Luigi vs. Jiggly puff

[LeetLeaf]

My friend plays Jiggly and he makes it impossible for me to do anything because he Bairs until I make a bad approach. What is a good way to approach a Jiggly that makes a Bair wall?

 

[Artificial Flavour]

I like to make a bair wall in return.

 

[Zelbertoad]

I don't play this match-up very much, but some suggestions are:
approach with WD shield while Jiggs is bair walling.
if platforms are available, try using them to your advantage and WD/WL from one to another.
bait Jiggs into approaching

 

[BluEG]

Yay! Puff matchup questions.

Bair wall is annoying and my friend used to do the same thing, then one day I realized "Hey, my bair has just as much range" Thus, making a bair wall in return is great.

Essentially I play this matchup by spacing Bairs/Dairs/Uairs to keep jigglypuff away and then try to predict where she will land and then grab / usmash.
Ftilt is surprisingly good if you tilt it upwards.

Most kills will be chops, or up smash. Up-B can get kills really early but i find it hard to land on puff.

Also, the BEST rest punish ever is to taunt and then Dair. Just sayin

 

[nublet06]

im actually really motivated to improve in this matchup. I only have 1 jiggs in my region to practice with and he is pretty good but not ranked.

i have always thought this is luigis worst matchup in the game. i really have nothing to add to the discussion besides that.

my common approaches just begged to be rested such as wavedash jab. it is also impossible to recover against jiggs.

id love to have a great jiggs to play with.

 

[Artificial Flavour]

Stuff

Also, the BEST rest punish ever is to taunt and then Dair. Just sayin

I landed a taunt >shory before on a whiffed rest. Not recorded but I have a witness.

Stuff

i have always thought this is luigis worst matchup in the game. i really have nothing to add to the discussion besides that.

my common approaches just begged to be rested such as wavedash jab. it is also impossible to recover against jiggs.

id love to have a great jiggs to play with.

Not at all Luigi's worst match up. It's at least 50-50. Uthrow>Uair>Bair or Uthrow>Bair>bair depending on DI work really well at lower percents. Chops are great at doing damage and better that dair imo cuz dairs can be DI'd so high and Jiggs gets a free recovery. WD OoS after getting bair'd/F-smashed is really god to get grabs/f-smashes.

 

[Verda Stelo]

I don't think this matchup is terrible it just requires the same patience and intelligence of the Luigi player that the Puff player is exhibiting (like most floaty MUs). It's all about figuring out their bair spacings and timings and punishing them. I like WD in to ftilt at mid-low percentages, it hurts and leaves them open to a few more aerial hits. Punish high spacings with usmash. Once you get Puff above 70% start looking for those chops.

 

[Verda Stelo]

I've gotten to play this matchup more recently (Hungrybox and Fearless at CEO and my primary training partner picking up Puff) and the more I play it the more fun I find it. Bair footsies can be like a bout of trench warfare, trying to place a move in just the right spot. Luigi can gain the upper hand in these exchanges with his significantly better mobility on the ground and SHAWLs. Like I said before, usmash is your best friend and you can take advantage of its invincibility frames if Puff is coming in high. When Puff bairs your shield, fades away, and comes back with another bair, that second bair will be higher due to the way his aerial mobilIty works--you can punish it with a wavedash OOS usmash before it comes in and after it hits your shield.
Dthrow can lead into good combos and kills but it can also be DIed. At medium percents, dthrow from a side platform can put Puff just above the top platform, potentially leaving an opening for usmash or ping off the top platform.
Fireballs are actually an effective way of both keeping Puff away and limiting his options offensively and defensively. Shoot a high fireball and Puff has to come in low, grounded fireball and Puff might shield, et cetera. This is something that adapting to your opponent's movement patterns and recognizing OOS habits will get you much more mileage out of due by presenting you with opportunities to more precisely limit the options that they probably want to do. (This is good skill in general, and I think consciously implementing something into your game in a particular situation helps you understand that concept more thoroughly so you can apply it to any situation you want to. This works for me, at least.) Be careful that you're not too close to your opponent when you shoot your fireball, it's very punishable at close range.
Watch out for your opponent trying to take advantage of your beautiful wavedash and crouching. Luigi can't grab a crouching Puff which will lead to a free punish, or if you try to come in with a dsmash or something, you'll get crouch cancel rested which makes you feel like the biggest noob in the world.

