Shroom for the Stars: Captain Toad for Smash 4! CHAPTER 11: IT'S A MII; TOAD!

[Guybrush20X6]

Let's think, what defines Captian Toad's gameplay?

I think Captain Toad is about taking advantage of gap's in the enemy's defense and using the enviroment to his advantage to make up for his own shortcomings.

How to translate that into smash...

 

[Zzuxon]

Let's think, what defines Captian Toad's gameplay?

I think Captain Toad is about taking advantage of gap's in the enemy's defense and using the enviroment to his advantage to make up for his own shortcomings.

How to translate that into smash...

Sounds like you are describing a very strong combo game, but poor approach.
Which I am all for.

 

[Gold_Jacobson]

So, I read again that supposedly Captain Toad mentions that "He wants to be in smash." This is also a bullet on the original post. Can someone tell me where this comes from? I googled a bunch but got nothing.

 

[Kenith]

So, I read again that supposedly Captain Toad mentions that "He wants to be in smash." This is also a bullet on the original post. Can someone tell me where this comes from? I googled a bunch but got nothing.

@GoldenYuiitusin Watch out, this guy's trying to out-gold you.

Also, he needs your translation.

 

[Deleted member]

@GoldenYuiitusin Watch out, this guy's trying to out-gold you.

Also, he needs your translation.

http://smashboards.com/threads/official-character-discussion-thread.347464/page-962#post-17025449
I've posted the link a couple pages back.
Not quoting the entire thing again....

 

[Gold_Jacobson]

http://smashboards.com/threads/official-character-discussion-thread.347464/page-962#post-17025449
I've posted the link a couple pages back.
Not quoting the entire thing again....

Hey, thank you very much for going back and getting this. As a new Captain Toad fan, I think this is great news. Personally, I think he will be the first dlc character, via amiibo. "Buy the Captain Toad Amiibo and unlock ___ extra stages in Captain Toad Treasure Tracker . And participate in Smash Bros 3DS/Wii U this holiday!"

 

[Zzuxon]

Hey, thank you very much for going back and getting this. As a new Captain Toad fan, I think this is great news. Personally, I think he will be the first dlc character, via amiibo. "Buy the Captain Toad Amiibo and unlock ___ extra stages in Captain Toad Treasure Tracker . And participate in Smash Bros 3DS/Wii U this holiday!"

I'm not so sure he'd be the first DLC character, those would likely be cut vets. But he is up there at the top echelon of potential newcomer DLC, I agree.

 

[Arcadenik]

Let's think, what defines Captian Toad's gameplay?

I think Captain Toad is about taking advantage of gap's in the enemy's defense and using the enviroment to his advantage to make up for his own shortcomings.

How to translate that into smash...

So Toad would be bottom tier or worse than Pichu because Toad cannot use the environment against opponents on Battlefield and Final Destination.

 

[Captain Toad]

So Toad would be bottom tier or worse than Pichu because Toad cannot use the environment against opponents on Battlefield and Final Destination.

Bottom tier? I think not, Toad is the best, therefore he would edge hog and flip final destination upside down instantly winning lol.

 

[Oracle_Summon]

So Toad would be bottom tier or worse than Pichu because Toad cannot use the environment against opponents on Battlefield and Final Destination.

Impossible. You can't get worse than Pichu.

 

[Autumn ♫]

Impossible. You can't get worse than Pichu.

Kirby did it in Melee, apparently.
http://www.ssbwiki.com/Tier_list

 

[Oracle_Summon]

Kirby did it in Melee, apparently.
http://www.ssbwiki.com/Tier_list

Well, I'll be. Though, it is horrible that Pichu constantly hurt itself whenever it used electric attacks even though it was canon.

 

[Berserker.]

Tier lists? Seriously? Already?

And what the ****. I'm not even on this list. Am I in some sort of alternate dimension?

Just make him ditch the backpack so he can jump.

No wa--- Wait a minute....

Hmmmmm.... Acutally... I can think of several ways on how to integrate the weight of his backpack into his moveset and traits. What if, you can actually use Toad's backpack as a weapon akin to a flail.

You can also throw it to enemies and it deals high damage and high shield damage. While having a bag, your falling speed is much faster and you're limited to walking. Oh and your walking speed is as sluggish as 1/2 of Puff's walking.

