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The Ultimate Snake Compendium

Yes!!

Smash Rookie
Joined
Jul 25, 2007
Messages
24
I'll preface this by giving a brief introduction of myself. I've been visiting these boards for a very long time, but never felt I could contribute since by the time I found out about this site, everyone knew everything there was to know. Not too long ago I created an account but didn't really post, but today I break my silence.

With Brawl approaching I'll finally (hopefully) have the chance to contribute and as a huge Metal Gear fan, what better way than to write up a thread about Snake?

This thread is mostly about the information we know about him and potential uses. I'll also be covering some of the more heated debates to put things into perspective for Snake fans... so, here I go.



Solid Snake, sneaky protagonist of the Metal Gear franchise. In Smash Bros. Snake seems to part ways with realistic pistols/rifles in favor of explosives. While some of his moves border on the slow side, boy do they pack a punch. Before I get into the movelists I'm going to cover some of the debates just in case people have a problem with how I label some of the moves.

SECTION 1 - DEBATES

Debate 1 - Mines
The Setup: Some people think Snake has one mine, others think they got rid of the Land Mine, and so on. This has been a heated topic for quite some time, but the official answers have been revealed.

The Verdict: Snake has two "mines." By that I mean, two devices placed on the ground that explode and they are fundamentally different. In the most recent gameplay videos you can see both C4 being utilized and his trusty Land Mine. C4, the Down B, is remote controlled whereas the Land Mine (Down Smash) is triggered when stepped on by an opponent. Don't worry guys, I have visual evidence of all this stuff in the moves section. Oh, by the way... whoever said they got rid of the Land Mine and replaced it with C4 is a liar... you can clearly see the Land Mine in the latest Dojo update video (Tokyo vs. Kyoto). I'll have links to that stuff below.


Debate 2 - What move is what!? Downward Rockets... WTF!

The Setup: Since Snake's RPG (rocket launcher) is angled downwards it has caused much confusion for all sorts of people. Some think the mine isn't truly a Smash and that Snake's moves are all one big mystery.

The Verdict: The Rocket Launcher is Snake's Forward Smash. It can be seen charing in the Tokyo vs. Kyoto match and it has been said on the Dojo that "even Snake's Smash attacks use ordnance." To those who dont know, ordnance means military weaponry. With this knowledge in hand it's clear that his forward Smash is the rocket Launcher and his Land Mine is still a downsmash. Of course, the knee/2-hand club combo was also a source of confusion, but it's now almost entirely confirmed to be a tilt. More on this in the moves section.


I think these are the two big ones, and I'm sure everyone is anxious to see/learn about Snake's moves, so let's get onto the movelist.

SECTION 2 - MOVELIST

Disclaimers

1) I will not be listing every appearance of a move seen in videos, I will be listing the BEST appearances that show the use/damage of a move clearly.

2) I post a LOT of speculation. Of course, I haven't played the game... I'm just trying to get discussion going and maybe give my fellow Snake players some potential strategies to work with when the game hits shelves.

IMPORTANT, READ THIS - The links I will be providing are to gametrailers videos. It is my suggestion that you download the videos from the links in QUICKTIME FORMAT so you can watch them frame by frame (by pausing the video and pressing the left and right arrow keys). This will allow you to get the best view of each move.

MISC.



>Entrance - Snake’s optical camouflage short circuits. Snake, who was once almost invisible, gets off the ground amidst a flurry of electricity. This is originally from the opening of Metal Gear Solid 2.

>Recovery Attack (Ground) - Spinning Kick - 6%
Watch it in Action: 5:00 - http://www.gametrailers.com/player/29932.html
Explanation: Snake spins in somewhat of a breakdance fashion. The range isn’t that bad.

>Recovery Attack (Edge) - Leaping Kick - 9%
Watch it in Action: 0:09 http://www.gametrailers.com/player/29935.html
Explanation: Snake leaps back onto the stage with a big kick. Very good range.

STANDARD ATTACKS

>A, A, A - Punch, Punch, Roundhouse - Punch1: 4%, Punch2: 3%, Roundhouse: 7-8%
Watch it in Action: 4:49 http://www.gametrailers.com/player/29932.html
Explanation: Snake punches twice and finishes the combo with a big roundhouse. The damage of this move is particularly impressive (roughly 15% total) and the knock back actually seems unusually potent for an A,A,A. His long legs once again make for yet another move with good range.

Possible Uses/Strategy: As always, the A,A,A is an excellent choice when in need of a great close quarters attack. It’s quick, has multiple hits, and does pretty good damage. Snake’s A,A,A actually has a decent bit of knock back so following up the A,A,A with a smash (like Mario can do, or other characters) actually seems to be out of the question. You can however use it to knock opponents off the stage and of course canceling the roundhouse in favor of a different follow up move or grab will likely be a viable option.

>Dash Attack - Roll Attack - 10-12%
Watch it in Action: 1:30 http://www.gametrailers.com/player/19856.html
CONFIRMED - 1:11 http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=sQHw8TylNvI
1:16 (Knocking Opponent FORWARD, 2P does it to 1P), 2:34 (Knocking Opponent BEHIND SNAKE, 3P does it to 2P), 3:43 (Knocking Opponent UP, 3P does it to 1P) http://youtube.com/watch?v=gj6QT2kuT2M
Snake consistently knocking the bag UP http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=hwoEif_ScQY
Explanation: The classic roll attack from Metal Gear games. If you’ve played the recent games you were likely not fooled into thinking this was just some method of crawling. Snake runs and does a leaping roll into the enemy. The most odd thing about this move is that there is footage showing Snake knock people in front of, behind, and above him with this move. Although the sandbag video shows him consistently hitting the bag UP, there may still be rare occurrences when your opponent is sent in a different direction. It may depend on when, during the roll, you hit the opponent. It seems that Snake's crouch is him laying, so all this move does is put you into crouch for a frame afterwards, which doesn't really leave you open. What exactly causes the different directional knockback is unknown.

