mew2 bottom tier

[kailo34ce]

is there any amount of short hopping and wave dashing that can that can make mew2 higher on the tier list

[MookieRah]

Wavedashing, l-canceling, and double jump canceling (aka DJC) make M2. If you can get that stuff down pat then you will be able to beat dudes with him. As for his tier placement, he isn't really bottom tier matierial. So don't worry about it. If you enjoy playing him, then play him.

[kailo34ce]

so i guess your a m2 fan.....i guess at some point we all were....i dont like mew2 but i would really like to fight a good m2

[MetaKnight0]

aaaaaa Mewtwo is bottom tier material >_>

Really, there's no amount of technical skill you can do to make Mewtwo better. In fact, to stand up to the other characters, Mewtwo is pretty much expected to do them. Using the moves he has in innovative or smart ways is a different matter.

[eMs]

well i think mew2 will take over the top tier before the new game comes out!

kailo: YOU LIKE IT

[MookieRah]

aaaaaa Mewtwo is bottom tier material >_>

Stop playing games Meta, you know that isn't true. Mewtwo isn't a great character, but he doesn't suck as much as the tier list credits him. I find it hard to believe that I would have soooo much skill with M2 that makes me win with a character deserving of bottom tier. I am not that conceited. I know from the vid you sent me that you aren't a Mewtwo slacker in the least, so why are you trying to convince these people that he is bottom tier? That makes no sense yo.

Really, there's no amount of technical skill you can do to make Mewtwo better. In fact, to stand up to the other characters, Mewtwo is pretty much expected to do them. Using the moves he has in innovative or smart ways is a different matter.

That much is true. Mewtwo is complete crap at low level play. He only becomes decent after you master wavedashing, l-canceling, and DJC. After that it comes down to character specific knowledge on how to take down certain characters. It's not an easy road to follow, but it isn't *that* hard.

It's time for us all to wake up. It was fun voting M2 as the worst character in the game on the last tier list, but I know it isn't true. The people I have played against knows it isn't true. I knew it when I voted that way, and even moreso now.

[kailo34ce]

eMs: you know you like it

[white peachy]

he's definitely bad, but probably not the worst in the game.

[kailo34ce]

you know its a kiddie game and YOU LIKE IT

[eMs]

Maybe it is a kiddie game... But it I was a game developer and I was making a "kiddie game" I would definately want it to be as good as this one.

"GAWK "
"HE ALMOST SAID IT"

[kailo34ce]

shhhh......if you be quiet he'll come down and play


and if i made a kiddie game you would kill eachother by throwing bombs and shoot eachother with guns just like in this kiddie game

[white peachy]

haha ok here's the story.
so i'm playing this kid, who thinks he's real good at fighters, but he never really played smash except for fun. so i 5 stocked him 1 on 1, and he said "super smash brothers melee is a kiddie game, come play me in street fighter!!!" i laughed, and the sig was born.

on a serious note, mewtwo is good if you're good and you practice you're *** off with him, if you suck though, mewtwo realllly sucks.

[kailo34ce]

mewtwo rules YOU LIKE IT

[MetaKnight0]

Originally posted by MookieRah
Stop playing games Meta, you know that isn't true. Mewtwo isn't a great character, but he doesn't suck as much as the tier list credits him. I find it hard to believe that I would have soooo much skill with M2 that makes me win with a character deserving of bottom tier. I am not that conceited. I know from the vid you sent me that you aren't a Mewtwo slacker in the least, so why are you trying to convince these people that he is bottom tier? That makes no sense yo.



That much is true. Mewtwo is complete crap at low level play. He only becomes decent after you master wavedashing, l-canceling, and DJC. After that it comes down to character specific knowledge on how to take down certain characters. It's not an easy road to follow, but it isn't *that* hard.

It's time for us all to wake up. It was fun voting M2 as the worst character in the game on the last tier list, but I know it isn't true. The people I have played against knows it isn't true. I knew it when I voted that way, and even moreso now.

Honestly, we both play Mewtwo very well. You're a lot more dedicated to him than I am, so you're obviously more prone to having to know match-ups better.

I play Fox/Mario/Marth as my real mains. However, I've played Mewtwo long enough to know what he can and can't do. I know Mewtwo can beat stuff like Marth or Zelda or Young Link or with enough practice. However, it's an entirely uphill battle with Mewtwo, as well as against a lot of the cast. If Mewtwo has an entirely uphill battle against a good chunk of the cast, it says a lot.

I think Mewtwo's biggest problems are:

1. His weight
2. His relative inability to create openings.

It's especially the last one that makes me think Mewtwo is bottom or close to it. In an offensive metagame, not being able to make an opening really hurts.

I'm not trying to sway people against Mewtwo. I just say how I see it.

[Diddy Kong]

People... The fight doesn't plays on the character select screen...
You can beat every character with every character so that mean Mewtwo can beat Falco and those other dip****s.