Toad has a special or standard that allows him to collect diamonds. You can gain a maximum of 3. Each diamond adds 3% damage to any attack that involves bag whacking. THROWING AWAY THE BAG will result to you losing all diamonds. Note that diamonds will still add to the damage of the thrown bag.

Without the bag, Toad's very fast but his damage output is weak.... Hm...

Sounds too gimmicky but it's interesting



And no. I don't think he's likely to get in Smash 4 at this point BUT DLC status is definitely not out of the realm of possibility.

 

[YoshiandToad]

Tier lists? Seriously? Already?

And what the ****. I'm not even on this list. Am I in some sort of alternate dimension?

I didn't like to assume! I'll add you right away.


Also although gimmicky, I kind of like the idea of having the bag be losable to heavily affect stats. Probably wouldn't work in game, but it's a fantastic idea.

 

[Berserker.]

I didn't like to assume! I'll add you right away.


Also although gimmicky, I kind of like the idea of having the bag be losable to heavily affect stats. Probably wouldn't work in game, but it's a fantastic idea.

If there's DLC, there's probably time to make **** like that happen. Unlikely but possible-ish

Smash 4 has some out-of-the ordinary newcomers. One with two-in-one character (Rosaluma), one with his own personal HUD (Little Mac), one with an invisible magic meter per tome (Robin), a not-Strider (Greninja) and while we're at it, a psychopath/sociopath (Villager) that uses things that aren't even weapons to begin with.

 

[Berserker.]

Whoops I double posted. Merge post?

This is what happens when you got too much spare time. Day dreaming and fantasizing. Doodling with moves.

Didn't really give that much thought about it.
[collapse="Daydreaming"]Basic traits:
> Falling speed = Mario

Backpack mechanic:
> With the backpack, his jump height is one stage block high
> Falling speed is increased to Fox's falling speed
> His foot speed is as fast as Mario's (He can still run fast with the backpack based on Mario 3D World and CT:TT)
> Without his backpack, he's as fast as maybe Captain Falcon(?)
> Jump height is increased. No specific value. Too lazy

Diamond collecting mechanics:
> Each diamond adds 3% to any attack that involves using the backpack
> Maximum limit is at 3
> Each diamond also adds to the move's base knockback
> Can only be gained through mining while GROUNDED
> As long as you have a diamond, some frames of certain moves have super armor

Neutral B: Mine
> Adds 1 diamond to Toad's backpack
> While grounded, it does NOT damage
> Animation lingers as long as Ike's eruption
> In air, it deals 10% damage. Potent meteor smash

Forward B: Throw away
> Throws one diamond away which deals 18% damage
> Arc can be manipulated (Diagonal up/down or straight)
> Can do moderate shield damage
> Fast start-up

Hold Forward B: Backpack throw away
> Holding down forward B will make C.Toad throw away his backpack
> Can do moderate shield damage
> Arc can be manipulated (Diagonal up/down or straight)
> Default damage (w/ no diamonds) is at 14%. Affected by diamonds
> Somewhat slow start-up

Downward B: Wall pop-up
> Acts as a barrier
> Absorbs 25% damage
> As tall as Mario
> Can only summon 1 at a time

Upward B: Windmill platform (The ones where in you blow on the mic for it to move in SM3D World)
> High vertical, mediocre horizontal
> Deals 8% damage in 4 hits

Notable attack

(Dash A): Mine cart- Akin to Wario's bike except it's uncontrollable and you can only go at one direction. Deals 9% damage. Can absorb 15% damage. If the cart blows up (losing all its "health"), Toad receives 10% damage. While dashing, you can press A to throw turnips which deals 8% damage each

(A) Turnip throw- Throws a turnip which deals 8% damage. Fairly spammable. This is also Toad's attack when pressing A while in air. The turnips are a bit floaty so it can last longer on stage.[/collapse]

Too lazy to come up with his playstyle. Just know that his attacks are still fast

 

[Guybrush20X6]

So Toad would be bottom tier or worse than Pichu because Toad cannot use the environment against opponents on Battlefield and Final Destination.

Not nessessarliy. I was thinking he coudl create enviromental hazards or something. Like his down special is him dodging a Thwomp or his up special is him (and any foes) being blasted upwards by a fan.

