. Was just too busy to actually post here, I suppose. But that's going to change right now.

And my dedication to zelda really was understated in my earlier post. Smash 4 is basically the only video game (well...maybe mario kart 8 too) that I have been playing for the last 2 years since the game came out on the 3DS. I have only used zelda and I play almost every other day. And when I am not playing, I am checking out any and all news on zelda smash strategies or whatever. So a good chunk of my life has been practicing my zelda game lol. I should go check how many hours I've played smash lol. I mainly stick to For Glory, but now that zelda got some buffs (and real changes, not some final smash aesthetic crap like in the last patch), I think I'll finally go to my locals lol.

Rickster · Mar 16, 2016

Rickster said:
Not feeling the run speed buffs.

Ftilt has much better startup.

The Jab and Uair damage buff easily confirmed already

Grab may have had its range buffed, need to test more

That's all I can find atm.

Edit: Oops forgot about the Nair thing

Also grab seems unchanged to me

Ftilt was false placebo.

Yay for useless damage buffs, as if Zelda needed them

SM Mystic · Mar 16, 2016

CrispyT-Bone said:
Yoo what is this Facebook group you speak of

If you can add me on Facebook, I'll add you to it.
Da'Ryeus Eugene Talley is the name.

Darktundra · Mar 16, 2016

KlicKlac said:
Hi Darktundra. I actually have been lurking in this zelda subforum for quite a lot for the last 6 months or so. Was just too busy to actually post here, I suppose. But that's going to change right now.

And my dedication to zelda really was understated in my earlier post. Smash 4 is basically the only video game (well...maybe mario kart 8 too) that I have been playing for the last 2 years since the game came out on the 3DS. I have only used zelda and I play almost every other day. And when I am not playing, I am checking out any and all news on zelda smash strategies or whatever. So a good chunk of my life has been practicing my zelda game lol. I should go check how many hours I've played smash lol. I mainly stick to For Glory, but now that zelda got some buffs (and real changes, not some final smash aesthetic crap like in the last patch), I think I'll finally go to my locals lol.

I am a Zelda lab rat that selfishly keep my techniques hidden........but don't tell anyone I said that.

SM Mystic · Mar 16, 2016

Rickster said:
There are no frame data changes to Uair. You can test the startup and endlag by full hop Uairing off the side of Dreamland. Zelda gets 4 in before dying just like before.

Come on guys Uair has been "getting bigger and faster" for three patches now.

You can short hop Uair and do Uair from a fast fall. It does come out quicker.

MOI-ARI · Mar 16, 2016

Rickster said:
There are no frame data changes to Uair. You can test the startup and endlag by full hop Uairing off the side of Dreamland. Zelda gets 4 in before dying just like before.

Come on guys Uair has been "getting bigger and faster" for three patches now.

b-but...

wait, was it always possible to FF uair on Mario? Because i happen to keep landing it.

^Plus. LedgeDrop to uair missed Mario last patch.

^Seems pretty easy to hit now at least ...idk

Rickster · Mar 16, 2016

SM Mystic said:
You can short hop Uair and do Uair from a fast fall. It does come out quicker.

We've been able to do both of those since release.

Nothing has changed.

Rebel13 · Mar 16, 2016

Uair is definitely faster. Down Throw is different. I just tested on 1/2 speed in training mode and had my opponent DI away out of down throw at 70%, and I could still get a true combo into a dash jump up air. Or maybe this is just u air being faster, but either way, that HUGE. I might actually consider using Zelda now. What nonsense.........

Newbarktown · Mar 16, 2016

Pardon my ignorance, but has jab > sweetspot fair always been a true combo?

KlicKlac · Mar 16, 2016

Newbarktown said:
Pardon my ignorance, but has jab > sweetspot fair always been a true combo?

It definitely is a true combo at the right percentage on the right character. I believe it works the easiest on samus. However, this jab to sweetspot Fair is only a true combo in a very small window.

MOI-ARI · Mar 16, 2016

Newbarktown said:
Pardon my ignorance, but has jab > sweetspot fair always been a true combo?

Yeah on some characters, or its more DI dependent i think. From personal experience it seems it can happen more frequently if you hit them with jab as they are in the air.