Possible Uses/Strategy: The first thing you may notice about this move is that Snake remains relatively safe afterwards. The nice thing about this attack is, even if you miss or your opponent blocks you do not have to fear getting shield-grabbed, since Snake ends up laying on the ground. So, if you mess up you can simply get up, shield, dodge, or do whatever you need to in order to proceed. Very nice. The damage isn't bad, but the fact that he pops you straight up most of the time (and Snake continues to tumble, away from your opponent) doesn't leave much room for strategy/combos.

TILT ATTACKS

>Forward Tilt - Knee Followed by 2-Hand Overhead Club - Knee: 9%, Club: 10%
Watch it in Action: 1:34 http://www.gametrailers.com/player/29932.html
1:29 http://www.gametrailers.com/player/19856.html
Explanation: Snake knees his opponent in the gut (or… I guess in the face if the character is short) and follows up with a powerful, overhead 2-hand club. This attack seems to be a cancelable attack, since in the new 5 minute video from Japan (at 4:36) Snake is shown kneeing Link, but not following up with the other attack. This is really nice in case you happen to miss.

Possible Uses/Strategy: Wow this is a nice tilt. For one, the speed is really nice. On top of that the damage is excellent… and finally, it has good knock back. But wait, there’s more! The fact that you can cancel this move means a lot in terms of attack strategy. If you’re attacking an opponent close quarters and choose this lovely tilt as your attack of choice, you have the following options.
1) Knee, then follow up with the Club. Great!
2) In case your opponent dodges you can stall the Club and attack right as they’re coming out of their dodge, making this attack completely unavoidable.
3) Knee, and if your opponent blocks you can stall for a second and use the club a little late in attempt to bait them out of their shield.
4) Knee, and if your opponent blocks, cancel the attack and grab them while they’re expecting a follow up attack. Oh, such trickery!

Of course, there will be more ways to use this move, and I may be wrong about the canceling mechanics, but based on what I’ve seen these are just some possibilities to think about.

>Up Tilt - Upwards Kick - 13%
Watch it in Action - 1:27 http://www.gametrailers.com/player/29932.html
1:34 http://www.gametrailers.com/player/19856.html
Explanation: Wow, Snake has some flexibility. Snake lifts his leg completely above his head, as if he was doing a split against a wall. We’ve only seen this connect in a trailer, so we don’t know what kind of damage it does, but it seemed to juggle Pit nicely in the second trailer.

Possible Uses/Strategy: Once again, thanks to Snake’s size and flexibility, this uptilt has some serious range. This move has a lot of potential, especially for setting up that killer Neutral Aerial. It may be a very nice way to get a guaranteed 4-hits out of your opponent or actually land the Upsmash.

>Down Tilt - Leg Sweep - 10%
Watch it in Action: 3:35 http://youtube.com/watch?v=MncPCyis6-E
2:24 (Watch 2P, he does it right in the open) http://youtube.com/watch?v=gj6QT2kuT2M
Explanation: In traditional leg sweep fashion, Snake swings his leg across the floor. It looks like the leg circles around his body, meaning it could possibly hit someone behind him, but this is purely speculation and may not be the case. The move is relatively quick and hits enemies upwards, kind of like C.Falcon's.

Possible Uses/Strategy: The sweep comes out kind of fast and pops your opponent up a small amount. This move is shown hitting Lucario at 0%, after which Lucario quickly recovers and counterattacks. Since floaty characters will likely recover quickly with an attack after getting popped into the air, you may have to wait until their damage is higher before you try anything afterwards, so you can get under them with a nice Up-Air or something. This move just seems a lot more useful against heavier characters, since he popup, on heavier characters, could lead to a short hopped 4-hit Neutral A, and we all know how nice that is (30% damage). Or, if their damage isn't high enough, you can likely grab them and followup with something out of that. I think the best uses for this move will surface once it comes in contact with characters other than Lucario, like some different weight classes and whatnot.

SMASH ATTACKS



>Forward Smash - Rocket Launcher (Downward) - 23%
Watch it in Action: 0:16, 0:31 http://www.gametrailers.com/player/29935.html
1:28 http://www.gametrailers.com/player/29932.html
Explanation: Snake pulls out an RPG and fires directly at the ground in front of him, it looks like Mewtwo’s downsmash at first glance but oh boy is this one different. First and foremost, the most noticeable thing about this smash is the range. The explosion is quite large and even reaches behind Snake (as seen when DK is coming from behind and gets nailed by the blast). Of course, the speed of this move isn’t the best but the damage and knock back are so high that not finding a good use for this move would be a crime.

Possible Use/Strategy: The first obvious use is edge guarding. With the new edge snap feature a lot of old edge guards will become useless, but this, to me, only makes Snake’s forward Smash more valuable. Using this smash to cover the edge with a massive explosion could prove to be an excellent tactic. Much like Mewtwo, you may be able to get some shots off on people who spend way too much time with edge-trickery. Additionally, when you knock someone on the ground and use this Smash, if they try to roll behind you they will likely get hit by the explosion. Just some stuff to think about.



>Up Smash - Mortar - 4% Startup Hit, 10-11% Mortar Hit%
Watch it in Action: 0:25 http://www.gametrailers.com/player/29935.html
Explanation: Snake quickly pulls out a mortar and fires it directly above him. If someone is close to Snake when he takes out the mortar it WILL hit them and pop them up, right into the actual mortar shell. The shell goes about twice his body height and falls back to the ground if it doesn’t hit someone on the way up. The longer you charge this move the higher the Mortar goes. When it falls back to the ground it explodes on contact, whether or not it always falls in the same direction is unknown.

