• Welcome to Smashboards, the world's largest Super Smash Brothers community! Over 250,000 Smash Bros. fans from around the world have come to discuss these great games in over 19 million posts!

    You are currently viewing our boards as a visitor. Click here to sign up right now and start on your path in the Smash community!

just wondering about triple jab

thekyllerkyd

Smash Rookie
Joined
Apr 28, 2015
Messages
4
Location
Norcal
I noticed that triple jab (the butt) can knock an opponent at lower percents not that far away from you putting them in a prime position for a down smash or f tilt. I was just wondering if this was safe and if it is what are some other practical uses of triple jab? I know it can also stop Luigi while he is sliding so I'm just wondering how good this move is in this day and age
 

Vist

Smash Champion
Joined
Jan 13, 2003
Messages
2,059
Location
Pasadena, Maryland
I'm not a frame advantage master or anything, but judging by the frame data for the triple jab, it's not terribly safe. It is, however, fairly difficult to punish for some characters in my experience.

Punishing the triple jab usually means shield-grabbing Luigi, but that means getting close enough to actually do it. Characters like Marth or Sheik probably have the easiest time doing it considering their grab range.

Dsmash is a good follow up to the triple jab because the Dsmash will really push a shielding opponent away in case you're actually too close to them.

As far as other uses, I personally like to triple jab as a sort of barrier against certain characters who are trying to get way too close / wanting to grab. ICs are a good example of this; I've had some success keeping ICs from wavedashing in and shield-grabbing me by spamming jabs / jab combos which a lot of times will stop their movement just before you would be in their grab range. Not only does it stop those attempts to approach and grab, but also can stop some of their attempts to wavedash in and Dsmash etc. I wouldn't say this kind of use is guaranteed to work but it's more of a heuristic that can work in certain situations. Also, it doesn't have to be just situations where the opponent is the one approaching, but could also be times where you are approaching but don't want the other guy to get too close at the same time since it usually means you've just committed to a fairly long and predictable wavedash movement.

It's also sort of an odd (yet again, not terribly safe) form of pressure if you are throwing out moves to keep the opponent trapped either in terms of movement or options (like making them sit in shield, at least temporarily).

Triple jab can kind of be good in some cases as a follow up to edgeguards on more heavy / fast-falling characters. Let's say you're right by the ledge and somehow you managed to get a falco to do something unsafe close to the ledge while recovering or regrabbing the ledge. In these cases, you might be able to land a jab / double jab / triple jab to make them fall just slightly below and follow it up with an offstage aerial etc. The triple jab in these cases are a lot of times better than just a single jab because the single jab not really move them anywhere and they could just fall and snap right to the ledge.

One other use is throwing it out while wavedashing backwards in order to do a stalled ledgegrab (Abate does or used to do this a lot). I personally don't think it has too much use or at least isn't usually the best move(s) to stall with, considering the hitboxes are only in front of you, but it does leave some split-second options for exactly when you snap to the ledge if you choose to only to a single jab as opposed to double jab / triple jab.
 
Last edited:

thekyllerkyd

Smash Rookie
Joined
Apr 28, 2015
Messages
4
Location
Norcal
I'm not a frame advantage master or anything, but judging by the frame data for the triple jab, it's not terribly safe. It is, however, fairly difficult to punish for some characters in my experience.

Punishing the triple jab usually means shield-grabbing Luigi, but that means getting close enough to actually do it. Characters like Marth or Sheik probably have the easiest time doing it considering their grab range.

Dsmash is a good follow up to the triple jab because the Dsmash will really push a shielding opponent away in case you're actually too close to them.

As far as other uses, I personally like to triple jab as a sort of barrier against certain characters who are trying to get way too close / wanting to grab. ICs are a good example of this; I've had some success keeping ICs from wavedashing in and shield-grabbing me by spamming jabs / jab combos which a lot of times will stop their movement just before you would be in their grab range. Not only does it stop those attempts to approach and grab, but also can stop some of their attempts to wavedash in and Dsmash etc. I wouldn't say this kind of use is guaranteed to work but it's more of a heuristic that can work in certain situations. Also, it doesn't have to be just situations where the opponent is the one approaching, but could also be times where you are approaching but don't want the other guy to get too close at the same time since it usually means you've just committed to a fairly long and predictable wavedash movement.

It's also sort of an odd (yet again, not terribly safe) form of pressure if you are throwing out moves to keep the opponent trapped either in terms of movement or options (like making them sit in shield, at least temporarily).

Triple jab can kind of be good in some cases as a follow up to edgeguards on more heavy / fast-falling characters. Let's say you're right by the ledge and somehow you managed to get a falco to do something unsafe close to the ledge while recovering or regrabbing the ledge. In these cases, you might be able to land a jab / double jab / triple jab to make them fall just slightly below and follow it up with an offstage aerial etc. The triple jab in these cases are a lot of times better than just a single jab because the single jab not really move them anywhere and they could just fall and snap right to the ledge.

One other use is throwing it out while wavedashing backwards in order to do a stalled ledgegrab (Abate does or used to do this a lot). I personally don't think it has too much use or at least isn't usually the best move(s) to stall with, considering the hitboxes are only in front of you, but it does leave some split-second options for exactly when you snap to the ledge if you choose to only to a single jab as opposed to double jab / triple jab.
oh so the 20XX thing of stopping sliding momentum unexplored or just like too situational to be used at all?
 

