Not a Tier List: Montage's Character ratings: New Info: Meta, Sonic, Snake, Lucario

[soulz]

Ahh boo. Is IC's THAT bad?
Maybe they need a bit of figuring out
But are they strong enough to survive and well be on equal terms with the others?

 

[Vividice]

Great thread dmbrandon!

As far as I can say without having the game, I agree to most of your ratings in general.

But I have some questions about some characters and your ratings.

1.) Pit 9/10 I agree for sure that Pit is good.
But wouldn't you say that Pit lacks good ko moves?
And has Pit problemes to connect with his moves? On many videos it seems like its hard to hit the enemy with many attacks.

2.) Wolf 9.5/10
Has wolf got any ko moves?
On most videos again it seemed like Wolf wouldn't be able to ko anyone reliable even if the enemy% are quite high.

3.) Diddy looks good but 10/10?
You say he is strong: Which attacks are strong?
How is his ko ability?

4.) R.O.B.
How are his smashes? To slow? Which of his moves are strong enough to ko?

5.) Ike
Many people criticize Ike as to slow you not :D
Are some of his attacks quick enough to connect reliable? Or is the impression of to slow false in general?

6.) Samus is my SSBM Main but she was definitely not 8/10 in Melee.
Would you say compared to the whole cast she is buffed (Melee Samus vs Brawl Samus)

My impression is that she is nerfed in many ways.
-Weaker charge beam! (in ssbm it was a great ko move)
-It's harder to hit with missles, and the knockback is heavily reduced.
-Samus Jump/Return abilitity was good in ssbm in ssbb it's only avarage compared to the whole cast
-FSmash is weaker
-Airial combat suffers from nerfed Nair

Summarized: Samus range combat is nerfed quite bad and her ko moves are weaker.
Improvements? I see none.

I wish she would be better than in melee but I don't see any buffs...



Thanks a lot!

 

[SuperLink9]

I can't believe the amount of flaming on this thread.

Can people not understand that these are his opinions?

In any case, I'm glad Yoshi's score went up a bit... heh, this kind of thing is all I have until the EU release in 4 months

 

[sHy)(gUy]

thanks for the info.

i'kind of expect mario to be a 5, he is supposed to be the average character. Thats the rating i would give him melee, but that didnt stop me from using him and winning with him(best mario in LA and ive won a few tournies) and i intend to do the same in brawl, looking forwrd to playing u online when i get the game....

also diiddy is going to be crazy with those banana peels, im definitly going to put in alot of work with

as for marth bleh, hes still my enemy in tnis game. Im glad hes good or better though

 

[5@/\/\U5]

great freakin read!

I'm delighted that it seems like 14-15 characters seem as though they could compete for top tier this time around! hoorah!

also glad that Snake has serious potential. I'll be curious to give him a go, as well as Olimar, Wolf, Diddy, Sonic, Samus (old main), and Toon Link.

man this is gonna be a long f*%kin month

 

[Big Burn]

subscribed....

 

[demondude]

lol he overated pit alot XD

No he didn't.

 

[chimpxstyle]

These are impressions people. Our opinions on the characters potential. Every character is playable is some way except Yoshi really. Some just require more work, practice, and mind games than others. Mario isn't terrible, just in comparison with the rest of the cast, we don't think much of him. This is an opinion. This is not written in stone. Chill the **** out people. If you cannot handle people's opinions, maybe you should log off the internet and go read a phone book or a dictionary for fun.

 

[Drake3]

Oh god, it's like she's a character now.

Well. I guess that's a good thing >_>. Maybe it's because Sakurai decided to give her a third lightning kick.

 

[ph00tbag]

6.) Samus is my SSBM Main but she was definitely not 8/10 in Melee.
Would you say compared to the whole cast she is buffed (Melee Samus vs Brawl Samus)

My impression is that she is nerfed in many ways.
-Weaker charge beam! (in ssbm it was a great ko move)
-It's harder to hit with missles, and the knockback is heavily reduced.
-Samus Jump/Return abilitity was good in ssbm in ssbb it's only avarage compared to the whole cast
-FSmash is weaker
-Airial combat suffers from nerfed Nair

Summarized: Samus range combat is nerfed quite bad and her ko moves are weaker.
Improvements? I see none.

