Official SWF Tier List v8

[Z'zgashi]

Imo, either place Sheik and Zelda separately, or just use Sheilda as both, having Sheik/Zelda AND Sheilda is just dumb and doesnt make sense. Either combine them or separate them, dont do both otherwise it contradicts itself. If Zelda's best option in a MU is to switch to Sheik, either combine the two and base the MU off the duo's best option, Sheik, or keep them separate and acknowledge that Sheik has a separate MU that is better. Saying Sheilda does better than Zelda/Sheik makes no sense since it IS them, just rated with different credentials. Just because these 2 characters have the unique ability to switch between each other at will, it shouldnt mean it makes either of their match ups any different, it just means you have the unique option to switch into a different MU mid game. Just pick one way to rate them and stick with it. I could go on about more reasons why I think it's dumb, but its too late and I honestly just dont feel like ranting about it.

 

[Man Li Gi]

The Japanese condense Sheilda as one character.

 

[Z'zgashi]

I dont care if we use Sheilda or use Sheik and Zelda, I just dont think we should use all 3 at the same time.

 

[infiniteV115]

Only reason we use all 3 at the same time is because there's only one person on this continent that plays Sheilda. Everybody else either plays Sheik alone or Zelda alone lol

 

[ぱみゅ]

Kind of reminds me a certain page 1 conversation....

Sheilda is a pain, the character exists, and has potential to be better than Sheik or Zelda alone, but Ed is the only one using it, so the character does not impact the metagame, but Ed does.

Instead of Sheilda we could add Ed two spots above Sheik.

I was actually talking with ED about this at the last tournament I saw him at in Miami. I think since hes the only current shielda that is making an impact in the metagame we should just ditch the shielda icon and replace it with happy happy ED face. Maybe with his hat to???????????????!!! hype.

I am so for this! Lets make it happen!!!

 

[Shiny Mewtwo aka Jigglysir]

Kind of reminds me a certain page 1 conversation....

Can we put Reflex's face in place of Pokemon Trainer too?

 

[ぱみゅ]

There have been several Pokémon Trainers (Mjollnir, T-block, Coontail...)

They probably don't play anymore, but still......

 

[Shiny Mewtwo aka Jigglysir]

There have been several Pokémon Trainers (Mjollnir, T-block, Coontail...)

They probably don't play anymore, but still......

Reflex will be Red and those 3 can be Squirtle, Ivysaur and Charizard.

 

[#HBC | Scary]

Yay! The Sheilda conversation is back. Super endangered species since forever ago!!! I know that Japan has her considered as one, but do they actually do it?

 

[Z'zgashi]

Yes, all of their lists have Zelda and Sheik as one.

And regardless, even if Ed is the only Sheilda main, my opinion is still this:

Saying Sheilda does better than Zelda/Sheik makes no sense since it IS them, just rated with different credentials. Just because these 2 characters have the unique ability to switch between each other at will, it shouldnt mean it makes either of their match ups any different, it just means you have the unique option to switch into a different MU mid game.

 

[infiniteV115]

Yeah I'm not saying Zelda and Sheik should have their own individual placements on the tier list, I was trying to explain why they did. I, too, think we should just have Sheilda on the list

 

[Man Li Gi]

While I do see why the Japanese and many people want Sheilda as one char, I have friends who main only Sheik and main only Zelda (Riot comes to mind). Throwing them in as if they play with the same playstyle is wrong, but who really cares?

 

[Z'zgashi]

I really dont care, I just dont think all 3 should be listed, just go with either Sheilda or Zelda/Sheik.

 

[PKBeam]

Does anyone call the combination Zheik?

 

[#HBC | Scary]

Nope.

Not at all.

 

[#HBC | Scary]

Double post.

I actually don't mind them separate. Like all of you have said, people will typically only play one or the other and they should be respected as such, not just arbitrarily lumped together just because the characters are one entity. This is why we discussed planting my face on the tier list :D.

/pipedream

 

[SSBBDaisy]

what mus would u use shielda in?

 

[PKBeam]

If you main Zelda then you use Shielda for everything.
If you main Shiek then you use Shielda for KOing, Pikachu and almost nothing else.
If you don't main either you probably shouldn't be going Shielda at all.

Double post.

I actually don't mind them separate. Like all of you have said, people will typically only play one or the other and they should be respected as such, not just arbitrarily lumped together just because the characters are one entity. This is why we discussed planting my face on the tier list :D.

/pipedream

Isn't that why there is no Samus+ZSS or whatever on the tier list

 

[Luco]

Samus + ZSS is impractical to change between in normal games. Poke trainer isn't split because a change happens automatically when you die and fatigue = probably wanna change at some point to KO.

