Q&A How to Wreck *****es with Ganon?- Linguini Q&A Thread

[Bwmat]

for some reason these are the only vids they've uploaded so far, even though should have recorded a bunch more.

doubles (with espi, the boy genius):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=plmLmKBqAO4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IMmujrYaLR0 (The ending is insane)

 

[YvngFlameHoe]

One of the homies told me, that I "need to play faster", I told em "that should come with practice" (I only been playing for 6 months) but I have no idea what to do to make me actually get faster. Any speed or reaction tips I should add while i'm in the hyperbolic time chamber (lab) ?

 

[Renth]

One of the homies told me, that I "need to play faster", I told em "that should come with practice" (I only been playing for 6 months) but I have no idea what to do to make me actually get faster. Any speed or reaction tips I should add while i'm in the hyperbolic time chamber (lab) ?

It comes with practice.

Best method of learning melee is to get all of your tech down, practice everything you want to learn to the point of hand breaking perfection. The mental game the player vs. player experience comes with time. Tech first, Mental later.

 

[Renth]

Also being "fast" with Ganondorf is irrelevant.

You are playing a character who's closest similar attribute play style is Marth. Your main priority is zoning and reactions, Play safely and be able to dash back and b air in an instant be prepared to up angled f tilt/up air a falcon who's about to approach and so on.

Being a Ganondorf main literally translates to your reaction time needs to be on a very high level, you spend a lot of the match counter playing your opponent, Ganons neutral is not very strong. you could play like Spider Sense or myself where we are constantly wavelanding but a lot of our movements are smoke and mirrors.

The truth is, 90% of our "swag" is us just waiting to see what our opponent does and we react to it from there. If I can make someone shield from wavelanding towards them. Then the advantage point in neutral goes to me.

Baiting opponents into shield is one of my / Ganondorfs strongest attributes. If someone lands on a platform above you from a down throw, they are 9/10 gonna shield. Up b their shield, spam b a air zoning they won't approach. After the 3rd b air, use your next double jump to waveland under them and get a free grab (its a crowd pleaser)

Melee at its core in a competitive structure is literally all bait and wait. Do something to get them to do an action then you react to it, there are popular reactions. People without ganondorf experience will try to shield grab your side b for example. Use their ignorance to your advantage.

 

[Renth]

Playing SSBM with Mr.Smooth and BillDozer

twitch.tv/Lunacy_Renth

 

[-ACE-]

Agreed Mark, great post. The very first sentence is a semi-true generalization though. CONTROLLED speed is great and necessary for us.

YvngFH: you get faster by reacting out of shield, stun, and lag more quickly, fastfalling everything, never missing L-cancels, getting your aerials close to FP, wavelands, having a crisp wd, and knowing how to properly cancel or transfer your momentum in wavelands/double jumps. Stuff like that. Just never let your desire for speed hinder your zoning game (Renth's main point)

GRIM: told you puff is a ***** haha jk. You played fairly well. Vs kage too. Gotta space him out more and get your aerials closer to FP. Trust me, every Ganon is beatable. Hopefully they put those on YouTube.

 

[NickNasty]

I've been playing melee since March of this year. I've traveled a bunch this year to different local, regional and nation tournaments and I'm finally starting to see results. Now one thing I'm honestly having trouble with is approaching in the neutral. I know that Ganon is an overall more defensive character, but I can't help to think that wave landing into an aggressive position to ftilt or even grab/pivot grab. A lot of time I'll be caught in a wave land by an opponents ftilt or sometimes even a fox upsmash when it becomes too readable. Is there any easy way to overcome getting pinched in this kind of situation or should I just hang back and throw out more fade away f-airs?

 

[Renth]

20GT

is real.

 

[tm]

I've been playing melee since March of this year. I've traveled a bunch this year to different local, regional and nation tournaments and I'm finally starting to see results. Now one thing I'm honestly having trouble with is approaching in the neutral. I know that Ganon is an overall more defensive character, but I can't help to think that wave landing into an aggressive position to ftilt or even grab/pivot grab. A lot of time I'll be caught in a wave land by an opponents ftilt or sometimes even a fox upsmash when it becomes too readable. Is there any easy way to overcome getting pinched in this kind of situation or should I just hang back and throw out more fade away f-airs?