I wish she would be better than in melee but I don't see any buffs...

Wait, Samus ever had KO moves?

I think Diem, you're going to see a lot of disagreements from Samus mains here, because Samus' range game has been nerfed pretty badly, and she relies on it for a lot of her set ups. Fair and Uair are fairly useless without missiles, and most characters can just duck under canceled missiles now. Her nair, which was her most ubiquitous aerial, has been nerfed. Now her approach seems limited to JBT'd bairs, because that's her only move with any KO potential.

I think you should switch her with Zamus. From what I've seen, Zamus has a lot of powerful moves, decent combo ability, and and a third jump, all things that you've said she doesn't have. Care to enlighten me as to why you see things this way?

 

[GameAngel64]

I'm glad that Zelda has improved. I'm hoping it won't be long before I'm able to consistently sweetspot her pickier lightning kick.

 

[Milos]

I'm glad that Zelda has improved. I'm hoping it won't be long before I'm able to consistently sweetspot her pickier lightning kick.

Hi I think you know my friend, he used to ask you for zelda advice over youtube and smashboards. flame_overlord?

 

[eggs-on-toast]

Hey thanks for the ifo but it appears that all the people i like and will probaly use most suck, except DeDeDe, oh and Diddy but im not sure now since most people will use him and i have a weird thing about that. But just one question, Is everyone playable at least?

 

[Fletch]

Excellent read, can't wait to get a copy now, although it'd be nice to get impressions from the characters you didn't talk about.

 

[dmbrandon]

Thanks for all the feed back.

Although GimpyFish is an awesome player, It's hard to listen to his advice on a gam he played for a total of an hour, while I have almost 40.

Mario's score is staying the same until I see it should go up. We're testing him now.

 

[fazares]

Thanks for all the feed back.

Although GimpyFish is an awesome player, It's hard to listen to his advice on a gam he played for a total of an hour, while I have almost 40.

Mario's score is staying the same until I see it should go up. We're testing him now.

itsnt the fact he just played an hour but the list of changes that he noticed while doing so that makes mario better than his melee counterpart...anyway....i....,just like u, will get the game soon so i will test for myself...

 

[Finch]

Ok I have a tier list that will satisfy everyone:

All characters: 10/10

stop being scrubs. Yoshi has been and will be a ****ty character for obvious reasons. And his list isn't based on equal playtime of all characters so just accept a bias rather than getting angry about it. No one else is doing this so I appreciate it greatly.

 

[fazares]

of course no one else is doing this but pros will....btw...when i get the game i ll post my mario impressions on the mario forums.....
i m just relieved that this isnt a tier list but just some random opinion of characters based on personal preference and usage....

 

[KeyKid19]

Sounds like Falcon got trashed in Brawl. At least all of the new characters seem quite interesting. Even R.O.B. sounds pretty cool.

 

[BrianM]

I really hate your input on Zamus, it doesn't seem to have been given much thought at all.

 

[GameAngel64]

Hi I think you know my friend, he used to ask you for zelda advice over youtube and smashboards. flame_overlord?

Yes sir, I do believe that name sounds familiar.

 

[iron blade]

Cool. Finally some reviews that aren't biased and just give facts. I've seen Dmbrandon's Pit video. Finally someone who uses him right. He wouldn't happen to have any more, would he? Also, the Mario review surprised me. He's always been pretty balanced.

 

[BrianM]

Technically, 5/10 is middle/average.

 

[fazares]

u shouldnt give him so much credit about mario rating....wait for someone that know how tu use him(pretty rare from the numerous nicovideo or youtube vids)
i ll be giving some advice when i get the game...in the mario subforum

 

[Neemo]

Dmbrandon, the thread Creator
I give you a 10/10 for this highly entertaining piece.