Where Puff really beats Luigi in this matchup is off stage. Puff can easily deal with Luigi's recovery horizontally and if you're below the stage. Always try your best to recover as high as possible versus Puff. His limited vertical mobility and poor upward hitboxes allow Luigi to for almost free if you cover yourself smartly with a dair. Once you establish this threat your recovery options open up a little bit more. Puff can easily rest a missile on stage so make sure you hit any edge cancels properly.
To edgeguard Puff is difficult but certainly not impossible. Threaten high recoveries with fireballs and bairs, punish low recoveries with ledge invincible bairs, and you can punish missed sweetspots with backwards dairs on the ledge. If you land the meteor hitbox Puff is dead almost certainly. When Puff is trying to get off the ledge I like to SHFFL fairs, which Luigi can actually do quite exceptionally; his floatiness gives you a lot of control over the timing and spacing of your aerial.

 

[BluEG]

I agree that Fireballs are extremely useful in this matchup, arguably the best MU for fireballs actually other than Peach.
The matchup is very slow in general, so poking for some damage and limiting their movement is key.

Being offstage against Puff means almost certain death, and recovering with luigi missile is pretty much impossible unless you're just hoping for a misfire.

Landing up-smashes is key, practicing WD -> Dash -> jumpcancelled USmash is a really good thing to know how to do since it extends the reach of it considerably when punishing.

 

[TheHartChip]

On a side note with Jigglypuff if they ever use rollout your down-b has more priority. I am not sure if this is all that useful. It was something I thought about while re waching Hungrybox vs. cool hat.

 

[Verda Stelo]

Lol that's an amazing counter troll.

 

[TheHartChip]

Yeah my little brother plays jigglypuff and he likes to use it and one day I decided to fight back against it rather than just jumping over.

 

[TheHartChip]

Oh I almost forgot I find it is really easy to be juggled by jigg's up air so if you ever get stuck in that don't nair because jiggs can hit through it. I have found my best bets have been a preemptive dair which can send jiggly out of the way or DI to the side and fair or bair if jiggs comes near you.

 

[Verda Stelo]

Puff's uair is certainly hard to beat, especially with his great aerial mobilIty compared to Luigi's... lackluster aerial mobilIty. If you have great timing you can beat it with dair but you're right in that avoidance is going to be better for Luigi. A carefully timed bair or uair can actually move your hurtbox and make the chasing Puff miss too!

 

[-ACE-]

Versus puff.....

THE NEUTRAL GAME IS EVERYTHING.

The importance of hitbox knowledge/proper spacing and especially stage control/zoning is much more important vs jiggs than other characters.

Tech skill helps a lot, as it is your goal to constantly avoid bad situations for Luigi, in every situation you make... and you must do this without giving puff free space (although luigi's wavedash makes the appropriate distance you should remain from puff somewhat of a gray area... as you can close space on the ground so quickly). The faster/more fluid you are, the more openings will come your way. Going offstage is instant death. Control the center of the stage as often and as intelligently (don't get predictable with techs/wavelands) as possible, and you must know how to appropriately change your DI as you get closer to the ledge (do anything you can to prevent a bair to bair combo that could send you offstage). Trades will happen a lot. If you come within range with one of puff's hitboxes, you want to have the most disjointed, perfectly spaced hitbox you can possibly dish out ready to meet him. Verda Stelo's recommendation on dealing with the second bair of puff's typical bair, drift away, bair again is cash. usmash is so good when you know puff is high enough to get hit by the top part of it. If you can't kill on a missed rest, aerial or dthrow combo at low%, and I dont mind dsmash at medium% as not many people do this and you can aerial afterward if they don't DI appropriately.

This matchup is hard. You really have to try to avoid being hit as much as possible. Lots of bait/punish play as well as aerial footsies. Don't let your guard down for a second.

 

[TheHartChip]

I would also say your recovery should be done a little differently. If you end up off stage don't just do short bursts of green missile to get back on. Jiggly can easily gimp you so don't make it easier by doing that. Change up how long you charge each one. That way you can respond to jigglypuffs attack and possibly hit her away. That way you can continue recovering without having to worry about being hit further away.

 

[-ACE-]

Yeah the typical free side-b isn't free against puff... all you can do it drift toward the stage intelligently and watch him... use your regular (directional) DI as well as your jump to bait anything that may leave an option open, and put a hitbox on his face if he gets too close.

 

[Verda Stelo]

Nice point about DI, Ace. If you start to get pushed off stage with an aerial string, which will certainly happen, you have to know your defensive capabilities relative to your stage position. While you're still on stage (your loving home) DI down and away to give you the best chance to get your feet on the ground and your guard up. When you get hit off you have to switch your DI up and that's when you have to make a decision based off of your percent; at lower percents you'll want to DI up and away to avoid the next attack, at higher percents up and in to give yourself the chance to survive and recover. Like most of the advice I give, this applies to every matchup.