Pit's Better Half: Dark Pit General/Social Thread

[young grasshopper]

Because his entire characters exists essentially because of a pallete swap from Bawl. It's almost like a bad fanfic or something.. In fact I'm sure there were 'Dark Pit' fanfics before the new Kid Icarus was even shown.

Here's an analogy I like to make.. Pretend that Sakurai directed a new Starfox game. In this game, he introduced a new character, Dark Fox (based off of Fox's black color from Brawl) who plays a semi-minor role in the story. Then in the next Smash game, Sakurai adds Dark Fox onto the roster as a clone of Fox(pretend other Fox clones never existed). Like.. Would no one else find that to be stupid?

The whole situation just seems dumb to me. A 'dark' version of a character isn't exactly a horrible concept, but that isn't what bothers me. What bothers me is that if the Kid Icarus series was developed by anyone other than Sakurai, Dark Pit would practically have no chance of getting in. He's a character Sakurai would overlook and deemed 'too similar'.. But because Kid Icarus is a brainchild of Sakurai, he's yet again letting his bias show. I mean, look at other 'dark' characters.. Dark Link is a costume, despite holding much more significance in the Zelda series. In terms of moveset potential, look at the Dark Samus assist tropy. I'm saying this as someone who is typically against 'dark' versions of characters being added to the game.. I never was keen on Dark Samus being a playable character, but after seeing her ingame, she has some pretty awesome looking attacks. I think she could have been a cool addition.

Well anyway.. Done with my rant. Yeah, I just don't like how Sakurai can be so biased at times when he says he tries not to be.

If I made smash, the first characters that I would consider would be the characters that I made before (assuming that I worked on previous games), simply because those would be the characters that I understand and think about more often than with characters I had no part in making.

 

[Sahfarry]

If I'm being honest, I think Fox having TWO clones is a bit more silly than Pit having one. At least Dark Pit has a cool theme.

Well then it's a good thing that Fox never will have two clones. If anything, they're semi-clones. That's a term I hate to use because it's such a stupid technicality, but they at least they function totally differently (Toon Link should take some notes) and are not just a Fox "without a tipper" that I fear Dark Pit will be for Pit.

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

Of all 40+ characters to make clones, Sakurai chose Dr. Mario, Lucina and Dark Pit. The latter two are obviously pandering to the fanbases of both franchises. Both Lucina and Dark Pit have major impact on their games' storylines and are also popular characters according to polls, some of which conducted by Nintendo and others by Japanese magazines.

I agree on Lucina, but to think she's just merely promoted to a "modern vanilla" clone at best from an alternative costume, while Pittoo not only gets a spot, but seems to be a semi-clone or get even a fully unique moveset, tells me that he clearly favours KI with too much priority- for a series that is currently ambiguous on if it'll be carried on by him or other parts of Nintendo.

 

[LancerStaff]

I don't know for sure why DP got in over somebody else. It could be any number of reasons or people who wanted to see him separate. It could just be that he was the easiest to create some unique specials for. We have, what, ten sword wielding characters now? It's a heck of alot easier to make unique moves that don't involve swords then those that do. Lucina is more of a clone because she didn't have as much to work with. DP could wield any of 9 totally different weapon classes with 12 fairly unique weapons within those classes. Lucina's are all simple and fall into the "slash/stab to attack" category. And if I had to guess, Sakurai doesn't want to alter past clones as to not alienate the old players, even though most want significant changes.

 

[Maikou]

I dislike him because he should have been a palette swap, rather than his own character. If the leak is real (which it seems to be holding up as) and he is positioned on the roster as he was shown, he will undoubtedly be a clone that *ahem* "doesn't have a tipper", so to speak..

Speaking of palette swaps, what would Dark Pit's alt colours be?

Well then it's a good thing that Fox never will have two clones. If anything, they're semi-clones. That's a term I hate to use because it's such a stupid technicality, but they at least they function totally differently (Toon Link should take some notes) and are not just a Fox "without a tipper" that I fear Dark Pit will be for Pit.

Did you even play Kid Icarus Uprising, or even look up Dark Pit himself? KIU has more than enough weapons to make Dark Pit unique. The only "concern" one should have with Dark Pit is what his Final Smash will be.
Also,

These are from the second post on the thread.

