D
Deleted member 245254
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I make this thread humbly, and earnestly. It's not an attack, and I'm also not declaring this presentation as fact. It's a mere projection of my thoughts, an opinion formed in to words meant to provide some food for thought. Looking at the argument from a different perspective. I'm interested in what you may have to say.
We argue all day about the necessity, validity, and even fairness of "AT" mechanics in Smash. It's not just a two-sided issue either, and there is more than just one mechanic to speak of when this conversation is had. Immediate examples are Wavedashing and L-Cancelling.
On one side, many say that advanced techniques increase the depth of character control, thereby giving players exactly what makes SSB(M) so special as a competitive fighter. It creates the potential for those "clutch" moments that we spend all day vying to see with our own eyes in action, and then turn them in to GIFs later that we can post on reddit or put away in our secret folder with the rest of our gamer porn. The freedom of absolute control, this camp would argue, is what makes SSBM what it is, and what every SSB should be if it means to topple its Melee brethren in competitive value.
On the other most polar side, we have folks who believe that these techniques make the game too complicated. That they are unneeded barriers for entry in a game that should be relatively simple to pick up and play, from a technical standpoint. That a majority of the greatest game play in a fighting game comes from the mind games, the spacing, and the demonstration of good fundamentals.
Both of these sides have their points, and I'm not even going to bother baring in to that trench yet again. What I'm here to talk about is...your health.
Three examples I'm going to cite...first is Mew2King. Here he cites developing issues with his fingers. If this is anything but a result of his incredibly dominant career playing competitive-level Smash Bros, it'd be news to me.
https://www.facebook.com/mewtwoking/posts/741767699175034
The next example is actually one that was shown as recently as EVO...in an interview with Mango...
Relevant part begins at around the 2:00 mark. He describes consistent pain that he "freestyles" with. He cites that the size of his hands in relation to the GC controller could be a factor but in essence, this is pain that has developed as a result of playing Smash competitively.
Having to perform a constant string of the relevant pool of AT's on Melee is not something most would define as easy to perform at a high level. Everyone who plays knows the kind of controller kickflips you do with your hands when playing Smash. It takes practice and dedication to said practice to move and fight in the way these pros do...but at what cost? I understand they are having fun and doing what they love...so essentially who am I to tell them that they should stop...but does this apply to everyone?
What drives many new players is the potential to become as good as one of them. Certainly not everyone will ever get to that level. Very little amounts of people ever will, but it's that feeling that one day, they could be. Except...what about those who value their long-term dexterous health? These techniques and the way in which they must be used create a dynamic that has extreme physical demands from a top-level player in terms of their hands...and clearly it has a way of taking its toll...and rather quickly. Football players quit due to years and years of blunt bodily trauma, UFC fighters and boxers will end up with flat noses or brain damage even before they stop playing, and the passion they have for their sport is commendable in every way...but is that the mark of an accessible game? The kind of game SSB is meant to be, in every iteration?
My third example is Sakurai. Everybody knows of the issues he has incurred, and almost undoubtedly due to his heavy-handed work on the SSB franchise. Citing Melee as his most prized and slick creation, is it really any wonder his hands adopted the same fate we are seeing in our top players? Have you considered he may be designing Smash 4 to not be painful to play in the sense that he must work around the pains that designing Melee could have caused him?
This type of problem doesn't tend to show up in a lot of the rest of our FGC brotherhoods, and I'll tell you why : the fight stick. Smash is built around a handheld controller. The rest, if not all, of the other fighters are primarily played on fight sticks which are engineered to be flexible due to their long-staying value as reliable tools for fighting games. Certainly the potential is there for them to create disadvantageous circumstances for many fingers out there, but you can see how the difference between that and a hand-control are strikingly different, mostly based on the fact that a fight stick ultimately gives you the freedom to form your hand in any way you see fit to the buttons. A hand controller has one model, one size, and one shape, and your hands must cradle it, and the size of your actual hands is irrelevant to its design.
So it all comes to this, my main point. Is a more technically accessible Smash worth the loss of "control", the loss of freedom, and the other factors that pro-AT players argue for...if it means that you are not harming your actual physical condition in the process? Have you considered that the potential for long-term harmful effects on a persons dexterity could be both a detractor to players who might hope to one day be competitive, and a detractor to those who begin to experience it even if they are showing promise? The speed of the game may also be relevant in this case, as having the need to string most of these techniques together for up to 8 minutes at a time, many times a day, is what compounds this issue when it's at the speed and reflexive acuity that is required to compete in high-level Smash. This all creates exclusivity. Exclusivity to only those who are willing to endure actual long-term harm to their bodies in order to compete, they must love the game enough to willingly hurt themselves to continue playing it at the top level. How isn't this the basic polar opposite of accessible?
We all know competitive Smash is fun. We also all know that Smash can be competitive without AT's. Injecting those mechanics in to easier to perform methods would negate (at least with a very high success rate) the probability of developing health related issues in players' hands, as those functions wouldn't be nearly as strenuous to perform for long periods of time in rapid succession, and at the very same time create that openness to feeling that potential to be successful even for a newbie. This creates competitive drive in players all around, and makes our favorite game less of a health risk to play competitively.
In any case, this is just a thought I had, and I'm curious to what you think.
UPDATE : It would appear that Hax, a very skilled and well known top Melee player, has now taken an indefinite break from playing because of developing hand issues. Add that to the list...
