Roll Cancel Grabs

[B0NK]

@Leon Trotsky from the Lil Mac boards discovered this late last night.

Videos - https://gfycat.com/CreativeBitesizedHen

and

From a standing position, you can input Forward or Back -> R -> Z/L or A and do a boosting grab with rolls. You should see the flash from the roll animation. This is made possible because of the buffer system. (L is for 3DS).

This cannot be performed from a dash without letting the stick return to neutral like Boost Grab can, nor can it be done OoS as far as I know.

Lil Mac and Wario visually have the most drastic Roll Cancel Grab, their are probably plenty of characters with the same effect.

Some characters go farther then their dash grabs and boost grabs, some go the same. Go ahead and test it out!

 

[Leebee]

yoooooo that grab range. we Third Strike now.

good find!

 

[<π]

Reflex made a quick little video tutorial. He found out about it this morning.

 

[B0NK]

I'll add it to the OP, thanks.

 

[Camalange]

Is it invincible on start-up like a roll, or is it more similar to a glide-toss?

 

[THK]

No invincibility. It's more like a glide toss.

 

[Camalange]

No invincibility. It's more like a glide toss.

Thank god.

 

[Zexoor]

It's worth running the practice mode at 1/4 speed If you are new to this sort of stuff, made it easier to pick up for me anyways

 

[B0NK]

It can help you understand what's happening, yeah.

 

[Piefrenzy]

I'm a novice. Some one tell me why this is good

 

[RanserSSF4]

I've been testing this too and I can honestly say this will easily make Pivot/turn around cancel grabs way better as it does increase the range of throws. This will also make Little Mac's bad throw range really good now.

 

[B0NK]

I'm a novice. Some one tell me why this is good

Are you familiar with fighting games? It's like a kara canceled grab.

If you're not, it's basically a way to increase your grab range with no downsides.

I've been testing this too and I can honestly say this will easily make Pivot/turn around cancel grabs way better as it does increase the range of throws. This will also make Little Mac's bad throw range really good now.

His throw range isn't bad and you can't pivot this. You'll just get a standard pivot grab with a flash. It may make your pivot grab slightly faster though, I'd need to test more. #2lazy

 

[RanserSSF4]

Are you familiar with fighting games? It's like a kara canceled grab.

If you're not, it's basically a way to increase your grab range with no downsides.



His throw range isn't bad and you can't pivot this. You'll just get a standard pivot grab with a flash.

I see. I was testing that too and it seems that it does do what you said, but there were times my throw range got increased, but maybe I dashed the other direction really fast I didn't notice it.

 

[Zexoor]

Are you familiar with fighting games? It's like a kara canceled grab.

If you're not, it's basically a way to increase your grab range with no downsides.



His throw range isn't bad and you can't pivot this. You'll just get a standard pivot grab with a flash. It may make your pivot grab slightly faster though, I'd need to test more. #2lazy

Yeah but style points tho

 

[RanserSSF4]

I've done more testing. I think you can use this as a mix-up with IASA/Crouch Cancelling. Imagine this:

You go for a IASA/crouch cancel and go for a long range tilt move (Little Mac or Greninja's F-Tilt). Next time you do, you go for the roll cancel grab after your crouch cancel and since it does increase your throw range, you can create a lot of mix-ups, which will lead to more mix-ups/combo potential.

The timing is pretty hard, but after you get some practice, I think this will be a devastating tech!

 

[Piefrenzy]

Are you familiar with fighting games? It's like a kara canceled grab.

If you're not, it's basically a way to increase your grab range with no downsides.



His throw range isn't bad and you can't pivot this. You'll just get a standard pivot grab with a flash. It may make your pivot grab slightly faster though, I'd need to test more. #2lazy

I didn't know it increased his grab range. It just looked like a dash grab to me

 

[otter]

yoooooo that grab range. we Third Strike now.

good find!

odd choice considering roll canceling is literally a tech from capcom vs snk.

 

[B0NK]

I didn't know it increased his grab range. It just looked like a dash grab to me

It's a faster, longer range dash grab for some characters.

 

[The Real Gamer]

This is going to be a godsend for WFT.

 

[domino]

This seems pretty handy!

 

[KuroganeHammer]

This is a very nice thing. Doing it with Palutena atm and she makes her roll noise so you can tell easily when you've got it down to muscle memory.

 

[ChronoPenguin]

Rip Melee. We ATing up in here.

 

[SamuraiPanda]

This is an awesome finding! Sonic's is pretty big (first one I've tried). Breaking this down for why it works might help discover new things. I've also been able to back roll cancel grab as well as forward roll cancel grab.