ZombieBran · Mar 16, 2016

This won't change Zelda's tier position but I'm glad for these buffs. I always thought Zelda should do a bit more damage if she's going to stay as slow as she is. If she plays like a bad heavyweight, at least let her always hit like a heavyweight

More importantly I hope this means there will be more patches and hopefully more Zelda buffs.

also gorls, why are we acting like these are Zeldas first buffs? She's gotten a plethora of buffs.

KlicKlac · Mar 16, 2016

So it seems now Zelda's uair comes out faster and her ftilt is now comes out on frame 10 instead of 12 and ends on frame 37 instead of 39.

According to labbers.

KlicKlac · Mar 16, 2016

https://www.diffchecker.com/j8xt8mpo

The actual data dump changes for zelda.
Wow upair got its hitbox increased too!

Rickster · Mar 16, 2016

Well, I stand corrected.

Nice to see that the Grab and Ftilt changes weren't placebo.

KlicKlac · Mar 16, 2016

Rickster said:
Well, I stand corrected.

Nice to see that the Grab and Ftilt changes weren't placebo.

I haven't looked at zelda' grabs yet. What do you see differently with her grabs?

ZombieBran · Mar 16, 2016

I ****ING KNEW FTILT WAS FASTER
but I fell for placebo changes before so I never trust myself anymore.

Forget what I said, maybe Zelda may not be the absolute worst anymore rofl.

Rickster · Mar 16, 2016

KlicKlac said:
I haven't looked at zelda' grabs yet. What do you see differently with her grabs?

Well in the code, each of the grabs has something called "unk" followed by a number, and the numbers for all of them were increased by 1. So I'm just assuming it was a range increase or something since idk what else it could possibly be.

KlicKlac · Mar 16, 2016

Rickster said:
Well in the code, each of the grabs has something called "unk" followed by a number, and the numbers for all of them were increased by 1. So I'm just assuming it was a range increase or something since idk what else it could possibly be.

Whatever it is, hopefully it allows for more followups.

Furret · Mar 16, 2016

KlicKlac said:
https://www.diffchecker.com/j8xt8mpo

The actual data dump changes for zelda.
Wow upair got its hitbox increased too!

hmm neat lets see what we got in the care package;

Uair increased range and damage with KBG decreased to compensate
Looks like Dash/Standing/Pivot grab has some parameter change best if @BJN39 just looked at it, I suck with grab hitboxes
Multi hits on Nair hit .5% harder, final hit confirmed for 5%, KBG also adjusted to be less
Multi hits on Jab hit .5% harder, final hit confirmed for 5%, BKB increase slightly/KBG decreased
Odd changes to Ftilt with frame modifiers and a Z axis change, might come out as soon as frame 9 if I am mathing correctly. (I still hate the move)

as a note this doesn't include any FAFs in it, so there could be more don't get your hopes up

Stuff that can be swept under the rug;

Uair is not coming out sooner

ZombieBran said:
also gorls, why are we acting like these are Zeldas first buffs? She's gotten a plethora of buffs.

please do take note of this kiddos

Deleted member · Mar 16, 2016

Posted by Methacrylate and Lavani

Zelda
- Nair multihits damage 2/1 -> 2.5/1.5
- Nair (final hit) KBG 160/160/140/140 -> 130/130/110/110
- Uair Size 7 -> 8 and KBG 90 -> 84
- Jab hits 1 and 2 damage 2.5 -> 3
- Jab hit 3 (final hit) KBG 130 -> 95 and BKB 35 -> 40
- F tilt Z position 3 -> 3.5

Increased horizontal range on all of Zelda's grabs.

Grab

X₂ 10.5 -> 11.5

Dash Grab

X₂ 13.5 -> 14.5

Pivot Grab

X₂ -15.7 -> -16.7

Furret · Mar 16, 2016

Kokonoe said:
Zelda
- Nair multihits damage 2/1 -> 2.5/1.5
- Nair (final hit) KBG 160/160/140/140 -> 130/130/110/110
- Uair Size 7 -> 8 and KBG 90 -> 84
- Jab hits 1 and 2 damage 2.5 -> 3
- Jab hit 3 (final hit) KBG 130 -> 95 and BKB 35 -> 40
- F tilt Z position 3 -> 3.5

hey did you get frame 9 for ftilt?

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