 

[fazares]

^^^are u sarcastic...???
btw 5/10 isnt the problem....he said mario was downgraded when a pro nicknamed gimpyfish gave a list of many changes that makes him better...not worse....ahaha
i ve played mario for long time and the changes made to him are for the better...trust me...this guy would place mario as a low tier in ssbm

 

[Vividice]

Wait, Samus ever had KO moves?

I think Diem, you're going to see a lot of disagreements from Samus mains here, because Samus' range game has been nerfed pretty badly, and she relies on it for a lot of her set ups. Fair and Uair are fairly useless without missiles, and most characters can just duck under canceled missiles now. Her nair, which was her most ubiquitous aerial, has been nerfed. Now her approach seems limited to JBT'd bairs, because that's her only move with any KO potential.

I think you should switch her with Zamus. From what I've seen, Zamus has a lot of powerful moves, decent combo ability, and and a third jump, all things that you've said she doesn't have. Care to enlighten me as to why you see things this way?

@phootbag

I first thought "what do you mean with Diem?" until I noticed you mean the crewmember of the OP :D

But is the part about switching to Zamus directed at me?
If so: I thught about it but im not sure. Zamus is nice but its not my Samus in the shiny Suit and not the range combat queen i loved....


@critique about my posting (if any was directed at me)
It's clear for me that these are his opinions but I just wanted to understand them.
If he just says yoshi 1/10 diddy 10/10 then it helps no one.
But he didn't just told as his ratings, he also tried to back them up with reason/explanations.

But on some chars those explanations where not enough to understand his rating.
I would like to understand his ratings and I don't want to change them or anything else.
This is no critique in any way about dmbrandons posting. It's great and I hope everyone appreciates his work.

I hope you will answer any of my questions dmbrandon.

 

[dmbrandon]

1.) Pit 9/10 I agree for sure that Pit is good.
But wouldn't you say that Pit lacks good ko moves?
And has Pit problemes to connect with his moves? On many videos it seems like its hard to hit the enemy with many attacks.

It's true, he does lack KO. His moves that do, however, do well. This, combined with multiple backairs off the stage, can kill at low percents.

2.) Wolf 9.5/10
Has wolf got any ko moves?
On most videos again it seemed like Wolf wouldn't be able to ko anyone reliable even if the enemy% are quite high.

Fsmash, D smash, Shine, Bair, SideB. He's a monster.

3.) Diddy looks good but 10/10?
You say he is strong: Which attacks are strong?
How is his ko ability?

Diddy has three usable spikes. His banana game can chain people into almost any attack. He has the peanut gun for off the level edge guarding. His moves has NASTY priority, and speed. All smashes KO.

4.) R.O.B.
How are his smashes? To slow? Which of his moves are strong enough to ko?

Good. All of them. lolz

5.) Ike
Many people criticize Ike as to slow you not :D
Are some of his attacks quick enough to connect reliable? Or is the impression of to slow false in general?

http://youtube.com/watch?v=siMtxG5SJss

6.) Samus is my SSBM Main but she was definitely not 8/10 in Melee.
Would you say compared to the whole cast she is buffed (Melee Samus vs Brawl Samus)

While she has been slightly nerfed, the game has slowed down, while she has not. He pace is more than enough to keep up with the spacies, without being Wes.

My impression is that she is nerfed in many ways.
-Weaker charge beam! (in ssbm it was a great ko move)
-It's harder to hit with missles, and the knockback is heavily reduced.
-Samus Jump/Return abilitity was good in ssbm in ssbb it's only avarage compared to the whole cast
-FSmash is weaker
-Airial combat suffers from nerfed Nair

-Faster to charge. The missile cancel keeps kood distance from it this time, so it's two separate hits.
-They're wider, and easier to combo out of.
-Not true. you can multiple tether, into the UB. Samus has to be wall or star KO's 90% of the time.
-Fair can combo into it.
-Not at all ^_^

 

[xilez]

Dmbrandon..you think you could get me some good samus videos of the bomb recovery and tethering?

i saw the one on your youtube page, but the bomb recovery wast usually really close to the stage..