Possible Uses/Strategy: Well, the move comes out a lot quicker than it looks, but for the most part it still seems very easy to dodge. This doesn’t make this move useless by any means though. It’s very possible that you can make use of this move after an uptilt or short hopped up-air. The best part about this move is the fact that if you use it on an opponent and miss, there’s a second chance. If they dodge, or if you happen to miss after an attack and they just fall to the ground, the mortar may strike them on the way down or the explosion may catch them when it hit’s the ground. Also, this move CAN hit people near Snake and pop them up into the actual Mortar, so do not be afraid to use this move if someone isn't in the air above you. Additionally, Snake starts charging the Smash once the device is placed on the ground, so if you hit a heavier character with the first hit, you can charge the Smash for a couple seconds while they get launched up and begin to fall, then release the Smash. This could be a nice way to land a charged Smash. Also, if you up-throw a fastfaller you may be able to whip this bad boy out, pop them right back up and into your Mortar. This move will take some experimenting but it has tons of potential. Also, if you want to keep your opponent on edge, you can charge this and fire this off during the fight. This may be helpful because as the Mortar comes down the opponent will likely block, in which case you can grab. Or, if they're dodging or trying to counter they could get caught by the Mortar. The best time for this may be as your opponent is coming back to the stage. That way you can go for an attack, and if you miss, the mortar has a second chance to hit them. All in all, not all of this may be practical, but it's stuff to think about.



>Down Smash - Land Mine - 18%
Watch it in Action: - Burrying the Mine
1:12 http://www.gametrailers.com/player/29932.html
0:59 http://www.gametrailers.com/player/25841.html
0:03 http://www.gametrailers.com/player/29935.html
- Mine Exploding
1:17 http://www.gametrailers.com/player/29932.html
Explanation: Snake kneels down and plants a Land Mine at his feet. This move is absolutely excellent. burying the mine doesn’t take too long and once its set in place the mine is barely visible. The damage and knock back are pretty good so this move should definitely be abused by any Snake player. It seems that Snake can be hurt by his own Land Mines though, so make sure you watch your own step after planting them.

Possible Uses/Strategy: Strategically placing mines will likely lead to victory, since mines give the ability to do many things.
1) Edgeguard, obviously. Placing mines on the edge while edge hogging puts the opponent in a sticky situation. If the C4 can be detonated in midair, you may even be able to place C4 right next to the mine and drop of the edge to detonate it if they try to recover past the mine. Of course, I’m getting ahead of myself.
2) Control platforms. Placing a mine on a platform, especially a small one, may cause the opponent to change their strategy drastically. Any smart opponent will know that going to a mine-clad platform could result in danger, especially if Snake gets close enough to grab them and potentially drop them (via juggle or grab) on the mine.
3) Limit options. If you place a mine on a ground and your opponent falls, this makes tech-chasing very good for Snake. Say, for example, you know you have a mine on the stage. If you use Snake’s downthrow (he simply lays his opponent on the ground) or any move that ends with your opponent on the ground you now seem to have the upper hand. They obviously will not tech or roll towards the mine so either they tech/roll towards Snake (which would result in another grab or a fierce attack) or get up (most likely) so you can anticipate and grab again or attack them. Also, imagine using this in conjunction with C4. C4 is one way, land mine is another… no way out.

The possibilities for this move are endless. I’ll stop there.

AERIAL ATTACKS

>Neutral A (Aerial) - 4 Kicks - Individual Kicks (first three) (4-6%), Final Kick (14%)
Watch it in Action: 1:17 http://www.gametrailers.com/player/29932.html
Explanation: Three spinning kicks (much like C. Falcon’s neutral A in Melee) followed by one last kick that’s a bit higher than the others. In the video it shows Snake do this move to Pit and land all 4 hits, taking his damage from 22% to 51%. This seems like a ridiculous amount, but in other gameplay videos you can see Fox land a lot of hits from his forward air (which combos now, unlike Melee) and do around 30%, so I think this may actually be legit.

Possible Uses/Strategy: All in all it seems like a pretty solid move. The amount of attacks, if short hopped in front of an enemy, ensures they likely wont ground dodge and definitely cant take too many countermeasures. Additionally, this move can very likely be used after popping your opponent up (via uptilt, or perhaps even down tilt) for a reliable way to land all 4 hits of this move. Not too shabby for a neutral A.

>Forward Aerial - Giant Axe Kick - 14-15%
Watch it in Action: 0:58 http://www.gametrailers.com/player/29935.html
1:28 http://www.gametrailers.com/player/19856.html
Explanation: Snake stretches his leg above his head and brings it back down, in traditional axe kick fashion. While it is seen in the second trailer hitting Link into the ground (which causes him to pop up) it is also seen hitting Mario and making him fly upward, diagonally. I think the attack will send the opponent downards if they’re caught by the end of the kick (Link instance), but will send them upward diagonally if they get hit right as the kick starts coming down from above Snake’s head (Mario instance).

Possible Uses/Strategy: This move is very, very slow to start up. In that way it really reminds me of DK’s forward air, so jumping at your opponent with this attack in mind may not be the best idea. Of course, this move may have some nice uses, especially since it seems to pop grounded opponents up. If you can land this move on the ground you can likely grab or as shown in the second trailer, attack out of it. I think the best use for this would be to spike recovering opponents (assuming my prediction about where it sends your opponent is correct). This move will probably have a boatload of priority and the range is actually quite nice (as always, thanks to Snake’s turbo legs), so going off the stage to nail your opponent with this beast of a kick may result in a killer spike. Of course, you could be shooting Nikitas, throwing grenades, planting mines, or chasing with a different, more reliable aerial (back or neutral) instead…. Who knows, this move may be much more useful than it appears.

>Back Aerial - Back Kick - 16%
Watch it in Action: 0:07 http://www.gametrailers.com/player/29935.html
Explanation: Snake stretches his legs backwards, kind of like Mario’s, and kicks the opponent with both legs. Unlike Mario’s, this attack doesn’t seem to linger much and instead puts a decent amount of force into one quick hit.