Kind of like Nathan Drake magiking a chest high wall from nowhere in PSASBR.

 

[YoshiandToad]

Not nessessarliy. I was thinking he coudl create enviromental hazards or something. Like his down special is him dodging a Thwomp or his up special is him (and any foes) being blasted upwards by a fan.

Kind of like Nathan Drake magiking a chest high wall from nowhere in PSASBR.

That'd work kinda nicely with a Wario's Woods reference actually if they(or we since it's hypothetical) didn't want a 100% Captain Toad Treasure Tracker moveset.

 

[Rasumii]

Updated my signature to include the Captain.

 

[Berserker.]

Not nessessarliy. I was thinking he coudl create enviromental hazards or something. Like his down special is him dodging a Thwomp or his up special is him (and any foes) being blasted upwards by a fan.

Kind of like Nathan Drake magiking a chest high wall from nowhere in PSASBR.

Did somebody say....

Nathan Drake? He's one of my favorite characters ever and Uncharted is one of my favorite franchises ever also

Anyway, that also sounds like a nifty and interesting idea

 

[Oracle_Summon]

Hey guys, according to this list, how would Captain Toad's moveset be classified? (hybrid classes are possible):

Zoner - Character whose strength lies in forcing their opponent to stay in a certain area. Ex:

Ranger - Character whose strength lies in their ranged attacks to force opponents to keep their distance. Ex:

Speedster - Character whose strength lies in their speed and ability to overwhelm their opponents with relentless attacks. Ex:

Trickster - Character whose strength lies in a quirky moveset that is hard to predict and can alter the battle field. Ex:

Bruiser - Character whose strength lies in devastating attacks to quickly finish off opponents. Ex:

Resistor - Character whose strength lies in super armor that allows them to tank hits to strike down opponents. Ex:

Puppeteer - Character whose strength lies in overwhelming opponents with relentless attacks stopping opponents from striking back. Strength in numbers. Ex:

Juggler - Character whose strength lies in being able to string combos together to finish off opponents. Ex:

 

[Zzuxon]

Hey guys, according to this list, how would Captain Toad's moveset be classified? (hybrid classes are possible):

Zoner - Character whose strength lies in forcing their opponent to stay in a certain area. Ex:

Ranger - Character whose strength lies in their ranged attacks to force opponents to keep their distance. Ex:

Speedster - Character whose strength lies in their speed and ability to overwhelm their opponents with relentless attacks. Ex:

Trickster - Character whose strength lies in a quirky moveset that is hard to predict and can alter the battle field. Ex:

Bruiser - Character whose strength lies in devastating attacks to quickly finish off opponents. Ex:

Resistor - Character whose strength lies in super armor that allows them to tank hits to strike down opponents. Ex:

Puppeteer - Character whose strength lies in overwhelming opponents with relentless attacks stopping opponents from striking back. Strength in numbers. Ex:

Juggler - Character whose strength lies in being able to string combos together to finish off opponents. Ex:

He'd be most akin to luigi or captain falcon.

 

[Oracle_Summon]

He'd be most akin to luigi or captain falcon.

Who would his toughest opponents be? Considerably:

 

[YoshiandToad]

Regarding the type of character Captain Toad is...he can oddly fit a few roles; without his backpack as a more typical Toad fighting style(see 3D World) he could be a speedster or rush down style fighter due to his superior speed and power. I saw Rush Down playstyles being mentioned a lot in the regular Toad thread which I guess is most similar to Bruiser on the list.

However; if we focus on his lack of a jump due to being weighed down by his backpack, he could easily have a more tanky playstyle that makes him difficult to throw or knock far similar to the Resistor.

Trickster could also work with him if he brought forth various weapons, or attacks from his backpack to fight with such as the pickaxe, some diamonds, turnips or the minecart all with similar start up animations making him less predictable...in the case of Captain Toad I guess it could be interesting to see a Resistor/Trickster playstyle for me personally.

Who would his toughest opponents be? Considerably:

Considering Captain Toad's less than inspiring jumping skills(especially with the backpack on) it's possible that rangers could very well be his greatest enemy; hypothetically he's very much an up and close fighter with poor recovery akin to Little Mac, and a character like Link could probably quite easily play keep him at a distance with ranged moves, rack up enough damage so he's easier to throw off and then make sure he cannot recover with a projectile or two.