 

[#HBC | Scary]

If you main Zelda then you use Shielda for everything.
If you main Shiek then you use Shielda for KOing, Pikachu and almost nothing else.
If you don't main either you probably shouldn't be going Shielda at all.

Isn't that why there is no Samus+ZSS or whatever on the tier list

It isn't as clear cut as that.

There is no pairing of ZSS/Samus because smash balls are not legal, so once you become ZSS, there is NO going back.

For PT. Fatigue is a giant issue. Otherwise people could decide to solo a Pokemon. We understand that to be impossible without consequence.

This isn't the case for Zelda and Sheik. You can decide to be one or the other, completely solo, and not have the consequence of fatigue. For that alone, they deserve separate slots.

 

[#HBC | Scary]

what mus would u use shielda in?

Truthfully any, but I definitely do it against Snake, Rob, DDD, Diddy, Yoshi, & Lucario I think. Probably missing a few.

Multiquote button how I miss thee; I always forget I can on the current format.

 

[NickRiddle]

Just hit "Reply" for everybody you want to quote.

 

[#HBC | Scary]

Just hit "Reply" for everybody you want to quote.

I know, just forgot since I was doing it from my phone at the time.

 

[Gardex]

Quiksilver breaks the CP system with his Samus/ZSS, it's quite a fun thing to witness.

Like, he'll lose to Snake with ZSS, counterpick Samus and win, then he'll stay Samus as his opponent switches to MK for a free win.
One second into the match and he has switched to ZSS and takes the ez win vs Pocket Knight.

I also support having Ed's face replacing Sheilda

 

[#HBC | Scary]

That's awesome!! Good job Quik. Peeps gotta do their hw against him from now on lmao.

Thanks Gardex!!!

 

[infiniteV115]

Yeah Quik went 1-1 with Bizkit's Snake at Apex 2013 then game 3 he went Samus and 2 stocked him

 

[Shaya]

Samus vs Snake is incredibly lame, truly requires actually knowing the match up. *shock* *horror*

*crouch*

 

[Gardex]

I've never actually seen Quik lose that matchup. He even took out Ally's Snake in a moneymatch

 

[Z'zgashi]

Well to be fair, is IS Samus, not like anybody actually knows that match up lol.

 

[Man Li Gi]

Well to be fair, is IS Samus, not like anybody actually knows that match up lol.

Is IS? Anyway, Zamus MU pretty much is rush her and avoid the Screwattack (reminiscent of the Melee incarnation, but this time, she can't kill). I know the spacies beat her easy. Snake should also beat her with ease....

 

[Grim Tuesday]

spacies have shine....

 

[socandrewcer]

Ike for SSS tier https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h5825Wu0WjA

 

[Man Li Gi]

Ike for SSS tier https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h5825Wu0WjA

But nothing can stop Ganon. Anyway, yeah Zamus is not to hard of an MU to face up against and there's plenty of time to adapt as Zamus goes in a pattern and/or have a hard time killing so you can adapt from that. Even I tried to be a Smaus main, but she couldn't kill so I dropped her.

 

[infiniteV115]

Why are you calling Samus Zamus. Zamus is supposed to be one of the (stupid) ways to refer to Zero Suit Samus

 

[Man Li Gi]

Why are you calling Samus Zamus. Zamus is supposed to be one of the (stupid) ways to refer to Zero Suit Samus

I wasn't though. Zamus (z-air Samus).

 

[Z'zgashi]

No, Zamus has always meant Zero Suit Samus. Whoever told you that is just straight up wrong.

 

[Man Li Gi]

No, Zamus has always meant Zero Suit Samus. Whoever told you that is just straight up wrong.

I never call Samus as calling ZSS since that almost implies you start the match with Samus then change to ZSS ALL the time. Zamus seems like an appropriate name as all Brawl Samus mains use Zair to death. I don't care if most (actually only a few scrubs) people use it to refer to ZSS, I use it to refer to her main playstyle.

 

[Z'zgashi]

Well youre the only one Ive personally ever seen who uses it that way and all its achieving is confusing people and making them think you have no idea what youre talking about.

But by all means, if you want to use it that way, go ahead.

 

[Shaya]

People would call that Zairmus (which I've maybe heard somewhere along the way during all my travels, maybe). Zamus is definitely zero suit samus.

 

[Man Li Gi]

Truth be told, never heard anyone use the term Zamus to refer to ZSS. I referred to ZSS as ZSS earlier on this thread yet as soon as the Zamus term is thrown out, people are now confused. You people must get easily confused.