Possible Strategy/Uses: Of course, thanks to the range of Snake’s legs, this move becomes a very formidable aerial for attacking. Not only can this probably be used as a great kill move, but it can also be a very safe method of attacking. Since Snake stretches his very long legs backwards, if you SHFF this move, when you land, you’ll likely be a decent distance from the enemy, making it hard for them to really counter.

>Up Aerial - Upward Stomp - 11%
Watch it in Action: 1:19 http://www.gametrailers.com/player/29932.html

Explanation: This move pretty much just looks like Captain Falcon’s down-air, except Snake is stomping upwards. It doesn’t really look like a bad move but its knock back seemed to be lacking. Of course, this isn’t necessarily a bad thing, since if the knock back isn’t that great you may be able to land two of them consectuvely in a nice juggle. Also, since Snake’s body is huge and he’s a very tall guy, the range on this move is pretty nice.

Possible Uses/Strategy: Basic juggles, maybe something that could lead into a follow up aerial. It doesn't seem like that great of a KO move, it didn't send DK too far and he was at a pretty high percent.

>Down Aerial - Multiple Stomps - First 3 Stomps - 4-6% Final Stomp - 8%
Watch it in Action: 1:37 http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=sQHw8TylNvI
3:07 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h-FzSlAnoUs
Explanation: Snake stomps his feet below him four times, with the last stomp being slightly more powerful than the others. We do not know if this combos in the air or if the final hit spikes. We do know that on the ground the final hit has pretty good knockback, enough to kill Dedede at 50% in Shadow Moses. While the stage boundary was somewhat close, Dedede is still a heavyweight at low percent and his knockback was surprising to say the least.

Possible Uses/Strategy: Well, since this attacks is composed of multiple hits, it might catch people who try to air dodge this attack. Of course, since this attack seems to be at least a little lengthy and Snake isn't the quickest jumper (making a swift C.Falcon shorthop stomp nigh impossible), I think it's safe to say this attack may take the back seat for edgeguarding to his back aerial or his specials/smashes. This move may be somewhat useful if you fall and use it after releasing your Cypher near the top of the stage (assuming you need a safe way to land without a pesty guarder). This move also has a lot of potential in other areas, thanks to its duration and knockback. Since it's particularly long and has really good knockback on the ground, shorthopping in someones face and using this move could prove to be a good tactic. Since Snake stomps multiple times ground dodging will likely be impossible, and if they roll you can still jump away or land and counter. Additionally, if you're facing an opponent whos recovery is primarily vertical (take Dedede for instance), its possible that you can edgeguard him pretty easily by watching his movement. Once the characters jumps are expended you can drop off the stage and begin Snake's down aerial. Since the recovery of said characters are vertical and they're obviously trying to get back on stage, you know they'll be coming up at you. Since Snake's down-air lasts a while you could simply drop down and start his down-air and when they use their upB they'll run right into it. The reason this seems so much more effective for edgeguarding than other people's d-airs is because with Snake's you do wouldn't need any timing. For example, Falcon's stomp is quick, you'd need to time it in order to spike someone. Since Snake's down-air is multiple hits you can drop off, use it, and feel confident that they'll up-B by the time he is finished stomping. Of course, if this move has horrendous priority, that could throw this entire theory out the window, but on paper it sounds decent. All in all, the dynamics of this move could really make or break it.

SPECIAL ATTACKS



>Standard B - Grenade Throw - Hit without explosion: 3%, Explosion: 12%
Watch it in Action: 1:30 http://www.gametrailers.com/player/29932.html
0:24 http://www.gametrailers.com/player/29935.html
Explanation: Pressing B will cause Snake to pull the pin on a grenade. He will carry the grenade in-hand until it explodes, so make sure to always get rid of it before you cause unnecessary damage to yourself. You can throw this grenade at three different ranges; far, medium, and short. The distance you throw the grenade depends on which direction you tilt the control stick (with the furthest throw being achieved by holding forward and the short underhand toss being the result of the stick tilting back). The grenade explodes once the timer is up, seemingly regardless of whether or not it strikes anyone. If Snake is in the vicinity of the grenade explosion, much like Link's bombs, it will hurt him. (as seen hurting him at :36 -- http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=sQHw8TylNvI)

Possible Uses/Strategy: The funny thing about this move is, it seems that unlike Links bombs these grenades will not explode upon contact. Snake is seen throwing a grenade, Pit gets hit and simply falls on the ground (after taking 3 damage) and the grenade proceeds to bounce on his head before landing on the floor. The explosion is actually pretty large and the knock back isn’t stellar, but can probably set up for a nice aerial or follow up at lower percents. Since you can throw this grenade so many distances, it’ll easily be Snake’s most reliable projectile. While there may be better ways to edge guard, since you can throw this grenade so many distances there’ll be a huge range in which you can effectively pelt grenades at your recovering opponents. Of course, if you keep throwing them quick they likely wont explode, but it might actually cause your opponent to lose a little height or mess up their recovery in general. Time will tell, but all in all it appears to be a very useful move.



>Side B - Nikita Missile - 8-12%
Watch it in Action: 0:22 http://www.gametrailers.com/player/29935.html
2:42 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h-FzSlAnoUs
Missile Being Canceled - 0:21 http://youtube.com/watch?v=fCQWwvZYE1c
Explanation: Snake pulls out a rocket launcher and fires a controlled missile called the Nikita. Using the joystick (or d-pad, or whatever you use to move when you play), you may control this missile in a very similar fashion to Ness/Lucas’ PK Thunder. Just like in the MGS games, the Nikita gains speed if it travels in the same direction for a short length of time. This move can be canceled by pressing the shield button but canceling the missile causes it to simply fall out of the air and it does not keep the same trajectory. It does however keep the same trajectory if you're hit out of the missile. It does seem somewhat slow and doesn’t have excellent damage. Additionally, using the Nikita mid air doesn't really slow your falling speed, so you may want to avoid this or cancel it quickly after using it.