If your waveland approach is getting read, then you can empty land -> tilt or bair to punish their missed attack if they're close to you, or you could waveland partially in instead of perfect waveland which will mess with their spacing. If you're at low % you can also ASDI down into a jab / tilt / grab.

 

[-ACE-]

I'll use this accidental double post to say tm's post is basically exactly what I was going to add to my last one before I lost my train of thought ().

So true.

@ Renth you know it!

 

[-ACE-]

Oh damn... Had a good response to that but it got deleted. Looked like a double post so I edited one... All is gone.

****.

But basically wL in is a huge commitment, have to know what your opponent is doing, option after waveland must justify risk, cc/asdi options.

 

[NickNasty]

http://www.twitch.tv/anjosmash/v/13323199 -> Match Start 57:50

Here is a match from a recent tournament. I don't know if this is the place for advice or criticism, but if anyone wants to take a look at this set and give me any advice, I'm all ears :3
edit: thanks tm & Ace for the advice on the WL situations

 

[Coastward]

@ Divinokage would you house and train me next summer if i decided to come to montreal?

 

[RedmanSSBM]

I remember one of my friends said something like Doc had a very similar playstyle to Ganon.

Uh, no he doesn't rofl.

I agree that Marth has the most similar playstyle to Ganon. A Marth that plays like Ganon can be a rather scary Marth to face.

 

[Divinokage]

@ Divinokage would you house and train me next summer if i decided to come to montreal?

Sure I can probably do that..

Did you guys also see at 2:10 on X-Wanted's link? Howtf did Up-B go that far? lol.

 

[-ACE-]

@ Divinokage dair can release wacky momentum in strange directions if stun is blocked by an object like randall. His MC after randall was extremely fast so I don't think the total effect of stun was over

@-FEMTO- I've landed 3 sextuple dairs before on fox/falcon. Last one the falcon quit out frames before #6 hit.

 

[Coastward]

Sure I can probably do that..

Did you guys also see at 2:10 on X-Wanted's link? Howtf did Up-B go that far? lol.

alright i might take you up on that offer in the future.

 

[NickNasty]

@ Divinokage My vegas rooftop warrior :*

 

[Divinokage]

@ Divinokage dair can release wacky momentum in strange directions if stun is blocked by an object like randall. His MC after randall was extremely fast so I don't think the total effect of stun was over

@-FEMTO- I've landed 3 sextuple dairs before on fox/falcon. Last one the falcon quit out frames before #6 hit.

Hm.. its probably easier to land Fair x5 in PAL as well.. =P It happened so many times Fair x3 in NTSC and they die already. lol

 

[X WaNtEd X]

Sure I can probably do that..

Did you guys also see at 2:10 on X-Wanted's link? Howtf did Up-B go that far? lol.

Holy **** I didn't even notice that. Maybe it has something to do with the momentum I had from that dair on randle?

 

[spider_sense]

Watching Ace school boys in the hood with his bars. Lmao

 

[Эикельманн [РУС]]

My **** gets so hard when mark makes serious important posts.

Oh btw here is me vs LLL.Remen.

https://youtu.be/BALPdfF_OCM

 

[Shiny Mewtwo aka Jigglysir]

My **** gets so hard when mark makes serious important posts.

Oh btw here is me vs LLL.Remen.

https://youtu.be/BALPdfF_OCM

Holy crap that 3rd game

 

[RedmanSSBM]

My **** gets so hard when mark makes serious important posts.

Oh btw here is me vs LLL.Remen.

https://youtu.be/BALPdfF_OCM

Oh ****. I think the PAL Falco dair saved your ass in that first game. You were probably dead if it were NTSC.

Also that last game was brutal. Good stuff Ian.

