The_Loki
Smash Apprentice
So some talk on the Wario forums got me interested in the attacks that characters do when on the ledge of a stage (AKA Ledge Attacks).
I wanted to know which ones were vulnerable to punish during the attack instead of just shield grabbing them.
*Note*: Sakurai mentioned on the Dojo that if you do you ledge attack while you still have invulnerability frames from grabbing the ledge that ledge attack will have more invulnerability frames. For the rest of this post these will be referred to as EX frames.
So what I did was have each character do their ledge attack against Wario standing over the ledge with Bite running. I used bite because of its constant hitbox and overall good priority.
Just for those people who didn't know; ledge attacks change at 100% dmg and become slower and gain many more invulnerability frames.
Some common things I noticed before I go into character specific data:
Distance from the ledge effected whether the attacks hit Wario or not. This is caused because of where and when the hitbox from the ledge attacks come out and most moves would hit Wario if he was standing at the max range of the move where the hitbox comes out.
When I say that someone was vulnerable it means that Bite hit them before the hitbox of the move came out. I will also mention any occurrences of moves that were distance dependent.
If I say a move traded it means it caused damage to Wario but they still got bitten this is do to Bite having the priority of a grab and means I bit their hitbox.
All ledge attacks done at 100% have invulnerability frames during the whole attack and can only be shield grabbed, so Vulnerable means under 100% dmg
Mario: Vulnerable, attack trades with EX frames.
DK: Vulnerable only without EX frames, Invulnerable with EX frames.
Link: Vulnerable with and without EX frames.
Samus: Vulnerable with and without EX frames – Trades if standing at max range.
ZSS: Vulnerable only without EX frames, Invulnerable with EX frames.
Kirby: Vulnerable only without EX frames, Invulnerable with EX frames.
Fox: Vulnerable with and without EX frames.
Pika: Vulnerable only without EX frames, Invulnerable with EX frames.
Marth: Always Trades even with EX frames.
G&W: Vulnerable without EX frames, Trades with EX frames.
Luigi: Vulnerable without EX frames, Trades with EX frames.
Diddy: Vulnerable with and without EX frames.
Zelda: Vulnerable without EX frames – trades at max range; With EX frames Invulnerable at max range.
Sheik: Vulnerable with and without EX frames.
Pit: Vulnerable with and without EX frames. - Always Trades at max range.
MetaKnight: Vulnerable with and without EX frames. *
Falco: Vulnerable with and without EX frames. - Always Trades at max range.
Ivysaur: Vulnerable without EX frames. With EX frames trades at normal range, if very close to ledge Ivysaur is invulnerable and wins. *
Squirtle: Vulnerable with and without EX frames. - Always Trades at max range.
Charizard: Vulnerable with and without EX frames. - Always Trades at max range.
Ike: Vulnerable without EX frames. Invulnerable with EX frames.
Snake: Vulnerable with and without EX frames. - Always Trades at max range.
Peach: Vulnerable without EX frames. Invulnerable with EX frames.
Yoshi: Trades without EX frames. Invulnerable with EX frames.
Ganon: Vulnerable without EX frames, Trades with EX frames.
Ice Climbers: Vulnerable with and without EX frames. Nana is a second attack though and breaks bite. *
DDD: Vulnerable without EX frames – Trades at max range. Trades with EX frames. Has an Invulnerable sweetspot.
Wolf: Vulnerable with and without EX frames. Trades at max range with EX frames. Has a Invulnerable sweetspot with EX frames.
Lucario: Vulnerable without EX frames(loses at close range, Trades at max range). Invulnerable with EX frames. *
Nes: Vulnerable without EX frames. Trades with EX frames.
Sonic: Vulnerable with and without EX frames.
Bowser: Vulnerable without EX frames. Invulnerable with EX frames.
Wario: Vulnerable with and without EX frames.
Toon Link: Vulnerable with and without EX frames. *
Rob: Vulnerable with and without EX frames. *
Olimar: Vulnerable without EX frames. Invulnerable with EX frames.
Cpt. Falcon: Vulnerable without EX frames – Trades at max range. Always Trades with EX frames.
Jgglypuff: Vulnerable without EX frames. Invulnerable with EX frames.
Lucas: Always invulnerable with and without EX frames !
*Ledge attack has a disjointed hitbox and wins if you are to far away to hit him.