Possible Uses/Strategy: Unfortunately, the missile just sort of runs out of steam and falls when you cancel it, so there wont be any missile spam or even explode-on-command missiles. They do still explode once they hit the ground though, so at least they don't disappear. Anyway, regardless of that there’s one thing I noticed, the missile does not pop people upwards. There is a lot of video evidence now and there can be no debate, this missile hits people back. Since this missile knocks the enemy back instead of upwards it could be a great edge guarding tool. Also, at higher percents the knockback isn't half bad, so when your opponent is far away and you can't hit them with anything else and you have all the mines you want planted, definitely fire this thing. If you can hit them you'll knock them back and may even keep characters with bad recovery from being able to return. While hunting recovering enemies they'll likely try to air dodge, so faking them out by making the missile change direction for a split second, then resuming your course could fool them into air dodging prematurely. This move has a lot of potential.



>Down B - C4 - 17%
Watch it in Action: - Planting: 4:44 (right after the throw), Detonation: 4:46 http://www.gametrailers.com/player/29932.html
Explanation: Snake plants a clearly visible brick of C4 on the ground. This mine, unlike your Land Mine, is controlled by a remote held by Snake, so it seems that this mine will not go off unless you tell it to. Additionally, there have been reports saying any B move will detonate the mine once planted, so this could be problematic. Once the B button is pressed again Snake detonates the mine. We don’t know whether the C4 can be detonated in the air, but I’m assuming it can. Keep in mind, detonating the C4 at your feet can hurt you, so make sure you're a safe distance before using it.

Potential Uses/Strategy: If you aren’t a fan of his grenades or the Nikita it definitely wouldn’t hurt to keep a C4 out at all times. C4, much like your land mine, can mess with your opponents and lock down their choices in terms of movement. Here are a few simple things you could do with C4.
1) Plant near the edge, right next to a Land Mine, and edge hog. If your opponent recovers past the mine it may be possible for you to drop down and detonate it without dying. If not you can either try to roll up and detonate or edge hop and detonate to ensure they take the hit. This might not be completely reliable, or it could be awesome.
2) Place it across from a Land Mine on a single platform. Why oh why would you put both mines on one platform? Well, if you happen to hit or throw any enemy onto that platform, no matter which way they tech or what they do, they’re pretty much guaranteed to get blown up. It might be something to consider.
3) Plant it on a separate platform from another mine and try to keep your opponent uneasy about platforms.

Of course, randomly throwing around the C4 in the hopes that you can happen to hit your opponent into it works too. Y’never know where an opponent will be sent flying, they very well may fly right into an explosive.



>Up B - Cypher - 0%
Watch it in Action: 0:00, 1:06 (you can see him attack after) http://www.gametrailers.com/player/29935.html
Explanation: Snake grabs his recon camera and begins to float into the air. It appears that the Cypher will always float upwards and you merely have control of his horizontal movement. The Cypher travels pretty quick and Snake can attack afterwards (1:06), so it may actually be a very viable recovery.

Possible Strategy/Uses: To avoid edge guards, assuming the Cypher has no damaging properties whatsoever, it may be wise to just float to a very high distance away from the edge, then move over the stage and drop down on your enemy. This way you can dodge or counter an attack that may come up at you while falling back to the stage. The reason this may be a good option is because it beats trying to fly back on the edge while holding onto the Cypher and essentially being a sitting duck. On a side note, the Cypher looks like an excellent way to avoid Final Smashes by simply flying away over and over. Also, it appears that for a decent portion of the Cypher Snake has super armor. This is great news considering Snake is a very tall guy, and is a huge target when his entire body is stretched out. This will negate any projectiles that may come your way. Also, if you're high enough while returning you may be able to cancel the Cypher as their attack ends and stomp them a few times. That is purely speculation though.

GRAB/THROWS

>Grab Attack - “Neck Snap” - 3%
Watch it in Action: 1:01 http://www.gametrailers.com/player/25841.html
1:25 http://www.gametrailers.com/player/30197.html
Explanation: Snake jerks the opponents head back in what appears to be a neck-snapping fashion. Technically, I believe he’s just cutting off oxygen and knocking them out, but it’s just more fun to label this the neck snap. Snake is seen using the downthrow (laying the opponent on the ground) without the neck snap beforehand, so it’s now confirmed that this is his grab attack.

>Forward Throw - Forward Snapmare - 9%
Watch it in Action: :04 (1P does it to 2P) http://youtube.com/watch?v=gj6QT2kuT2M
1:06 (1P does it to 2P) http://youtube.com/watch?v=gj6QT2kuT2M
Explanation: Snake moves the opponent behind his back, grabs them by the neck, and hurls them over his shoulder.

Possible Uses/Strategy: This move is pretty much your standard forward-throw, which means it has standard forward-throw uses. The most famous use for a forward-throw is to get opponents out of your face and create a little room for yourself. This time you gain can be used planting a mine, pulling the pin on a grenade, or setting up for a different attack in some way. Don't forget that forward and backwards throws can be used to toss opponents into mines, so if you see a mine is close you can throw them on it, or if its a C4, throw them at it and detonate.

>Back Throw - Snapmare - 9%
Watch it in Action: 3:14 (3Player does it to 2P) http://youtube.com/watch?v=gj6QT2kuT2M
Explanation: Snake grabs the opponent by the neck, turns around, and slings them over his shoulder.

Possible Uses/Strategy: This move is pretty much your standard back-throw, which means it has standard backthrow uses. The most famous use for a backthrow is to get opponents off the stage at early percents for some quick KOs. Of course, everyone knows this. Don't forget that forward and backwards throws can be used to toss opponents into mines, so if you see a mine is close you can throw them on it, or if its a C4, throw them at it and detonate.

>Up Throw - Suplex - 11%
Watch it in Action: 0:50 http://www.gametrailers.com/player/25841.html
3:30 http://www.gametrailers.com/player/usermovies/170539.html
Explanation: Snake drops back and suplexes the opponent. The suplex appears to pop enemies straight up above him.

