Melee Netplay - The Future is Now (New and improved!)

[Makkun]

This is awesome! Just what I wanted to wake up to. I'm glad you were able to play with JMC last night, KnitePhox. The best part is there's a full FORTY MINUTE VIDEO of seamless online play. Mind if I put the link in the OP video section?

Also I'm editing the OP to contain the proper processor information.

 

[Boat Mode]

I was skipping around the video and I heard numerous comments about lag. How many frames of lag are we talking about? This is cool but I don't really see the point if there are 5+ frames of lag.

 

[Makkun]

The average pad buffer for two people with decent internet connections is 8. This equates to about 4 frames of lag. It's noticeable, but still feels good. I don't have any problems until about the 12 buffer mark (about 6 frames of lag). Anything below 10 (like you said, 5 frames of lag) feels fine. You have to take what you can get. Any game with online play is going to have lag, and the ability to even play Melee online is totally worth it. That being said, I don't think anyone should expect to be able to play really high-level tournaments or money matches properly online. But high-level play is still fun and definitely possible. You just need to take it with a grain of salt and don't get overly serious.

Edit: Also I just heard them talking about lag during the Luigi/Falcon match at about 11 minutes. The first time JMC mentions lag, it isn't really lag but just a hiccup with Dolphin (watch their FPS drop, not related to actual lag). They then talk about how their gameplay is so smooth they could probably drop down to 2-3 pad buffer (1 frame of lag) without any hiccups. Awesome!!!

 

[Bones0]

You are talking about input lag, right? (Where Dolphin has to process your input for a few frames before it executes on the screen.) What kind of lag can be expected with a typical Verizon Broadband connection? Speed(Down/Up): 1184 / 448 Kbps

Tentatively hyped.

 

[Boat Mode]

Well I'm still relatively new to competitive melee so I saw this and saw a great opportunity to improve. Regardless of the lag this is really cool, I just tend to pretty picky about laggy tv's and such.

I'll be trying this with a friend (fairly certain we both have the required specs) some time this week. We live in the same town so I'll see how low we can get the lag.

 

[Makkun]

Bones, I think you should be okay as long as nobody else on your network is interfering. JMC says as long as you're about twice as fast as dial-up you should be fine. So I'd think you'd be way in the clear.

Boat Mode, that's awesome! If you want to play some time, PM me. I played Melee competitively from about 2005-2009 and I got pretty good. Obviously I'm really rusty but it would be a good opportunity for both of us! Do you have a controller you can play with?

 

[Turnerfield77]

i've downloaded the memory file, i've put it in the memory card slot on the memcard manager, and i still can't get the game to load with everything in it

 

[Makkun]

i've downloaded the memory file, i've put it in the memory card slot on the memcard manager, and i still can't get the game to load with everything in it

Ah, you shouldn't have to use the memory card manager. The file isn't a SSBM save-file. It's an actual GameCube memory card file. All you have to do is put it in your User/GC folder and overwrite the MemoryCardA.USA.raw file that's already there. Make sure you keep a backup copy of the file, though. You'll need to revert back to its original downloaded state every time you reconnect with somebody, so you both are playing with the EXACT same data (this includes kill counts and even power time). It's the best way to ensure you don't desync.

 

[Turnerfield77]

once in the user folder, do I extract it? or leave it as a .rar?

 

[Turnerfield77]

finally got it!!! well my computer runs the game at 60 fps without breaking a sweat so when i get a useable controller adapter, i would love to test with you guys

 

[Makkun]

Awesome!! I should probably put in the OP that you need to extract it... hehe

 

[Gliffie]

If you want to test with an European, I'm available. I have a laptop with i5 Sandy Bridge:

My ping to Chicago:



I'm downloading something right now so it may be a bit slower than usual, but it looks like I'll get 8 frames of lag from network latency alone. I'll see if I can improve it.

 

[JMC4789]

I play Smash 64 at 7 frames of lag usually cross country, I'll gladly play you with 8 frames if you send me your contact info.

 

[Bones0]

What's the lowest lag you guys have been able to achieve so far?

 

[Makkun]

Edit: Nevermind I'm an idiot. JMC and KnitePhox got about 3 frames of in-game lag in their 40+ minute video from last night.

 

[JMC4789]

Lowest lag ever is 2 frames from a inter-state test. On average, we're expecting U.S. players playing with one another to experience 2 - 5 frames of lag max, with perhaps a few exceptions. From Michigan to Alabama is about 6 frames, and that's with the Alabama player on a dialup connection. It's basically half of brawl, and even better than I expected. We could also look into other modes of netplay, like Kaillera, but, with those you run into enormous risks of desyncing even with N64. Right now, we're happy with P2P because it never desyncs when properly setup.

There are optimizations to be made in the netplay code, according to the Dolphin Devs, so if we show them we're using it, it may get even faster!

 

[Achilles1515]

does anyone want to play right now?

