• Welcome to Smashboards, the world's largest Super Smash Brothers community! Over 250,000 Smash Bros. fans from around the world have come to discuss these great games in over 19 million posts!

    You are currently viewing our boards as a visitor. Click here to sign up right now and start on your path in the Smash community!

Fox Trot canceling ??? (video)

OoNoiRoO

Smash Journeyman
Joined
May 16, 2006
Messages
371
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-x8wygkxDyI

NEW VIDEO
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l-tBzYAaGu0

ALSO SEE
http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=140981


Fox trotting is using the initial dash movement continuously to move. It is possible in Brawl. To do so, you must wait till the end of the dashing animation, then dash again.

In Brawl, you can only do this in one direction. To change directions, you must dash dance.

Every character can dash dance, but only with the initial frames of a starting dash. Because fox trotting uses the starting dash continuously, at the beginning of each "trot", you can initiate a dash dance. You can use this dash dance to change the direction of your fox trot fluidly.

You can also cancel the initial frames of a dash(in the range of what you can dash dance) with an Up Smash, Forward Smash(both ways, shown), Forward B(both ways), Down smash, and down tilt. I'm not sure how to get a down tilt though, as it has come out randomly. Quite possibly other normals are cancelable, but the dash dance makes that impossible to hard.

You can also run one way and immediately dash attack the other way with this.

Possibly the actual dash dance of brawl?
 

vagabond

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Jul 27, 2005
Messages
183
Location
York, PA
Nice stuff man, keep the vids and hunt for techs coming. BTW, since you have an apparent interest in the technical side of the game, is there any chance you'll be posting match videos with yourself and another human opponent any time soon?
 

Card

Smash Lord
Joined
Sep 19, 2001
Messages
1,237
Location
Montreal, Quebec, Canada
Hello new method of transportation? (ala: wavedash)

I like it already. I like the name Fox Trotting too.


EDIT (Now that I'm over the excitement of a new Technique):
Now we need to take this to the next level and ask and answer a few questions;

  1. Is this possible with every character?
    • If yes, are there any differences between characters advantages/disadvantages?
    • If no, which characters cannot do it, and is there similarity between said characters
  2. What are some effective uses for this technique?
  3. What does this technique allow the user to do, that he could not do otherwise?

I know you answered most of these in your Youtube video, but this is just to be extra clear on this. Also a better quality video couldn't hurt :laugh:

Good job.
 

MookieRah

Kinda Sorta OK at Smash
Joined
Mar 7, 2004
Messages
5,384
Location
Umeå, Sweden
Kick ***. This is definitely a good find. One could use it as a dash dance, and it's also somewhat similar to a pivot. Definitely going to be a trick that will become mandatory.

@Card
It's actually a technique that was discovered in melee, but it just wasn't very useful. You couldn't smash from it and stuff like this, that's for **** sure.
 

OoNoiRoO

Smash Journeyman
Joined
May 16, 2006
Messages
371
I'm pretty sure fox trotting was in melee as well. It's just that without wavedashing, this would probably be the alternative. Maybe for now.
 

IllidR

Smash Champion
Joined
Jul 24, 2007
Messages
2,373
Location
"Pikmen" Forever!
Very good move, I saw this in a previous Marth video and wondered the uses. I can definitely see it becoming useful but to what extent we'll find out soon!
 

draigaran

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Nov 18, 2007
Messages
123
So let me get this straight, you repeatedly smash the control stick to the left or right?
Nice find... and who says Brawl won't any AT at all? psh.
 

OoNoiRoO

Smash Journeyman
Joined
May 16, 2006
Messages
371
Yea, sometimes in the game you just randomly trip. Not sure why.

I'll have some vids up of me and some of my friends up later.

So let me get this straight, you repeatedly smash the control stick to the left or right?
Nice find... and who says Brawl won't any AT at all? psh.
Pretty much yea haha, but to change directions, you have to smash the direction of your trot then immediately they opposite way. Then you can continue that way or switch again if you want for juicy mind games.
 

HollaAtchaBoy

Smash Master
Joined
Jan 22, 2007
Messages
4,985
Location
203 nuggaaaaaaah
The thread was locked before, but NinjaLink found this in a more premature form the day we got Marth's SSE footage leaked, without actually playing it.

But I agree, This is definitely an interesting development.
 

Percon

Smash Lord
Joined
Dec 11, 2006
Messages
1,945
Location
St. Catharines, ON, CA
Wow, first truly useful advanced Brawl tech!

And people were so worried when Wavedashing was removed... bah, I say. New forms of spacing FTW!

I'm so happy you discovered this! Long live FTCing!

One more thing to add, though. Fox Trot Cancel is a cool name, but a bit long winded. Now, SHFFL was used because nobody wanted to say Short Hop Fast Fall L-Cancelled every time. Eventually, the word "shuffle" came out of that because of the similarity of the words, and because the word just fit with the action.

Now, I suggest that Fox Trot canceling be known as FTC or "Fetch". (FTCing becomes "Fetching", obviously)
 

OoNoiRoO

Smash Journeyman
Joined
May 16, 2006
Messages
371
Hello new method of transportation? (ala: wavedash)

I like it already. I like the name Fox Trotting too.


EDIT (Now that I'm over the excitement of a new Technique):
Now we need to take this to the next level and ask and answer a few questions;

  1. Is this possible with every character?
    • If yes, are there any differences between characters advantages/disadvantages?
    • If no, which characters cannot do it, and is there similarity between said characters
  2. What are some effective uses for this technique?
  3. What does this technique allow the user to do, that he could not do otherwise?