Possible Uses/Strategy: Right off the bat it’s easy to see that the throw pops the opponent right into Snake’s UpSmash/UpTilt zone. While we can’t be sure of Mario’s percent, I think it’s safe to say that on average opponents will end up there. At earlier percents, for damage building, it may be possible to Up Tilt once or twice and follow up with a 4-hit Neutral A. At higher percents or with lighter characters it may even be possible to land an UpSmash on them (whether it be on the way up or way down). So, while it isn’t an easy way to get opponents of the stage, this throw does seem to have a lot of potential.

>Down Throw - Opponent Laying - 13%
Watch it in Action: 4:44 http://www.gametrailers.com/player/29932.html
Explanation: Snake simply lays his opponent on the ground… he’s actually quite gentle about it. Once the opponent is comfortably situated on the floor their damage meter just pops up by 13%. How silly.

Possible Uses/Strategy: This move has the potential to be really annoying. Since Snake lays his opponent on the ground I’m unsure if it’s even possible for your enemy to tech. If the opponent can not tech this move sets up for the most annoying chain grab in the entire game. Here are some ways you can potentially make use of this throw.
1) Lay the opponent down. They will either roll away in either direction, or get up. If you have no mines set up you can just await their decision and react. If they roll towards you in either direction its very possible that you can chase them and grab when they get up, or attack with a dash attack. If they simply get up you can shield grab them. How annoying for them.
2) If you have a mine on the ground this severely limits their decisions. They obviously will not roll towards the mine, so you know they’ll either roll the other way or get up. With this much knowledge of their options, reacting to their movements should be cake.
3) If you want to be tricky you can try to lay your opponent down between two mines, completely negating any options they have. Of course, this can be hard, but you can always try to quickly roll backwards and plant a C4 if you have a Land Mine on the other side of them before they can react. If they roll towards you while planting the C4 you can grab or if you have the time detonate it, if they choose to get up there may be a small window for a chase.

As always, I’m getting ahead of myself, but at least there are some ideas.

EXTRAS

http://www.smashbros.com/en_us/characters/images/snake/snake_080110d-l.jpg

>Final Smash - Grenade Launcher - 18-19% per hit
Watch it in Action: 2:13 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h-FzSlAnoUs
Explanation: Snake hops onto the ladder of a support chopper and takes aim at the stage. You can manually aim and fire your grenade launcher at your enemies. The Final Smash ends after 12 shots or after a certain time limit. The grenades can be fired in about one second intervals and about half a second to reach the stage. Since you can see precisely where Snake is aiming and the grenades aren't instant, they can often be avoided by single opponents.

Potential Uses/Strategy: Since their knockback isn't unbelievable, especially with an opponent that is either heavy or at low percent, you'll want to consider when and how to use this Final Smash. Timing could very well mean everything, popping this one when everyone is at 0% could prove end up fruitless, but if you wait until your opponent(s) have some damage on them, you may be able to clean up. In a one on one match you'll want to shoot not where they're at, but where' they're going to be since the grenades can be dodged without too much trouble, especially by faster characters. Look for openings, like when they land after jumps or if they roll. Of course, always make sure to fire at anyone vulnerable, especially in a 4-man.

>Wall Kick
Watch it in Action: 1:37 (Watch 1P) http://youtube.com/watch?v=gj6QT2kuT2M
It appears that Snake can wall kick, which is always a nice technique to have. Wall Kicks have a variety of uses and since Snake's Up-B lets him recover from a Wallkick just fine (unlike Samus or Mario's in Melee), using this to attack many not be a bad idea.

http://www.smashbros.com/en_us/howto/technique/images/technique07/technique07_071113j-l.jpg

>Taunt 1 - Box
Explanation: Snake retreats into his box. It’s unsure whether or not he can move while inside the box. It appears that Snake can make a dramatic entrance out of the box as well, this will likely be by using that taunt again or perhaps just pressing any button.

>Taunt 2 - Box

>Taunt 3 - Box. I'm dead serious. =(

Victory Pose 1 - Snake crawls towards the camera and rolls into a kneeling position. He then says something. You can see it here.
http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=YmFhcebChAI

Victory Pose 2 - Snake appears from beneath his box, just like his introduction in the very first trailer.
3:55 http://www.gametrailers.com/player/usermovies/170539.html

Codec Conversations

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=03ScdNs0-8A
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=30zcBpIg2wk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xe0moMrOsnI
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4lUo3BcrDOA


CLOSING

Well, there you have it. I hope this compendium is useful to some of you, if anyone has anything they'd like to add, please do. I really encourage discussion about Snake, his moves, and potential strategies.
 

SolidSonic

Smash Ace
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Messages
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Welcome to the forum, very informative post.

-Actually didn't know about the roll attack, but now that I think about that makes sense. I think the move will be good for hitting someone, then immediately popping down in order to dodge a projectile. It could have that dual purpose to it, if you can preempt when an opponent is going to throw or shoot something. Hopefully he pops back up from the crawl quickly enough.

-One thing I'm wondering is how long his up-B lasts and how high it goes..
 

Dudechapguyman

Smash Cadet
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Messages
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I'd like to bring up this image:



Now, that appears to be Snake's Nikita. However, he's clearly standing upright and aiming it upwards at Mario. I just can't work out where this fits in to his move set. But I feel it's something that needs to be mentioned.

I've also noticed something about Snake's mine. The time it takes for him to bury it seems to vary.

It takes him the shortest amount of time in this video (0:03):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kQ_m0vPVXWo

It takes him slightly longer in this video (1:13):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wG9PSQz610w

And I THINK it takes him even longer in this video (0:59):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cpPFr_9Cci0

The only explanation I've come up with for that is that Snake's mine is chargeable, and that the charging animation isn't the standard "freeze in place and blink yellow" as it is with all other smash attacks. I believe that the charging animation for Snake's mine is actually Snake digging. This is important to note, because it means if you want to charge Snake's mine, you don't have to go through the charging animation, and then the digging animation, because the digging animation IS the charging animation.