Just my two cents. Interesting topic though; we really don't discuss potential playstyle archetypes enough on these forums.

I'm intrigued to see how many different playstyles we think as a group could actually work quite well for him.

 

[Berserker.]

[collapse="Updated ramblings"]Diamond collecting mechanics:
> Each diamond adds 3% damage to any attack that involves using the backpack
> It also increases your attack speed and dodge speed by a certain amount of 15%
> Maximum limit for containing diamonds is at 3
> While having at least one diamond, you walk as fast as Brawl Peach and dash as fast as Brawl Kirby
> While having no diamonds, you walk as fast as Brawl ZSS and dash as fast as Brawl Sheik
> Whether or not he has diamonds, his air mobility is still great. His falling speed by default is heavy
> Each diamond also weighs his falling speed down
> Each diamond also adds to the move's base knockback
> Can only be gained through mining while GROUNDED

-----------------------------

SPECIALS

Neutral B: Mine
> Adds 1 diamond to Toad's backpack
> While grounded, it does NOT damage
> Animation lingers as long as Ike's eruption
> In air, it deals 10% damage. Potent meteor smash

Forward B: Throw away
> Throws one diamond away which deals 18% damage
> Arc can be manipulated (Diagonal up/down or straight)
> Can do moderate shield damage
> Fast start-up

Hold Forward B: Empty
> Holding down forward B will make C.Toad empty his backpack. The disposed items act as projectiles
> Can do moderate shield damage
> Arc can be manipulated (Diagonal up/down or straight)
> All the diamonds still deal the same damage
> Somewhat slow start-up

Downward B: Wall pop-up
> Acts as a barrier
> Absorbs 25% damage
> As tall as Mario
> Can only summon 1 at a time

Upward B: Windmill platform (The ones where in you blow on the mic for it to move in SM3D World)
> High vertical, mediocre horizontal
> Deals 8% damage in 4 hits

-----------------------------

ATTACKS

(A) Turnip throw
- Throws a turnip which deals 8% damage
- Fairly spammable
- This is also Toad's attack when pressing A while in air
- The turnips are a bit floaty so it can last longer on stage

(Dash A) Mine cart
- Akin to Wario's bike except it's uncontrollable and you can only go at one direction
- Deals 9% damage
- Can absorb 15% damage. If the cart blows up (losing all its "health"), Toad receives 10% damage
- While dashing, you can press A to throw turnips which deals 8% damage each

(Forward A) Bag smack
- Smacks the target with your bag dealing a base damage of 11%.
- Has long range and high priority. Quick attack.
- Negligible knockback. It's only meant for for starting combos
- Diamond feint: Frontward direction hit

(Upward A) Headlamp intensify
- Aims headlamp upwards. Somewhat slow start up. Quick ending lag
- Deals no damage but it automatically stuns the target for 2 seconds
- Affects both grounded and air borne foes

(Down A) Coin pluck
- Plucks a leaf which releases a bunch coins from the ground
- Deals 9% damage in 3 hits. Quick attack. Can be reflected
- Was made to pop enemies up into the air.
- High hitsun
- Despite the sound of how the move functions, it's not really that much of a good anti-air. The coins occupy as much area as... let's say Toad's model and it pops up

right in front of him

(F-smash) Bag whip
- Whips the target with your bag dealing 15-23% damage. Long ranged attack. Slow start up
- High knockback
- Diamond feint: Frontward direction hit
- If you have at least one diamond in your bag, it can reflect projectiles
- If you have at least two diamonds in your bag, it deals high shield damage
- If you have at least three diamonds in your bag, it has some super armor

(U-smash) Chuck up
- Throws bag upward dealing 13-21% damage. Bag has no priority. Medium start up
- High knockback
- Diamond feint: Upward direction hit
- If you have at least one diamond in your bag, it can reflect projectiles
- If you have at least two diamonds in your bag, it deals high shield damage
- If you have at least three diamonds in your bag, it has some super armor

(D-smash) Power star spin
- Ties a green star on a rope and spins around dealing 12-20% damage. Medium priority. Quick start up
- Above average knockback
- Reflects projectiles