Some of this data could be slightly off as the range factors are very precise but this gives a very good general idea of how good everyone's ledge attacks are.
I wanted to know which ones were vulnerable to punish during the attack instead of just shield grabbing them.
*Note*: Sakurai mentioned on the Dojo that if you do you ledge attack while you still have invulnerability frames from grabbing the ledge that ledge attack will have more invulnerability frames. For the rest of this post these will be referred to as EX frames.
So what I did was have each character do their ledge attack against Wario standing over the ledge with Bite running. I used bite because of its constant hitbox and overall good priority.
Just for those people who didn't know; ledge attacks change at 100% dmg and become slower and gain many more invulnerability frames.
Some common things I noticed before I go into character specific data:
Distance from the ledge effected whether the attacks hit Wario or not. This is caused because of where and when the hitbox from the ledge attacks come out and most moves would hit Wario if he was standing at the max range of the move where the hitbox comes out.
When I say that someone was vulnerable it means that Bite hit them before the hitbox of the move came out. I will also mention any occurrences of moves that were distance dependent.
If I say a move traded it means it caused damage to Wario but they still got bitten this is do to Bite having the priority of a grab and means I bit their hitbox.
All ledge attacks done at 100% have invulnerability frames during the whole attack and can only be shield grabbed, so Vulnerable means under 100% dmg
Mario: Vulnerable, attack trades with EX frames.
DK: Vulnerable only without EX frames, Invulnerable with EX frames.
Link: Vulnerable with and without EX frames.
Samus: Vulnerable with and without EX frames – Trades if standing at max range.
ZSS: Vulnerable only without EX frames, Invulnerable with EX frames.
Kirby: Vulnerable only without EX frames, Invulnerable with EX frames.
Fox: Vulnerable with and without EX frames.
Pika: Vulnerable only without EX frames, Invulnerable with EX frames.
Marth: Always Trades even with EX frames.
G&W: Vulnerable without EX frames, Trades with EX frames.
Luigi: Vulnerable without EX frames, Trades with EX frames.
Diddy: Vulnerable with and without EX frames.
Zelda: Vulnerable without EX frames – trades at max range; With EX frames Invulnerable at max range.
Sheik: Vulnerable with and without EX frames.
Pit: Vulnerable with and without EX frames. - Always Trades at max range.
MetaKnight: Vulnerable with and without EX frames. *
Falco: Vulnerable with and without EX frames. - Always Trades at max range.
Ivysaur: Vulnerable without EX frames. With EX frames trades at normal range, if very close to ledge Ivysaur is invulnerable and wins. *
Squirtle: Vulnerable with and without EX frames. - Always Trades at max range.
Charizard: Vulnerable with and without EX frames. - Always Trades at max range.
Ike: Vulnerable without EX frames. Invulnerable with EX frames.
Snake: Vulnerable with and without EX frames. - Always Trades at max range.
Peach: Vulnerable without EX frames. Invulnerable with EX frames.
Yoshi: Trades without EX frames. Invulnerable with EX frames.
Ganon: Vulnerable without EX frames, Trades with EX frames.
Ice Climbers: Vulnerable with and without EX frames. Nana is a second attack though and breaks bite. *
DDD: Vulnerable without EX frames – Trades at max range. Trades with EX frames. Has an Invulnerable sweetspot.
Wolf: Vulnerable with and without EX frames. Trades at max range with EX frames. Has a Invulnerable sweetspot with EX frames.
Lucario: Vulnerable without EX frames(loses at close range, Trades at max range). Invulnerable with EX frames. *
Nes: Vulnerable without EX frames. Trades with EX frames.
Sonic: Vulnerable with and without EX frames.
Bowser: Vulnerable without EX frames. Invulnerable with EX frames.
Wario: Vulnerable with and without EX frames.
Toon Link: Vulnerable with and without EX frames. *
Rob: Vulnerable with and without EX frames. *
Olimar: Vulnerable without EX frames. Invulnerable with EX frames.
Cpt. Falcon: Vulnerable without EX frames – Trades at max range. Always Trades with EX frames.
Jgglypuff: Vulnerable without EX frames. Invulnerable with EX frames.
Lucas: Always invulnerable with and without EX frames !
*Ledge attack has a disjointed hitbox and wins if you are to far away to hit him.
Some of this data could be slightly off as the range factors are very precise but this gives a very good general idea of how good everyone's ledge attacks are.