I know you answered most of these in your Youtube video, but this is just to be extra clear on this. Also a better quality video couldn't hurt :laugh:

Good job.
1. Yes. ALTHOUGH, few character's dashes end quite fast, so you don't need to dash dance to change directions. Most notable is Lucario.

The difference is the length of the dash. Obviously, longer ones will be faster, but shorter ones will have more control over spacing.

2 + 3. A list of what I can think of
- You can pretty much run up and Fsmash.
- Mindgames(just like dash dancing)
- Dash back to avoid a move, then dash toward to grab, fsmash, or aerial.
- Spacing
 

Maikeru17

What the hell is this thing
Joined
Jun 27, 2006
Messages
548
Location
Brooklyn, New York
NNID
NoxNoctis
Really awesome find, I could easily see this becoming a standard technique in Brawl.
I remember when NinjaLink brought it up, and had also wondered its uses.

I had a theory of my own (unrelated to Fox Trot Cancel), that utilizing the air dodge and whatever waveland physics we could muster, along with something unfound, would be the core of the Brawl metagame.

This find helps prove my theory.


-Nox


Shhh don't advertise it or Sakurai will take it out.
LOL!
You ****ing win.
 

Jekyll

Smash Ace
Joined
Aug 3, 2005
Messages
997
Location
Redwood City, CA
Correct me if I'm wrong...But isn't this EXACTLY how melee worked?

You can dash multiple times in the same direction(fox trotting),
or dash back and forth(dash dancing),
or you can dash, turn and during the next frame do whatever smash you wanted(pivoting).

The only difference here might be that pivoting is possible easier to do in brawl. I'm not sure about that, though, since it looked like the guy in the video missed the pivot a few times, and I honestly never thought the timing was too hard in Melee.

Either way, I guess it's good to see proof that some things haven't changed.
 

Gea

Smash Master
Joined
Jun 16, 2005
Messages
4,236
Location
Houston, Texas
Correct me if I'm wrong...But isn't this EXACTLY how melee worked?

You can dash multiple times in the same direction(fox trotting),
or dash back and forth(dash dancing),
or you can dash, turn and during the next frame do whatever smash you wanted(pivoting).

The only difference here might be that pivoting is possible easier to do in brawl. I'm not sure about that, though, since it looked like the guy in the video missed the pivot a few times, and I honestly never thought the timing was too hard in Melee.

Either way, I guess it's good to see proof that some things haven't changed.
The difference here is with Melee to dashdance you just need to turn around before a certain time. In brawl that doesn't work. You need to cancel the dash THEN turn around and redash.
 

Gea

Smash Master
Joined
Jun 16, 2005
Messages
4,236
Location
Houston, Texas
I do have a question about this:

What happens if you mess it up? Do you go into the tumbling, fall down animation or do you just stop like people trying to dashdance do? If you tumble you could effectively mess up on purpose to do extremely low aerials.
 

PwnyRide

Smash Ace
Joined
Nov 27, 2007
Messages
638
Location
Australia
Nice find. Mad Props.

And brawl was going to be noob friendly... pff please!
This isnt exactly hard to perform by the looks of it, so try not to be an *** so early, mkay?

Also feel free to correct me here, but defensive players might find this technique less...well... 'useful' in ther gameplay yes? Im wondering since some characters have off lag-like effects on the end of their dash animations unless the direction is kept held down (at least it's this way with Zelda in melee, which is in particular who im preferring to.)

This need to be tried out with all characters so we can get some more discussion going.
 

K1T3

Smash Lord
Joined
Dec 7, 2005
Messages
1,312
Location
San Antonio, Texas
This is good **** and makes me a little more optimistic for brawl. Thanks man. So why isn't dash dancing normally not possible and by canceling the lag before you dash in the other direction does that just mean let go of the control stick? or how exactly does that work...

Any word on any sort of Lag canceling for moves?
 

OoNoiRoO

Smash Journeyman
Joined
May 16, 2006
Messages
371
This is good **** and makes me a little more optimistic for brawl. Thanks man. So why isn't dash dancing normally not possible and by canceling the lag before you dash in the other direction does that just mean let go of the control stick? or how exactly does that work...

Any word on any sort of Lag canceling for moves?
you CAN dash dance, but it is very very small to the point where you don't gain any distance. In this case, you use the dash dance to change the direction of the fox trot.


No lag canceling techniques yet. As I've said before, landing lag for aerials differs on the type of aerial you land with. EX: With Mario, landing with a Bair has pretty much no delay, but landing with a Fair gets you a good amount of lag.
 

paper_crane

Smash Cadet
Joined
Jan 31, 2008
Messages
35
How fast is foxtrotting compared to regular dashing? It probably varies with every character, but on average, is the initial dash animation slower or faster than the regular one?
 

okamifire

Japan Enthusiast
Joined
Dec 9, 2007
Messages
978
Location
Richmond, VA
Oh man, that's great

Shhh don't advertise it or Sakurai will take it out.

Haha, that's fantastic, I totally got a laugh out from that. Brawl is going to be fun and like so many people mentioned before, people are going to find ways to be technical I'm sure.
 

drengist

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Oct 24, 2007
Messages
300
I wonder if you could mix this with short hop double laser or even better, turn around in the air and shoot backwards while moving forwards.
 

The_Woebegone_Jackal

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Nov 5, 2007
Messages
378
Location
Minnesota, USA
NNID
Faver_Jo
3DS FC
4854-6514-7143
This is wonderful, just what the doctor ordered for this community. This discovery may quell some of the complainers.

I do have a question though, can a special be done out of it? I would love to fake someone out just to turn around and release a charged beam into their face... :laugh:
 
Top Bottom