I also need to mention how Link is being changed up. Toon Link may also be changed greatly. Ya never know, THE GAME ISN'T OUT YET.

 

[ItsRainingGravy]

Reposting this from the leak topic:

Gonna talk about Dark Pit for a bit, since quite a few people seem riled up about him.

This is the leaked image of him: http://i.imgur.com/uK8qQX4.jpg

Take a close look at that image. Do you see the yellow, boomerang-like object on his image? It is under his right ear, and above the "DA" of his name. Additionally, take note of the purple coloration below the yellow boomerang-like object. Where am I going with this, you might ask? Well, the object appears to be in 3D, but it is not a part of the character's outfit.

http://img3.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20120508012547/kidicarus/images/f/fb/Darkpit_artnew.png

So if it is not a part of his outfit, it could be his weapon right? For those of you who have played KI:U, you might be aware of the main weapons that Dark Pit uses. The most commonly associated weapons with Dark Pit are the Silver Bow, the Dark Pit Staff, and the Ogre Club. Let's take a look at each of them, shall we?

Silver Bow
http://img2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20120119205845/kidicarus/images/2/29/Nicw.PNG
http://media.archonia.com/images/samples/72/64/147264_s2.jpg
http://nendoroider.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/Figma-Kid-Icarus-Uprising-Black-Pit.jpg

The Silver Bow is Dark Pit's version of Pit's Palutena Bow. This is his most used weapon in KI:U, and the reason why most people speculate the reason for his status of being a clone to Pit. However, there are two problems with this. One, the Silver Bow does not have any yellow coloring in the design. And two, the shape of the weapon does not match the boomerang-like object in the leaked picture. So then, the likelyhood of the object in the leaked picture being the Silver Bow is very unlikely. So if it's not the Silver Bow, then what about the next weapon most associated with him? Heck, it even has his name on it.

Dark Pit Staff
http://fc03.deviantart.net/fs71/i/2012/123/4/9/dark_pit_staff_by_isaac77598-d4yghdn.jpg
http://img.amiami.jp/images/product/review/124//FIG-IPN-5604_02.jpg
https://31.media.tumblr.com/5a2fa58c918c0a3378e7517dbab9aac2/tumblr_inline_mzxpfmbt0U1s9zi46.jpg
https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2829/12562965194_9dd15d421e_z.jpg

Oddly enough, Dark Pit only used this weapon a single time in KI:U (in chapter 6), in comparison to the multiple times that he has used the Silver Bow. Regardless, this is one of the only two weapons in the game that directly mentions Dark Pit himself (the other being the Ogre Club). Furthermore, you might notice two things right off the bat. One, the yellow coloring of the wings and "head" of the weapon. And two, the purple coloring of the rest of the weapon. Not to mention, the shape on the wings sort of have a boomerang-like appearance to them. Meaning that the weapon that Dark Pit is holding in the leaked picture is, most likely, the Dark Pit Staff.

Ogre Club
http://img3.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20120528154435/kidicarus/images/2/23/Ogre_Club.jpg
http://www.kidicaruswiki.org/images/f/f8/Ogre_Club.png

As cool as it looks, nothing about the leaked image looks like it would point towards this weapon. Plus, there aren't really any images online showing Dark Pit with the weapon. So, we'll skip this one. But the images are there for those who are curious.


Anyways, what does this mean in regards to Dark Pit being next to the other "clones" on the CSS? Is he still a clone? How much of he would be cloned from Pit himself, if his weapon isn't similar to the Palutena Bow? Why yes, there are elements in which he could still be a "clone", as I shall go over right now.