Vist

Smash Champion
Joined
Jan 13, 2003
Messages
2,059
Location
Pasadena, Maryland
oh so the 20XX thing of stopping sliding momentum unexplored or just like too situational to be used at all?
I'm not sure exactly what you mean, but my post was kind of like, separate from any pivoting stuff.

If you're talking about pivoting your approaches as opposed to throwing out a jab combo during your approaches, then they probably both have their own advantages / disadvantages and aren't exactly meant to do the same thing IMO. Pivoting your approaches are harder to execute but allow you to control your own movement with very little lag if done right. On the other hand, throwing out jab combos during your approaches (or whenever really) can not only control (stop) your movement somewhat but more so limit your opponent's movement potentially.

At least, that is what I was saying it can kind of do, and not to say it's reliable or whatever, but neither is a lot of Luigi stuff.
 

BatSox

Smash Rookie
Joined
Sep 8, 2014
Messages
7
I don't think you can grab the ledge (abate style) after the 3rd jab. I've tried and it always stops my momentum completely.
 

Vist

Smash Champion
Joined
Jan 13, 2003
Messages
2,059
Location
Pasadena, Maryland
Yeah honesty I don't really know if it does or not lol maybe it only single and double jabs work in that case
 

thekyllerkyd

Smash Rookie
Joined
Apr 28, 2015
Messages
4
Location
Norcal
I'm not sure exactly what you mean, but my post was kind of like, separate from any pivoting stuff.

If you're talking about pivoting your approaches as opposed to throwing out a jab combo during your approaches, then they probably both have their own advantages / disadvantages and aren't exactly meant to do the same thing IMO. Pivoting your approaches are harder to execute but allow you to control your own movement with very little lag if done right. On the other hand, throwing out jab combos during your approaches (or whenever really) can not only control (stop) your movement somewhat but more so limit your opponent's movement potentially.

At least, that is what I was saying it can kind of do, and not to say it's reliable or whatever, but neither is a lot of Luigi stuff.
Oh no I wasn't talking about pivoting or anything. Supposedly with Luigi you can stop your momentum when you're sliding with triple jab
 

Verda Stelo

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Feb 2, 2014
Messages
112
Location
Atlanta, GA
I tested it and yes the booty blast does indeed cancel your momentum. I don't see any major application of it as jabs are okay at their best but it's certainly good to know. More useful in doubles for sure.
 

Jelson

Smash Cadet
Joined
Feb 28, 2015
Messages
26
Jabs are fun to throw out to interrupt your opponents movement, and Luigi's first jab comes out on frame 2 which is too good. I've also found that triple jab near the ledge on a fast faller is perfect for running off into a Dair or Bair stage spike.
 

onehunna

Smash Cadet
Joined
Dec 19, 2013
Messages
27
Location
Seattle, Washington
Does anyone know exactly why the first two jabs cancel momentum? It reminds me a lot of Amsah teching or something, where the momentum is applied afterwards.
 

Stride

Smash Ace
Joined
Feb 22, 2014
Messages
680
Location
North-west England (near Manchester/Liverpool)
Does anyone know exactly why the first two jabs cancel momentum? It reminds me a lot of Amsah teching or something, where the momentum is applied afterwards.
• Velocity from a wavedash is applied on the frame of the airdodge and then degrades by the character's traction value each frame (or by double the traction value if their current velocity exceeds their maximum walk speed).
• While you're in certain action states (including probably all normals, spotdodges/rolls, and techs) you can't slide off the edge of the stage or platform.
• During the time you can't slide off your velocity still ticks down at the same rate as it normally does, but has no effect since you can't move anywhere.
• Once you are in an action state where you're free to fall off the edge, then the velocity that is left immediately takes effect and carries you off (assuming it hasn't expired by that point).

So the jabs don't cancel your velocity, they just prevent it from being applied and stop you from sliding off as long as you're in the animation. The velocity is still there once they're finished.

If you perform any action that resets your velocity, then you won't slide off after it since there's no longer any velocity left to carry you. This is why you can't slide off after rolls or Luigi's jab 3. Since you can still slide off after techs, I'm assuming that they don't reset your velocity, but instead just apply additional velocity.

Short wavedashes don't last long enough to slide off after some of the longer options (with a minimum length wavedash the only thing you can do is jab 1), but even a wavedash with the control stick in the corner notch allows you to slide off after using any uncharged smash attack with over 10 frames of leniency.

Medium distance wavedash (corner notch): 61 frames of sliding
Maximum distance wavedash: 75 frames of sliding
Minimum distance wavedash: 33 frames of sliding

This is fixed; regardless of what your velocity was before jab 3 it will be set to this. The game starts counting the animation at 0, so "frame 0" here refers to the first frame of the animation, not the frame before it starts.
Frame|Velocity (Mm/frame)
0|±0.00000
1|±0.00000
2|±0.00000
3|±0.00000
4|+2.54944
5|+0.27438
6|-0.05133
7|-0.16552
8|-0.06820
9|+0.08163
10|+0.08163
11|+0.08163
12|+0.08163
13|+0.08163
14|+0.08163
15|+0.08163
16|+0.37733
17|+0.51424
18|+0.28441
19|+0.09110
20|+0.03850
21|+0.01975
22|+0.00662
23|-0.00089
24|+0.00277
25|+0.00096
26|+0.01031
27|+0.01089
28|+0.00206
29|+0.00209
30 (Wait) |±0.00000; no lingering velocity once the animation ends
 
Last edited:
Top Bottom