(N-air) Turnip throw
- Throws a turnip which deals 8% damage
- Fairly spammable
- This is also Toad's attack when pressing A while in air
- The turnips are a bit floaty so it can last longer on stage

(F-air) Pack spike
- Spikes the target with the backpack dealing a base damage of 11%
- Meteor smash. Relatively quick start up
- If you have at least one diamond in your bag, it can reflect projectiles
- If you have at least two diamonds in your bag, it deals high shield damage
- If you have at least three diamonds in your bag, it has some super armor

(B-air) Backward swing
- Swings pick axe backwards dealing 12% damage
- Very quick attack overall
- Mainly used as a combo stringer
- Hitting the opponent with the base of your pick axe will knock them away
- Hitting them with only the tip or "axe" part of the pickaxe has non-existent knockback but very high hitsun

(U-air) Whip up
- Similar to Marth/Lucina's except with a whip w/ a green star
- Deals 10% damage. Very long range. Juggle with it
- Minimal landing lag
- Covers a HUGE arc. Can also reflect projectiles

(D-air) Meteor Toad
- Dives downward dealing 14% damage. Relatively quick start up
- Meteor smash
- Similar to Sonic's dive kick or something like that

(Grab/Tether) Power star grapple
- Deals the same damage and functions similarly to Link's hookshot
[/collapse]
Blah. Bored. Bags suck. Too complicated

Edit: Updated

 

[Oracle_Summon]

Regarding the type of character Captain Toad is...he can oddly fit a few roles; without his backpack as a more typical Toad fighting style(see 3D World) he could be a speedster or rush down style fighter due to his superior speed and power. I saw Rush Down playstyles being mentioned a lot in the regular Toad thread which I guess is most similar to Bruiser on the list.

However; if we focus on his lack of a jump due to being weighed down by his backpack, he could easily have a more tanky playstyle that makes him difficult to throw or knock far similar to the Resistor.

Trickster could also work with him if he brought forth various weapons, or attacks from his backpack to fight with such as the pickaxe, some diamonds, turnips or the minecart all with similar start up animations making him less predictable...in the case of Captain Toad I guess it could be interesting to see a Resistor/Trickster playstyle for me personally.


Considering Captain Toad's less than inspiring jumping skills(especially with the backpack on) it's possible that rangers could very well be his greatest enemy; hypothetically he's very much an up and close fighter with poor recovery akin to Little Mac, and a character like Link could probably quite easily play keep him at a distance with ranged moves, rack up enough damage so he's easier to throw off and then make sure he cannot recover with a projectile or two.

Just my two cents. Interesting topic though; we really don't discuss potential playstyle archetypes enough on these forums.

I'm intrigued to see how many different playstyles we think as a group could actually work quite well for him.

Alright. But when you guys want to talk about potential matchups when playing as Captain Toad, let me know please.

 

[YoshiandToad]

Alright. But when you guys want to talk about potential matchups when playing as Captain Toad, let me know please.

No, no, you misunderstand me. I'm saying we don't do it as much as we should. It's a good topic, please continue.

 

[Oracle_Summon]

No, no, you misunderstand me. I'm saying we don't do it as much as we should. It's a good topic, please continue.

Alright. How would Captain Toad players deal with characters such as & ?

 

[Berserker.]

Alright. How would Captain Toad players deal with characters such as & ?

Depends on what moveset we're talking about. If we're talking about mine, use the wall (d-special) and... well, that's it. Just make sure it's between you and the Luma/Nana

I guess.

 

[Oracle_Summon]

Depends on what moveset we're talking about. If we're talking about mine, use the wall (d-special) and... well, that's it. Just make sure it's between you and the Luma/Nana

I guess.

How about dealing with characters that can keep a good distance like ?

 

[Berserker.]

How about dealing with characters that can keep a good distance like ?

Throw some turnips then mine cart your way through

Basically, that's the only thing you can do against campers. Options are limited

 

[Oracle_Summon]

Throw some turnips then mine cart your way through

Basically, that's the only thing you can do against campers. Options are limited

Characters that are up and personal with devastating attacks like ?

 

[Berserker.]

Characters that are up and personal with devastating attacks like ?