1) Walking/Running Speed
2) Weight
3) Amount of jumps/jump height
4) Similar attacks/specials/throws

Number 4 on the list is probably what quite a few people believe, and why they might have problems with Dark Pit. Under the premise of Dark Pit having the Silver Bow, many people would be lead to believe that his entire moveset would be cloned from Pit. However, I do not believe that this is the case. Why? In the leaked image, Dark Pit is not holding the Silver Bow, but rather the Dark Pit Staff. Sure, he could very well still have the Silver Bow, but consider this: All characters who have a main weapon (usually sword) are usually holding that weapon in their picture. DeDeDe with his hammer, Link with his Master Sword and Hylian Shield, Robin with his/her Tomes and Levin Sword, and Pit with his Palutena Bow. So, wouldn't it also make sense that the weapon that Dark Pit is holding, The Dark Pit Staff, is his main weapon? Sure, he might have a few moves here and there that might be similar to Pit's (such as his specials), but otherwise I believe that his attacks are completely different in comparison to Pit's. So he would be more akin to Luigi in regards to his attacks. Special moves could still be almost identical to Pit's, though I really doubt his regular attacks would be the same with a completely different weapon.

In other words, he is not a clone of Pit in regards to (most) of his attacks. But rather, he is a clone of Pit due to having similar weight, running speed, and jumping ability in comparison to Pit (And maybe specials as well). At least, that is what I believe, anyways. Having almost the same model also counts too. And that actually matters quite a lot. Why? Because Dark Pit, Dr. Mario, and Lucina are probably the ONLY characters on the roster that were originally intended to be alternate costumes, hence their placement on the roster. And not DIRECTLY because they are "clones".

One last thing I would like to mention is that while Staffs are slower than Bows in KI:U, I don't think it might be the case here...probably. My reasoning behind this is Ike. Ike is very fast in Radiant Dawn, though he is slow in Brawl (and most likely Smash 4). So, Dark Pit could be slower than Pit, though they could also share the same speed as well. Who knows.
Anyways, I hope my post cleared some things up. Hope you enjoyed.

Dark Pit's placement on the leaked CSS might be because he was originally intended to be a pallete swap/alternate costume, and not necessarily because he might be a clone.

 

[Reila]

The sad thing is that people will complain if Pitoo is a clone and will complain just as much if he is an unique character.

 

[BluePikmin11]

The sad thing is that people will complain if Pitoo is a clone and will complain just as much if he is an unique character.

And then people will talk about he won't be removed because he has a pretty unique moveset like Wolf. Watch as it's a defensive excuse to keep Dark Pit in the next installment.

 

[Captain Norris]

Hello Pitoo fans! I don't know if this was brought up, but I noticed something about Dark Pit's render in this leak. I cannot post a link since I am not able to at the moment, but I am talking about the one where it shows the bottom screen of the CSS.
So, with his render, we know that he is holding the Dark Pit Staff, right? Well, in that same render, there is some sort of white clipping to the left of his hair. What is that? At first I thought it was his wings, but then I remembered that his wings were black. It couldn't be part of his staff either since it is much too high for it. Thoughts?

 

[Reila]

And then people will talk about he won't be removed because he has a pretty unique moveset like Wolf. Watch as it's a defensive excuse to keep Dark Pit in the next installment.

B-but Sakurai is so biased, he will most likely add Hades as a Ganondorf clone (cloneception) and Medusa as a Palutena clone (??) in the next installment.

 

[young grasshopper]

Hello Pitoo fans! I don't know if this was brought up, but I noticed something about Dark Pit's render in this leak. I cannot post a link since I am not able to at the moment, but I am talking about the one where it shows the bottom screen of the CSS.
So, with his render, we know that he is holding the Dark Pit Staff, right? Well, in that same render, there is some sort of white clipping to the left of his hair. What is that? At first I thought it was his wings, but then I remembered that his wings were black. It couldn't be part of his staff either since it is much too high for it. Thoughts?

hm, I didn't notice anything in the photo, but thanks for bring up something other than "blah blah, stupid clone blah blah, sakurai is biased, blah"

 

[Captain Norris]

hm, I didn't notice anything in the photo, but thanks for bring up something other than "blah blah, stupid clone blah blah, sakurai is biased, blah"

haha no problem! Here is a close up. I couldn't post links before: http://imgur.com/YlRoDx2
See that white triangle that appears to be cropped out? It looks like a feather, but it doesn't match any of Pit's feathers from his official render. Thoughts?

 

[Deleted member]

haha no problem! Here is a close up. I couldn't post links before: http://imgur.com/YlRoDx2
See that white triangle that appears to be cropped out? It looks like a feather, but it doesn't match any of Pit's feathers from his official render. Thoughts?