 

[JMC4789]

I can play a few rounds, but, I'm not very good and am stuck on a PS2 controller right now. It'd be good for testing and setting it up if you want!

 

[Achilles1515]

Okay im down to try. wanna get on skype? ive got to download it real fast

 

[JMC4789]

Sent you my contact info, I'm on right now. Should be pretty painless to setup, I just did it last night too.

 

[Fuzzyness]

ive got it all set up if anyone wants to try, the dual core method tho using the 30/45 fps cheat

 

[rokimomi]

Every time I right click on the iso and try to go into the properties from dolphin (to put in the cheats), it gives me a loop of alert messages saying the AR code is erroneous (note, I haven't put in any AR code at this point, I've only clicked on the properties button). I'm using the build from the OP and I've had this happen on two different Melee ISO's, any thoughts?

 

[leffen]

So the dual core version does not desync with 30/45 fps hack as long as you play non random characters?

 

[Gliffie]

ive got it all set up if anyone wants to try, the dual core method tho using the 30/45 fps cheat

Like I said, I'm up for testing and I'm also in Europe. Though, I think dual core is gonna be an unsynched mess lol

If we use cheats, do we both have to use them then?

 

[Fuzzyness]

me and internet exlporer tested it without the 30/45 fps codes on dual core and it didnt desynch. We both have good pcs

the only thing that desynched sort of was the random stuff after a few matches, like a turnip came out as a stitch on my screen at game 4 but not on his screen.

aside that worked nicely (apart from 5 delay'ish to america) XD

we used DSP LLE with Thread turned off, XAudio2 Backend



altho my dolphin is not really lagging at all with DSP HLE emulation and D sound,

 

[Izuhu]

Just got finish playing with nmn running single core. Too fun!, even though it lagged a bit here and there. Will definitely play better if we get dual core working with no ds

 

[leffen]

Yo fuzzy we definitely needs to play sometime then, I should get it set up.


My computer is old though, dual core i3 something something so maybe I need to upgrade?

 

[JMC4789]

i3 should be okay for the easiest maps. Make sure you use our speedhacks settings mentioned to get a little extra out of your machine. Only play 2 players as well, anything more will stress it out!

 

[JMC4789]

Rokimomi: You need to just hold enter through them all for right now. Dolphin's cheats for Melee are broken. AFter you get through them all it'll work as intended and you can enter in new cheats without errors.

Oops, sorry for double post, forgot how I was the last person to post when going through the thread and making sure all the questions were answered.

 

[leffen]

Will my i3 work with dualcore+30fps hack or just single core no hack?

Really curious, this is looking to be hella awesome

 

[Fuzzyness]

leffen just talk to me on skype

I have a really good pc so I was playing against IE with dual core and good settings lol

we could probably play dual core but your pc wont be able to handle intensive stage as much as mine

 

[JMC4789]

Try to avoid using dualcore, because if you use dualcore it will desync. Using the 30 fps hack will allow you to get similar performance as dualcore, but, both players need to be using the hack. And then, you need to make sure you set your FPS limit to 30, last I checked.

Our framerate hack isn't ready for release yet, but when it is, you'll be able to use the hacks without messing up audio.

 

[Fuzzyness]

well, with SSBMO coming up soon it'll solve that

 

[leffen]

How do I enable the 30 fps hack again? Been years since I last used dolphin

 

[Izuhu]

I can run HLE with no problems too, and I find OpenGL way better than DX9 for the fact that it runs faster with gc games.

 

[nmn]

How do I enable the 30 fps hack again? Been years since I last used dolphin

Our 30 FPS hack is not available for consumption yet, sorry. I have no compiler environment for Windows or OS X (I'm working on Windows right now, I'll need to put thought into OS X. Hackintosh is hard, and last I did a proper hackintosh was 10.6.)

well, with SSBMO coming up soon it'll solve that

Let's hope so, but in the meantime I remain skeptical until further information is posted. I know it's possible, but they're saying it works with vanilla Dolphin, and I have not reproduced that behavior.

 

[JMC4789]

The settings in the first post are not optional if you want to sync, running HLE audio with a backend will cause desyncs; running dualcore will cause desyncs.

You can use any graphics backend and they will sync. Open GL is indeed fastest

You can use the action replay codes posted by the Melee Online group though, but both players have to have the code enabled, and it will mess up LLE sound if you are using it.

 

[Fuzzyness]

im going to test it out now with a UK player

 

[Dan Salvato]

Try to avoid using dualcore, because if you use dualcore it will desync.

Dual-core does not desync on builds newer than 650.

 

[JMC4789]

Yes it does >.>. I just tested it.

Is there some other option that causes desyncs? Because simply enabling dualcore on build 651 will cause desyncs in Dolphin.

I'll do further testing in optimal conditions later on tonight... if you're right, it really does change everything. Here's to hoping!