 

[MegaGuy]

gr8 find dude! this will help me to become the greatest Wario of all time!!! q8^)

 

[Jellyfish4102]

This is cool. I wonder is this intentional?

 

[B0NK]

This is an awesome finding! Sonic's is pretty big (first one I've tried). Breaking this down for why it works might help discover new things. I've also been able to back roll cancel grab as well as forward roll cancel grab.

The input doesn't allow back roll, what you're doing is a turnaround forward roll cancel grabbed from a standing position. If I'm correct almost all "back roll" ones should look like they go slightly farther cause you're canceling into roll at a later frame.

Just think about the input. If you press back, then R, you turn around dash first before you roll.

 

[SamuraiPanda]

The input doesn't allow back roll, what you're doing is a turnaround forward roll cancel grabbed from a standing position. If I'm correct almost all "back roll" ones should look like they go slightly farther cause you're canceling into roll at a later frame.

Just think about the input. If you press back, then R, you turn around dash first before you roll.

You're right. Just confirmed it in 1/4th speed training mode that back roll does not have this property.

 

[Leebee]

odd choice considering roll canceling is literally a tech from capcom vs snk

that accomplishes something entirely different (giving invincibility to special moves). this is more like a kara throw than anything, which are ubiquitous in 3S.

 

[The Fail Tracer]

This button combination will take some getting used to for me.

I do think it really helps if you use the L grab button instead of A, so as not to accidentally use a smash attack instead of a grab.

I personally have L grab mapped to the jump button I don't use (Y in this case). So it's Side -> R -> Y for me.

 

[B0NK]

This button combination will take some getting used to for me.

I do think it really helps if you use the L grab button instead of A, so as not to accidentally use a smash attack instead of a grab.

I personally have L grab mapped to the jump button I don't use (Y in this case). So it's Side -> R -> Y for me.

I don't see why not, but the Grab button can still result in a Smash attack every so often. Honestly it's similar to any type of tech with multiple input options, it's just preference.

Also the way you have your buttons maps seems like the Y button would be easier on your hands, so that's good. Since I have it mapped to L, I prefer A since it hurts my hand less lmao. 3DS is not optimal for extended smash play :'(

that accomplishes something entirely different (giving invincibility to special moves). this is more like a kara throw than anything, which are ubiquitous in 3S.

And every other fighter ever.

 

[Tomo009]

I checked out some characters.

This is absolutely absurd for some characters.

For example Lil Mac as you said, but check out ZSS'

ZSS' combined with her tether length is absolutely absurd, it goes over 1/3 of FD, not far off 1/2 with the tether. It's pretty dumb. Her boost grab is also really long, but this is clearly longer.

I'm playing Sonic in this game and his also looks to be pretty good (clearly better than his boost grab) so I'm happy with the discovery, nice find.

 

[Xiao-Xiao]

I just want the Wii U version already man.

 

[B0NK]

k

 

[Gawain]

This is very similar to dash attack-cancelled grabbing. In fact it's almost the same in concept. Captain Falcon's dash attack grab goes like 1/3 across the stage, its nuts. His roll grab is about the same from what I can see.

 

[Signia]

So this means it's possible to dash one way, and roll cancel grab the other way right? Can't do that with a dash grab.

Also, does this mean it's possible to shieldgrab with a roll cancel grab? RIP spacing? :S

 

[Thinkaman]

So this means it's possible to dash one way, and roll cancel grab the other way right? Can't do that with a dash grab.

Also, does this mean it's possible to shieldgrab with a roll cancel grab? RIP spacing? :S

Nope to both. You can only do this out of an non-OoS forward roll.

 

[Praxis]

This is very similar to dash attack-cancelled grabbing. In fact it's almost the same in concept. Captain Falcon's dash attack grab goes like 1/3 across the stage, its nuts. His roll grab is about the same from what I can see.

Except that you can do this out of block, not just dash.

 

[Signia]

Nope to both. You can only do this out of an non-OoS forward roll.

I just saw it done out of a back roll on vgbc.

 

[Conda]

Awesome find, I'll try to make a video on my channel @ CobbsGames that more clearly demonstrates this.

Very useful tech for the characters who benefit from it.

Note that with some characters, the grab range is SHORTER. Greninja, for example, travels further with a normal dash grab, than with a roll-cancel grab.

 

[TimeSmash]

Wait so you just roll and then press A? I'm super tired and don't get what the OP is saying haha, forgive my idiocy.

Edit: Fun Fact
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