Part of the Silver Bow, maybe? Like he's holding the Silver Bow in one hand and the Dark Pit Staff in the other in his render?

 

[Sahfarry]

Did you even play Kid Icarus Uprising, or even look up Dark Pit himself? KIU has more than enough weapons to make Dark Pit unique. The only "concern" one should have with Dark Pit is what his Final Smash will be.
Also,

These are from the second post on the thread.

I also need to mention how Link is being changed up. Toon Link may also be changed greatly. Ya never know, THE GAME ISN'T OUT YET.

Will you chill out, man? You didnt understand a word I said, did you. I never said that Dark Pit didnt have potential. I just said that based on his placement next to thr other clones on the roster, that potential will be wasted. Reed mann.

In regards to Toon Link, I never said his Smash 4 iteration would be clonish. I just said that he should take notes so that hed be different in this version. You seriously need to learn a thing or two before you can start calling people stupid.

 

[SmashWolf]

Dark Pit's a clone here because he's literally a clone in Kid Icarus Uprising. However, because of the sheer variety in weaponry and powers in Kid Icarus Uprising, even a single weapon change can make these two play entirely different. I'm just afraid that Dark Pit's just going to be Pit but with the Silver Bow instead of the Palutena Bow. In which case...his inclusion wouldn't make a very big difference.

Though I'll take him over Duck Hunt dog and Dr. Mario anyday. I know alot of people will be angry because of his obvious visual resemblance to Pit, but there's a lot more to be gotten from him than just his looks.

 

[Number1MinunFan]

Well a fellow leak character just got revealed so its only appropriate that the others will be revealed soon or be found in-game

 

[PeanutProphet]

I don't know if you are aware of this or not, (if this has already been shown, delete this comment) but it is possible that some of the pictures in that leak with shulk could be fake. most notably, the dark pit picture

If you can't see why, look at the RANDOM. If you still can't see why, look at how the A overlaps the R. The roster pic could still be true, and he could still be in the game, but this picture has definitely been edited.

 

[Wintropy]

I'm just happy for the people who actually wanted Dark Pit to show up. I'll withhold judgement until the final release, but I think he's got potential.

I don't know if you are aware of this or not, (if this has already been shown, delete this comment) but it is possible that some of the pictures in that leak with shulk could be fake. most notably, the dark pit picture

[PICTURE]

If you can't see why, look at the RANDOM. If you still can't see why, look at how the A overlaps the R. The roster pic could still be true, and he could still be in the game, but this picture has definitely been edited.

Colour bleeding / shoddy camera work? I can't say, I'm not even remotely tech-savvy in that sense. I'd say that the roster selection is pretty much sound; the actual images and videos have a lot of small - though not insignificant - details that raise more than a few questions.

 

[Brother AJ]

No idea what to expect from this guy, but I'm always happy for new villains I'll tell you that.

 

[dezeray112]

Do you guys think Dark Pit will have a similar Final Smash like Pit or something different?

 

[Frostwraith]

No idea what to expect from this guy, but I'm always happy for new villains I'll tell you that.

I don't know if you have played Kid Icarus: Uprising, but

Spoiler: Kid Icarus: Uprising spoilers

contrary to most "evil twin" characters, Dark Pit is more of an anti-hero that does whatever he wants. He sometimes helps Pit when they have similar goals, but at the same time he wants to defeat Pit. After some character development, he eventually sides with Pit for the rest of the game.

Do you guys think Dark Pit will have a similar Final Smash like Pit or something different?

He could either use Pandora's power combined with the Silver Bow to achieve something similar to Pit's Final Smash, but he could also do something entirely different, like using the Lightning Chariot to strike down opponents.

 

[_Darkpit_]

Do you guys think Dark Pit will have a similar Final Smash like Pit or something different?

I think he will get another final smash because Pit is the only one character, who is allowed to use the three sacred treasures.

Another option could be the great sacred treasure ( without final strike ) like the Landmasters.
But I think it will not happen because the same reason like the 3 sacred treasures. He will get another final smash... and I hope its a power like trade-off. It could be a power because Palutena also uses powers ( black whole and Megalaser ).