It's just something I feel is worth adding to the mine's section. The charging is just speculation, so it's probably better to just leave that out, but there's no doubt that the burying time varies.
 

Yes!!

Smash Rookie
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Messages
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Well, about the picture. I think all he's doing is taking out the Nikita, because when he uses it he pulls it out over his shoulder and drops to one knee, which appears to be exactly what he's doing in the screenshot. Since you can aim the Nikita manually anyway, I doubt he'd be able to shoot at an upwards angle. That show was just taken as he is pulling it out.

I do think you're onto something with the Downsmash though. The digging time may fluctuate and I'm actually curious as to how it effects the Smash itself. I wonder if digging more makes the mine less visible, more powerful, or both. I'm almost positive you're right about the digging being the actual charge time.
 

tirkaro

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I'd like to bring up this image:



Now, that appears to be Snake's Nikita. However, he's clearly standing upright and aiming it upwards at Mario. I just can't work out where this fits in to his move set. But I feel it's something that needs to be mentioned.
Thats actually just him taking the nikita out. If you pay attenion to the animation for that attack, he grabs it somewhere from behind him, and puts it on his shoulder. The screenshot just makes it look like he's shooting mario.

Oh, and to the TC, great post, especially for a first post! 0_0. very in-deph.
 

Kruton

Smash Ace
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Messages
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I always hypothesized Snake's mines as big edge guard helpers while also edge guarding with Snake himself. It wouldn't hurt to simply plant a C4 next to the ledge and edge hog.
 

WarMachine

Smash Apprentice
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Messages
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I have a feeling that Snake is going to be a monster edge guarder. Not to mention that 2 mines, crazy smash attacks, and grenades that don't instantly explode on contact are going to make for some serious mind games.

Certainly going to be a unique character to play as.
 

Archenyte

Smash Journeyman
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Messages
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Welcome to the smash boards! =) I wish I did as good of a job on my thread as yours though. I liked how in the five minute video, snake used the laying down grab to put link on a C4 then activated it.
 

Chepe

Smash Lord
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Messages
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AMAZING Snake thread and should finally clear up the whole landmin/C4/kneefist debates. One thing I noticed that I believe you missed though:

In the 5 minute video, when Link attacks Snake out of his Side B, the missile DOES NOT just disappear, it does keep going where it was aiming. You can see the missile flying straight up and away (getting close to Snake at one point as he flies around) after he is hit by Link. If you cant see it, then save that Gametrailers video so you can see it in a bigger window (keeping its quality intact).

So if you are hit by someone, it continues on its path, but shielding might still be a different case...
 

Yes!!

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Chepe, I paused it and went frame by frame. Excellent catch, I totally missed it flying up off the stage. I'll make sure to modify my original post accordingly.

If anyone else catches anything make sure to let me know, this thread is for the good of Snake players everywhere. =)
 

NeoZ

Smash Ace
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Messages
955
Good post, and it's nice to have all the info in one place.
Also the C4 is NOT A MINE, as a lot of people have been saying, so it might be better if you change it in order to avoid further confusion.
 

LaniusShrike

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Huh. Hey, great job., I read it all. Snake really will be awesomely unique, won't he?
 

SmashBro99

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Nice, reading through this actually makes me really wanna try him out.
 

Yes!!

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Neo, in my description of C4 I made sure to mention that it was really just a brick of C4, I called it a mine to make it easier for those who were confused. I'm sure to people who don't really know much about military weaponry, they're just two mines and that's the end of it, so explaining that to them by saying "He has C4 an a Mine" may not have gotten the point across.

You're technically right though so I'll definitely make some changes to that once I get the Edit Post button to work. Has it been malfunctioning for anyone else? Every time I try to edit my post it doesn't really work.


qdMbp, most definitely. Snake is one of the most unique characters this game has seen, I think much like Olimar, using Snake effictively will rely heavily on strategy. He's also, in many ways, like a more expansive Link in that learning when and how to use all of his tools is absolutely necessary. I cant wait to try him out.

By the way, thanks to everyone for the positive feedback.
 
D

Deleted member

Guest
Very nice thread. I'm looking forward to playing as Snake very much, and this stuff that you posted is fun for me to think about.
 

Formless

Smash Cadet
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I wonder if his down smash explodes right away if there's someone next to Snake, probably won't.
 

NeoZ

Smash Ace
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Messages
955
Neo, in my description of C4 I made sure to mention that it was really just a brick of C4, I called it a mine to make it easier for those who were confused. I'm sure to people who don't really know much about military weaponry, they're just two mines and that's the end of it, so explaining that to them by saying "He has C4 an a Mine" may not have gotten the point across.

You're technically right though so I'll definitely make some changes to that once I get the Edit Post button to work. Has it been malfunctioning for anyone else? Every time I try to edit my post it doesn't really work.


By the way, thanks to everyone for the positive feedback.
I think most people nowadays might know what C4 is(mainly due to games and movies), but it's true not everyone would understand just by saying "Snake has C4".
And about the edit button, each time I press it my post goes blank and I can't edit, to fix this I just press edit again to go advanced and edit it.
 

Yes!!

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I updated the Compendium.

Updates:
1) Snake's Down Aerial added with video evidence and everything.
2) Dash attack confirmation, video included.
3) Edited Nikita details.
4) Edited Grenade details.
5) Edited Mine wording.
6) Added new Victory Pose, video included.

I think that's about it.
 

Jeff Highwind

Smash Ace
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Messages
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I cant find the video, but I remember seeing a demo vid where Snake was fighting Link at Shadow Moses and Snake's UAir looked somthing akin to (I cant believe I am saying this) Terry Bogart's rising tackle from the Fatal Fury games.

I dont see how the Up Smash would be any good unless you can angle the trajectory or the knockback is extremely nuts. For the FSmash though I wonder if you can do 2/3 of his AAA combo then go into the Fmash, that would be one evil trick.