 

[Vividice]

Thank you very much dmbrandon.

Great answers!

 

[Krell]

OK, I have also played this game and I don't entirely believe this rating system. I found Lucario to be deserving of far better than a 6/10, and Marth is not nearly as good as we was in Melee. I suspect crew members taking 'mains' strongly effects the ratings, as a person will obviously be better with their main and thus the character will appear better.
Then again, I just don't think anybody can make an effective rating system after having this game for less than a week. It will take time...

 

[Ogre_Deity_Link]

Link only has a 5/10?

Ow! My ego! And the ego of all other Link mains!

I thought he was supposed to be much better in Brawl than in Melee?

 

[Burning Soul]

Who's a good fast character that isn't one of the Fox Triples or Marth?

I need a fast main if Dedede and R.O.B. are slow...

Diddy or lucas

 

[Near]

Is Lucas' Pk Freeze useful at all?
What about his KO moves? Bair, Forward Smash, Up Smash and Down Smash?
Any more information would be appreciated.

 

[mario-man]

Umm... this may just be me, but this seems biased..........especially when NOBODY has ANY right to rate the characters unless you live in Japan and have played the game or imported it. Seriously guys, it's called PLAY-ING THE GAME!! Sure, everybody wants their character to be good or whatever, but you have NO right deciding which characters are good based off of videos. I mean, you can get a small idea, but I gaurantee that alot of the characters are better than they seem, and/or will get better with years as the metagame broadens. STOP DEBATING CHARACTERS UNLESS YOU HAVE PLAYED THE GAME!!! And still only then if you have put massive time into EACH AND EVERY CHARACTER, which is impossible since it hasn't even been out for a week, let alone in the hands of any country except Japan.

 

[ph00tbag]

But is the part about switching to Zamus directed at me?
If so: I thught about it but im not sure. Zamus is nice but its not my Samus in the shiny Suit and not the range combat queen i loved....

I was talking to Diem. I quoted you mostly to make the Samus kill moves joke. I'm a Samus main, so I'm allowed to knock her.

 

[Digman]

For some reason it doesn't suprisee me to hear that the Fox/Falco/Wolf trio are soo strong. Just from watching videos I see huge potential in all of them. Pleasant news to hear about Diddy's potential who was a character I wasn't sure had any potential at all.

 

[dmbrandon]

Umm... this may just be me, but this seems biased..........especially when NOBODY has ANY right to rate the characters unless you live in Japan and have played the game or imported it. Seriously guys, it's called PLAY-ING THE GAME!! Sure, everybody wants their character to be good or whatever, but you have NO right deciding which characters are good based off of videos. I mean, you can get a small idea, but I gaurantee that alot of the characters are better than they seem, and/or will get better with years as the metagame broadens. STOP DEBATING CHARACTERS UNLESS YOU HAVE PLAYED THE GAME!!! And still only then if you have put massive time into EACH AND EVERY CHARACTER, which is impossible since it hasn't even been out for a week, let alone in the hands of any country except Japan.

I've had the game since the 30th. I have played it dawn to dusk everyday for a week. I have 75 hours logged, kid, I know my ****. I make ratings updates as I find them, and regardless, it's my opinion. I've played every character in the game for at least an hour, and can see their starting potential. Don't assume I'm biased, because I HATE spacies, but I explain how they're still great.

More updates in 5 minutes.

 

[FiveLeafClover]

words

Uhh... if this is directed at the thread creator, then he definitely *does* have the game and he *has* been playing it a heck of a lot over the past few days.

Also, note the key word IMPRESSIONS. Meaning, how HE (and his friends) thinks the characters will end up, i.e. their potential. There's a reason why he said 'Not a Tier List'.

 

[Wight]

From what i have seen diddy is actually really bad. I dont see what you are talking about. I just see a diddy fan-boy a lil over excited. I know Ganondorf seems bad, but he isnt as bad as Yoshi, I diagree with luigi, he seems rather unchanged. slightly better, but still pretty bad. Worse than mario. Samus is not worth an 8. At least not with knowledge of current techs.