It would be nice if Darkpits weapons would have some modifications like to dodge.

I hope Sakurai will not give up the Kid Icarus franchise... I'm afraid if he will not continue to help Kid Icarus, the series COULD have diffecaulties to be more popular. Sakurai is the only one who made Kid Icarus so unique. ( And of course his team... Project Sora ... But he is the main director and developer as you know. )


Nintendo mustn't give up Kid Icarus. In the offical Nintendo side the text says about Kid Icarus: '' Some 25 years after the original Kid Icarus™ game for NES™ captured the hearts and imaginations of gamers worldwide ''. I think in the japanese side and another countries side, there is the similiar text. That means Kid Icarus is NOT a little franchise. And I believe in Kid Icarus <3.

 

[Brother AJ]

I don't know if you have played Kid Icarus: Uprising, but

Spoiler: Kid Icarus: Uprising spoilers

contrary to most "evil twin" characters, Dark Pit is more of an anti-hero that does whatever he wants. He sometimes helps Pit when they have similar goals, but at the same time he wants to defeat Pit. After some character development, he eventually sides with Pit for the rest of the game.

I have not, but I'm hoping that a KI game will be released for the Wii U. This is the only system I have, and it's going to stay that way for a long time unless I start to spontaneously crap gold. Could be any day now.

Spoiler: Kid Icarus: Uprising spoilers

Anti-hero? Even better. I say I want more villains, but what I mean by that is that I desire a wider variety of personalities amongst the playable cast. Anti-heroes as well as anti-villains are especially interesting to me due to their ambiguity and tendency to come across as more layered than your average Nintendo protagonist or antagonist.

 

[MajorMajora]

I don't know if you have played Kid Icarus: Uprising, but

Spoiler: Kid Icarus: Uprising spoilers

contrary to most "evil twin" characters, Dark Pit is more of an anti-hero that does whatever he wants. He sometimes helps Pit when they have similar goals, but at the same time he wants to defeat Pit. After some character development, he eventually sides with Pit for the rest of the game.

He could either use Pandora's power combined with the Silver Bow to achieve something similar to Pit's Final Smash, but he could also do something entirely different, like using the Lightning Chariot to strike down opponents.

Oooh, I like the lightning chariot, good final smash.

 

[_Darkpit_]

I have not, but I'm hoping that a KI game will be released for the Wii U. This is the only system I have, and it's going to stay that way for a long time unless I start to spontaneously crap gold. Could be any day now.

Spoiler: Kid Icarus: Uprising spoilers

Anti-hero? Even better. I say I want more villains, but what I mean by that is that I desire a wider variety of personalities amongst the playable cast. Anti-heroes as well as anti-villains are especially interesting to me due to their ambiguity and tendency to come across as more layered than your average Nintendo protagonist or antagonist.

A Kid Icarus game for Wii U would be sooo... amazing <3

Maybe Kid Icarus would be bigger like never before if it released for Wii U. Many gamers prefer TV console instead of an handheld console. ^^

 

[Reila]

A new Kid Icarus game should be released for the 3DS again (though a port of Uprising for the Wii U wouldn't be bad).

 

[Wintropy]

I'd like to see how they'd carry on the story. Hades is still ostensibly floating around somewhere and goodness knows there's a whole mythos worth of deities and daemons waiting to be unleashed.

 

[IceBreakerXY]

A new kid icarus game would be amazing just don't know what they could do to top the last game.Then again it's sakurai

 

[_Darkpit_]

I want to know the answers about mysterious questions for example:

Which releationship have Magnus and Gaol?

Or who is the Icarus character in the game? Pit ask for him to Palutena before the tutorial starts.

 

[young grasshopper]

I want to know the answers about mysterious questions for example:

Which releationship have Magnus and Gaol?

Or who is the Icarus character in the game? Pit ask for him to Palutena before the tutorial starts.

icarus is dead because he flew too close to the sun, that is why palutena needs pit

 

[_Darkpit_]

icarus is dead because he flew too close to the sun, that is why palutena needs pit

That sounds logically but do you have a source?... I mean its a fictive game and Palutena said like: '' That is not important. We concentrate at first on you... '' She didn't say more details.