Toad's fine with that. He also does the same thing anyway

 

[Oracle_Summon]

Toad's fine with that. He also does the same thing anyway

What about characters that have Trickster type gameplay, being able to alter the battlefield with obstacles and such like ?

 

[YoshiandToad]

What about characters that have Trickster type gameplay, being able to alter the battlefield with obstacles and such like ?

Whilst Villager would be able to pocket the Turnips/Diamonds(/Minecart?) from Berserker's set, it sounds like CT's projectiles may overwhelm Villager due to the sheer volume of projectiles he could feasibly chuck at him, especially if Turnip is his neutral A.

Not sure how best to deal with Pitfall with Berserkers set, but Gyroid rocket could feasibly be blocked by that wall summon ability.

 

[FireTheWFT]

Captain Toad, I love his puzzles from 3D World, sign me up as a supporter!

 

[Propeller Toad]

I've been rather busy as of late; however, I just wanted to let you all know that I too am in full support of Captain Toad! :D

I did create a moveset and reasoning for him earlier on GameFAQs (yes, horrid choice I'm quite aware; however I tried).

http://www.gamefaqs.com/boards/633202-super-smash-bros-for-wii-u/69747732

"Time for adventure!"

 

[Arcadenik]

I feel that if this Ninka Kiwi leak is true, then it means that Bowser Jr. and Dr. Mario are in and Toad is not... how do my fellow Toad supporters feel if this happens?

Honestly, I'd be very disappointed but I would have Duck Hunt Dog to make me feel better about it... and we still have Captain Toad: Treasure Tracker to look forward to... we need to be more vocal about how much we want Toad in SSB5 and we need to let Nintendo how much we want to play as Toad in the main Mario games (just to keep him relevant/important and to give him more material to develop a moveset).

 

[GM_3826]

I find it a great idea that Captain Toad could expand on the Pikmin concept inherent in SSBM: The character is unlocked by using a Captain Toad Amiibo (Option #1) or buying a copy of Captain Toad: Treasure Tracker (Optiion #2), both within the Wii U version. However, he would effectively be considered an "extra" character to the Wii U roster, maybe implemented in the 3DS version as part of DLC, maybe not. Ever heard of version exclusive content? It's like that, except that it's meant to coincide with another release.
...Maybe this could help justify the Zelda series having 6 reps and Fire Emblem having 4 reps by giving Super Mario another one?
Either way, I can assure you that if this does happen, (Meaning the Zelda series getting 6 reps), Captain Toad will at the very least be released as DLC.

 

[YoshiandToad]

I feel that if this Ninka Kiwi leak is true, then it means that Bowser Jr. and Dr. Mario are in and Toad is not... how do my fellow Toad supporters feel if this happens?

Honestly, I'd be very disappointed but I would have Duck Hunt Dog to make me feel better about it... and we still have Captain Toad: Treasure Tracker to look forward to... we need to be more vocal about how much we want Toad in SSB5 and we need to let Nintendo how much we want to play as Toad in the main Mario games (just to keep him relevant/important and to give him more material to develop a moveset).

Bowser Jr. I'd dislike because I'm not a fan of his...but at least I can kick him in the teeth so there's something and he's at least somewhat deserving I guess?

Dr. Mario is my worst nightmare. An alt costume Sakurai seems to love putting as his own character slot.

And then today we have Paper Mario getting his own stage, and even Daisy getting slightly more support because of Lucina's alt situation...about the only Mario character that hasn't received a boost is Geno...and I mean c'mon; it's Geno. He's not exactly likely due to his one shot status and 3rd party licensing issues.

All us Captain Toad fans have going for us is Amiibo cross game compatibility...but I think it's still a viable straw to grasp.

Call my crazy, but the Amiibo cross platform thing really strikes me as Captain Toad is getting some kind of compatibility with Smash...I just don't know what. Let's hope for DLC at the least!

Also I think it's worth noting that Treasure Tracker seems to already be changing the minds of previous Toad detractors. Looks like he's going to have a far larger fanbase behind him for Smash 5 should he not be an Amiibo DLC individual like many suggested.

Also I don't know whether or not you saw the news on Captain Toad: Treasure Tracker but the price is going to be $40 for you United States lot. At that price I hope the North American Toad supporters will buy it.

Propeller Toad, I will add you shortly.