UPDATE : Notice M2K's comment on why he's playing more Smash 4 lately...
UPDATE : Check Ken's latest tweets on his hand injuries...
We argue all day about the necessity, validity, and even fairness of "AT" mechanics in Smash. It's not just a two-sided issue either, and there is more than just one mechanic to speak of when this conversation is had. Immediate examples are Wavedashing and L-Cancelling.
On one side, many say that advanced techniques increase the depth of character control, thereby giving players exactly what makes SSB(M) so special as a competitive fighter. It creates the potential for those "clutch" moments that we spend all day vying to see with our own eyes in action, and then turn them in to GIFs later that we can post on reddit or put away in our secret folder with the rest of our gamer porn. The freedom of absolute control, this camp would argue, is what makes SSBM what it is, and what every SSB should be if it means to topple its Melee brethren in competitive value.
On the other most polar side, we have folks who believe that these techniques make the game too complicated. That they are unneeded barriers for entry in a game that should be relatively simple to pick up and play, from a technical standpoint. That a majority of the greatest game play in a fighting game comes from the mind games, the spacing, and the demonstration of good fundamentals.
Both of these sides have their points, and I'm not even going to bother baring in to that trench yet again. What I'm here to talk about is...your health.
Three examples I'm going to cite...first is Mew2King. Here he cites developing issues with his fingers. If this is anything but a result of his incredibly dominant career playing competitive-level Smash Bros, it'd be news to me.
https://www.facebook.com/mewtwoking/posts/741767699175034
The next example is actually one that was shown as recently as EVO...in an interview with Mango...
Relevant part begins at around the 2:00 mark. He describes consistent pain that he "freestyles" with. He cites that the size of his hands in relation to the GC controller could be a factor but in essence, this is pain that has developed as a result of playing Smash competitively.
Having to perform a constant string of the relevant pool of AT's on Melee is not something most would define as easy to perform at a high level. Everyone who plays knows the kind of controller kickflips you do with your hands when playing Smash. It takes practice and dedication to said practice to move and fight in the way these pros do...but at what cost? I understand they are having fun and doing what they love...so essentially who am I to tell them that they should stop...but does this apply to everyone?
What drives many new players is the potential to become as good as one of them. Certainly not everyone will ever get to that level. Very little amounts of people ever will, but it's that feeling that one day, they could be. Except...what about those who value their long-term dexterous health? These techniques and the way in which they must be used create a dynamic that has extreme physical demands from a top-level player in terms of their hands...and clearly it has a way of taking its toll...and rather quickly. Football players quit due to years and years of blunt bodily trauma, UFC fighters and boxers will end up with flat noses or brain damage even before they stop playing, and the passion they have for their sport is commendable in every way...but is that the mark of an accessible game? The kind of game SSB is meant to be, in every iteration?
My third example is Sakurai. Everybody knows of the issues he has incurred, and almost undoubtedly due to his heavy-handed work on the SSB franchise. Citing Melee as his most prized and slick creation, is it really any wonder his hands adopted the same fate we are seeing in our top players? Have you considered he may be designing Smash 4 to not be painful to play in the sense that he must work around the pains that designing Melee could have caused him?
This type of problem doesn't tend to show up in a lot of the rest of our FGC brotherhoods, and I'll tell you why : the fight stick. Smash is built around a handheld controller. The rest, if not all, of the other fighters are primarily played on fight sticks which are engineered to be flexible due to their long-staying value as reliable tools for fighting games. Certainly the potential is there for them to create disadvantageous circumstances for many fingers out there, but you can see how the difference between that and a hand-control are strikingly different, mostly based on the fact that a fight stick ultimately gives you the freedom to form your hand in any way you see fit to the buttons. A hand controller has one model, one size, and one shape, and your hands must cradle it, and the size of your actual hands is irrelevant to its design.
So it all comes to this, my main point. Is a more technically accessible Smash worth the loss of "control", the loss of freedom, and the other factors that pro-AT players argue for...if it means that you are not harming your actual physical condition in the process? Have you considered that the potential for long-term harmful effects on a persons dexterity could be both a detractor to players who might hope to one day be competitive, and a detractor to those who begin to experience it even if they are showing promise? The speed of the game may also be relevant in this case, as having the need to string most of these techniques together for up to 8 minutes at a time, many times a day, is what compounds this issue when it's at the speed and reflexive acuity that is required to compete in high-level Smash. This all creates exclusivity. Exclusivity to only those who are willing to endure actual long-term harm to their bodies in order to compete, they must love the game enough to willingly hurt themselves to continue playing it at the top level. How isn't this the basic polar opposite of accessible?
We all know competitive Smash is fun. We also all know that Smash can be competitive without AT's. Injecting those mechanics in to easier to perform methods would negate (at least with a very high success rate) the probability of developing health related issues in players' hands, as those functions wouldn't be nearly as strenuous to perform for long periods of time in rapid succession, and at the very same time create that openness to feeling that potential to be successful even for a newbie. This creates competitive drive in players all around, and makes our favorite game less of a health risk to play competitively.
In any case, this is just a thought I had, and I'm curious to what you think.
UPDATE : It would appear that Hax, a very skilled and well known top Melee player, has now taken an indefinite break from playing because of developing hand issues. Add that to the list...
UPDATE : Notice M2K's comment on why he's playing more Smash 4 lately...
UPDATE : Check Ken's latest tweets on his hand injuries...
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