 

[_Darkpit_]

That sounds logically, but do you have a source? Palutena said like: '' Thats not important. We concentrate at first only on you. '' She didn't say more details.


Okay back to topic:

Except that Pit is the only one who is allowed to use the Great Sacred Treasure and the Three Sacred Treasure there is another possible evidence why Darkpit will have his own final smash.

It looks like Lucinas final smash.

http://www.smashbros.com/images/character/lucina/screen-7.jpg

As you know Lucina is a clone of Marth. Okay Toon-Link has the same one like Link. But this is because of the story. And Darkpit is the easiest character to create his own moveset ( and finalsmash ). Its very likely that we are correct about this. ^^

 

[Wintropy]

I want to know the answers about mysterious questions for example:

Which releationship have Magnus and Gaol?

If I recall correctly, they were mercenary partners some time in the past. Magus's child died in unspecified circumstances, which probably led to a breakdown in affection between the two. After an implicit falling out, Gaol's heart was tempted by the Underworld Army and she was corrupted into serving them. Pit and Magnus's timely intervention breaks the curse on her spirit and restores her to her proper senses. They're on pretty good terms when you fight them later on and they seem to have sound synergy with one-another, so I'm just gonna go ahead and say that they're friends like they were in the far-off past.

Or who is the Icarus character in the game? Pit ask for him to Palutena before the tutorial starts.

I'm pretty sure that's just a throwaway gag. The dialogue has a lot of silly and irreverent jokes thrown in, like the reference to Komaytos resembling Metroids or Virid chastising Pit for mentioning the loading screens.

As for the Final Smash, it's too early to tell just yet if Lucina's is any different to Marth's. It looks distinct, how and ever, and I'd like to think she gets something new and exciting. There's no reason why Dark Pit shouldn't be the same, I dare say.

 

[LunchPolice]

However, after Shulk, he's probably going to be second amiibo I buy. Assuming I buy an amiibo, that is. I'm not sure I want to own an almost useless piece of plastic, but we'll see.

Hey, you bought a Wii U didn't you?

 

[_Darkpit_]

If I recall correctly, they were mercenary partners some time in the past. Magus's child died in unspecified circumstances, which probably led to a breakdown in affection between the two. After an implicit falling out, Gaol's heart was tempted by the Underworld Army and she was corrupted into serving them. Pit and Magnus's timely intervention breaks the curse on her spirit and restores her to her proper senses. They're on pretty good terms when you fight them later on and they seem to have sound synergy with one-another, so I'm just gonna go ahead and say that they're friends like they were in the far-off past.



I'm pretty sure that's just a throwaway gag. The dialogue has a lot of silly and irreverent jokes thrown in, like the reference to Komaytos resembling Metroids or Virid chastising Pit for mentioning the loading screens.

As for the Final Smash, it's too early to tell just yet if Lucina's is any different to Marth's. It looks distinct, how and ever, and I'd like to think she gets something new and exciting. There's no reason why Dark Pit shoutldn't be the same, I dare say.

Quite possible. It could be also an innuendo for a sequel thereby another developer have possible ideas to develope a sequel. ^^

 

[Misti]

I think Dark Pit will be heavier and more powerful than Pit. Also, the side-b could include the Ogre Club or the First Blade instead the Upperdash Arm.

 

[_Darkpit_]

I think Dark Pit will be heavier and more powerful than Pit. Also, the side-b could include the Ogre Club or the First Blade instead the Upperdash Arm.

I hope you are right. It would be really nice. ^^

 

[BluePikmin11]

Doesn't the staff make Pit slower? I think I recall of that when I played KI:U.

 

[Camc10]

Honestly, if Dark Pit is a last minute clone, he probably will just take Pit's moveset with some new properties.

 

[Wintropy]

Doesn't the staff make Pit slower? I think I recall of that when I played KI:U.

It trades off speed and reflexes for range and power. I could see Dark Pit fighting like that in Smash, taking advantage of his range and marksmanship rather than being a fast or agile fighter. It'd suit his personality, too, since he's inherently more cool-headed and merciless than the carefree, gung-ho Pit.