 

[-ACE-]

Yeah game 3 was played intelligently. Gotta love it when you can ledgedash past them and setup a gimp. Not many falcos are great at avoiding it tbh. I really think any time you can camp ledge for 3-4 seconds and bait him into getting too close, go for it. A simple ledgehop jab can setup a death combo sometimes.

 

[tm]

My **** gets so hard when mark makes serious important posts.

Oh btw here is me vs LLL.Remen.

https://youtu.be/BALPdfF_OCM

Yes, gimme that falco footage rofl.

 

[RaphaelRobo]

Ganon is a pretty cool character

 

[gmBottles]

Ganon is a pretty cool character

Yessir!

 

[NickNasty]

Best way to practice tipmans?

 

[PseudoTurtle]

Best way to practice tipmans?

Go to temple, plug a controller into second port, choose falcon for player two. You choose the dark Lord.

Make falcon go to the ledge in temple (the one in center stage). The only way you can knock him off is via the tipman, once you do, make falcon grab the ledge again. Repeat. Makes for faster practice this way because you don't have to wait for falcon to die and respawn every time you land the up air.

@-FEMTO- you had questions about the marth matchup? Post exactly what you need here and that way we can all help you. I'll start by saying up air is a godsend in this matchup if you're trying to stuff his aerials.

 

[spider_sense]

@-FEMTO- The way I practiced tipman was to practice my combos on the CPU until I forced them to come up stage and then I'd just uair.

LOL @ Mark name dropping me hard. My neutral game has gotten so much better, can't wait to show you guys the new 20GX.

 

[-ACE-]

Yo 20GX is men in tights

20GT is an unstoppable force.

 

[spider_sense]

Yo 20GX is men in tights

20GT is an unstoppable force.

Myb lmao. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M2AuvFRVbO8 Dave, hmu so we can smash up, dropping ill lines I'm so real the cops will have charge a fine.

 

[X WaNtEd X]

@ -ACE- In response to your post about Puff that got deleted, I'm kind of upset I lost to that guy because I usually do really well against people like Tsai that are top Puff players in my region. I guess the good Puff players don't respect Ganon shield pressure and fall for things whereas this guy was a lot more patient. I gotta learn how to play against worse players too I guess.

 

[-ACE-]

@ spider_sense My Ganondorf is ready for a canon or whatever you're plannin for but for now he gotta manage whores until he can't handle more.

Kids are fvcked lmao. Hit me up same time today for gamez

@ X WaNtEd X word, don't automatically conclude they're worse in the Ganon mu tho (not saying you're doing this) just cause they get outplaced by other puffs. She has so much mobility, you'd think puff is puff, but they can have totally different styles. They could be good vs Ganon and not even know why lol. I'm working on ideas vs Happy hydra myself. I really just need more consistent movement to fake him out and create openings more easily, and I'm getting there.

 

[X WaNtEd X]

I guess I am kind of assuming that. This guy was a total random, so it was hard to believe for me that he was better at the matchup then actual ranked players in my region. So I got stubborn and just didn't change my playstyle up.

I think I have the movement to combat Puff, I just don't utilize it to get grabs, which are crucial for the matchup imo. Like Kage told me after the match that I had plenty of opportunities to grabs; I had definitely conditioned this guy to shield my aerials. I just needed to be wavelanding and tomahawking more. Basically comes down to being aware of my opponent's habits. Rather, I was focusing too much on myself and being crispy.

 

[X WaNtEd X]

So Ganon players, who is going to TBH5? There is a VERY good chance I'll be attending. I got my ride set up. I got my housing. All I need now is to register and get coverage for work.

 

[gmBottles]

I wish! I've never even been to a national yet

However I should be going to EVO 2016. It's pretty far from now but still lmao.

 

[gmBottles]

In other news, I should be doing a money match this Sunday with a Fox player Mikeyy, so I'll have that to show you guys. It's just $5 but it'll be hype. I'm pretty confident in the MU, but any tips would be appreciated.

 

[-ACE-]

It's not your fault that $5 MM's are considered hype these days loool