And for the Down throw, it's a neck snap. That's where the 13% comes from, you can tell from his intro vid where he snaps mario's neck and the demo vid I mentioned if I can ever find the **** thing. The strategy for it though would be rather ingenious. Dsmash and/or Down+B in a place, bait your opponent then Down throw your opponent on the mine, activate then UAir them for a KO.
 

Dudechapguyman

Smash Cadet
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Messages
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A few new developments.

Each shot of Snake's grenade launcher does 19%, as seen in this video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h-FzSlAnoUs

Also in that video, we see that the Nikita works the same as it does in the Metal Gear games. If the missile has been traveling in the same direction for long enough, it will get a sudden drastic speed boost.

We also get a nice shot of Snake's neutral aerial KOing Dedede at 50%.

Edit: That might be Snake's down aerial KOing Dedede. I can't tell.
 

Yes!!

Smash Rookie
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Messages
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Alright, updated again with...

1) Very large update to the Down-Aerial section.
2) Small modification to the Nikita missile.
 

Yes!!

Smash Rookie
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Messages
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HUGE Update, I've added...

>Added info to the C4 and Land Mines, apparently they CAN hurt Snake.
>Damage for Uptilt added
>Nikita Missile Canceling mystery SOLVED. It simply loses its thrust and falls to the ground if you cancel it. Because of this dynamic I've pretty much completely changed the Nikita Missile section, so if you're interested definitely reread that.
>Update on the Up-Smash, it IS a 2-Part smash, the initial hit (him taking out the mortar) can pop you upwards into the mortar for a nice combo. As always I have video footage with times of this and every other move.
>Throws COMPLETE. I was wrong about the Suplex, apparently that is Snake's UPTHROW. Both the Back and Forward throw are shown in a video, which I made sure to post for you guys.
>F-Smash updated, it does not shoot off the stage, if you shoot it at the edge it still just explodes there, as assumed.
>Tons of new and interesting Dash Attack information. Its a bit of a mystery-move at the moment because it can apparently knock you all over. New video evidence of this and speculation are up, plus damage recordings for it.
>Uptilt and Downtilt damage were added and a better video shot of the downtilt in action is also up.
>Snake can apparently Wall Kick, I posted a video with a time to check under the "EXTRAs," you guys are free to see for yourselves.
>Did anyone noticed that the picture for Snake's Land Mine has been changed? It now looks somewhat futuristic... how strange.

I believe that's all folks, we now know all of Snake's moves, we're only missing a couple damage percents, taunts, and victory poses. Enjoy, I'll keep checking sources for info.


colbus; definitely. I'll be out there. =)
 

Dudechapguyman

Smash Cadet
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Messages
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Just to clarify, can Snake trigger his own mines by walking over them? Or were you saying that he's hurt by the explosion if somebody else triggers them? If Snake can trigger his own mines, then it seems like it'd be an almost useless attack, because it gives the opponent just as much advantage as it gives you.
 

Yes!!

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From what I've seen in videos, which keep in mind are of terrible quality with a lot of commotion, it appears that Snake can trigger his own mines by stepping on them. While that is annoying, you still have the advantage of choosing where and when they're placed. I may be wrong, and I really hope I am here, but if not I don't think the move is entirely useless.

Also, if there's a place that's advantageous to your opponent you can keep them from going there by placing a mine. Additionally, Snake's recovery also gives him a lot more freedom, so I don't think they'll bother him too much when recovering.

We'll have to try things out once we get our hands on the game, or at least wait for some more proof.
 

Eternal Yoshi

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Excellent thread. Keep updating whenever possible. I'm still wondering how much damage the neck snap can do and if his grab range is as good as Marth's.
 

lanky_gunner

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I'm going to suggest adding these, because they are a part of Snake's character-

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=03ScdNs0-8A

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=30zcBpIg2wk

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xe0moMrOsnI

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4lUo3BcrDOA

these are all of Snake's codec messages. unfortunetely, it's all in Japanese, so i can't understand what they're saying. but it's cool to watch. but what i wonder is HOW to do the technique...

i've heard all you do is crouch (like you see at the beginning of each clip) in front of the character, and it starts automatically after a set amount of time

anyway, just a thought. good to add to the first post
 

XACE-K

Smash Master
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Excellent thread and Snake looks like an awesome character which is why I want to main him.
 

Yes!!

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Updated With...

1) Grab Attack ("Neck Snap") damage (3%) plus a video where you can see him use it on Pit.
2) Codec Conversations (japanese) added.
3) Victory Pose 2 Added
4) Damage percent for Upthrow added (11)
 

PsychoMidget

Smash Lord
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box taunt can hit your enemy when u throw the box away, i believe it does 1% and has very small knock back

i loled
 

SolidSonic

Smash Ace
Joined
Oct 13, 2007
Messages
652
urghh.. how come we still don't know what his other two taunts are? All people ever use in the vids is his box taunt. lol
 

jellis186

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Oct 13, 2007
Messages
82
To add a bit of info with the cypher, when you first activate it, you are vulnerable, but after the cypher gets flying, Snake gains super armor similar to Ike's aether attack

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zpDccgdrHkM (2:18)

Edit:

In that same movie, you can see that after planting c4, using another B move will not set it off (3:16)
 

Yes!!

Smash Rookie
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Updated with some EXTREMELY disappointing news.

1) ALL of Snake's taunts are the Box. I have confirmed this first hand, so make no mistake about this.
2) Updated Snake's Super Armor during the Cypher
3) Added the extended length of the Mortar when charged.
 

SolidSonic

Smash Ace
Joined
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Messages
652
Updated with some EXTREMELY disappointing news.

1) ALL of Snake's taunts are the Box. I have confirmed this first hand, so make no mistake about this.
I'm not going to be shy about this, thats just plain f**king lazy on the devs part.

Wow.

Perhaps some hope remains for the western version of the game though?!
 
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