And... Mewtwo isn't worthless if you can't Wavedash. I can't Wavedash and I swear my Mewtwo is a killer machine. But anyway if you think he's better with the Wavedash can you teach me how to Wavedash then?

[kailo34ce]

like i said before...i really want to fight a good mewtwo...i have no experience at all with a good mewtwo and i would really like to see how i would do againts one..


and i simply dont understand how you could say that mewtwo could take down marth....ive watched alot of vids and mewtwo just doesnt have the speed..

YOU LIKE IT



btw...my mains are marth/fox/peach

[kailo34ce]

in my opinion mewtwo is to zelda as roy is to marth....but in this case i believe that the slower(more powerful) charactor should take the higher position on the tier list

and whats up with the RiTT(roy is top tier) thing ,is it a joke,....or have they not found out that ,compared to marth, roy is obsolete in every way

[MookieRah]

Mewtwo isn't worthless if you can't Wavedash. I can't Wavedash and I swear my Mewtwo is a killer machine.

If you own dudes with M2 without wavedash then you will pwn their mom in the face if you did. Also, to wavedash all you do is jump and immediately press diagonal forward or back and L. What you are attempting to do is air dodge immediately after jumping.


and i simply dont understand how you could say that mewtwo could take down marth

I am quite savvy in this matchup actually, and it's not so bad really. Most people don't know that M2 can totally **** up Marth if he sneaks his way inside of Marth's sword range. Quadrouple fairs are common and backthrows to edgeguard and upthrows to kill ownz marth. If my M2 can hold his own against Husband's Marth then that means something :-P. Of course, that is with the novelty effect. He learned how to rape me after that, but I am not daunted by it, cause I am gonna learn even more ways to rape Marth to make it even again :-P. Also, Husband didn't rape me cause I was M2, he raped me cause he figured out my playstyle. He discovered my tendencies, so in effect the novelty effect will still work if I refined my playstyle and make it more diverse. Since our matchups I have found a few more effective techniques, but nothing really special.

2. His relative inability to create openings.

I don't see this being true for that many cast members. Ganon, Marth, and Samus are about the only people that give me trouble in getting openings. Usually you have to play a really odd defensive agressive style versus them (with the exception of Samus cause I still don't know what to do against her...). It's all about finding their tendencies and exploiting them. A LOT of Marth players use the same basic strategies and techniques and because of that it's easy to exploit the hell out of them cause they really have no ****ing clue what M2 can do to fight back. Peach and Cap "can" present problems due to lots of aerial priority, but if you play your cards right that isn't much of a problem. That said, I still have some big problems with Peach.

[MetaKnight0]

You aren't thinking broad enough. Making an opening can be as simple as having a good air attack with a short-hop.

i.e. Fox, Sheik, Falcon, Bowser, Ganondorf

Or it could be having a good grab
i.e. Marth, Fox, Sheik

Or it could be having a good projectile game
i.e. Link, Samus, Falco

Something like that or a variant (i.e. Fox shine, Mario jab)

The very fact that Mewtwo has to wait until he can exploit tendacies really solidifies the fact that he doesn't make them. Shadowball is too slow and predictable to be a good approach tactic, his Forward/Neutral Airs don't have forward range (a global trait in many of the higher tier'd character), and even Wavedashing in as an approach is a very risky thing to do. Unless you wavedash in when you see an opening. But that means Mewtwo didn't create his own opening, right?

It's really no matter if your Mewtwo is very skilled and can see openings and force your opponent into creating them for you. However, I'm gonna have to use your Husband example.

From what I gather, he beat you because he saw your tendacies. Speaks volumes to me, because that meant that he wasn't forcing himself into creating openings, which you also incorporate into your playstyle. Now, without Mewtwo's ability to make an opening on the opponent or substantially pressure (kinda), and the opponent no longer making openings for Mewtwo to get into, where is Mewtwo now?

It sounds like an uphill battle for Mewtwo now, which is exactly the point I want to get across. Like I said, I don't want to undermine possible future Mewtwo users, but really, Mewtwo is handicapped.

[MookieRah]

You aren't thinking broad enough. Making an opening can be as simple as having a good air attack with a short-hop.

Umm... dtilt. That is how I set up stuff against pretty much everybody, and it works against pretty much anybody.

Forward/Neutral Airs don't have forward range (a global trait in many of the higher tier'd character), and even Wavedashing in as an approach is a very risky thing to do

The nair doesn't need great forward range, it is VERY useful because it hit's all around M2. If a person has a laggy aerial move like Peach's fair, Cap's nair and dair, Dorf's fair and dair, etc you can easily just jump into the air and nair them as you see them try to pull it out, you have to be quick about it, but it's fun :-P. It's hard to follow up on it with much, but I often chain together a few nairs a lot of the time.

Also, for people like fox and falco, fair is actually an appropriate opener. It is lacking in forward range, but it's got a longer range than many expect.

On another note; It also has super priority and works versus everything Cap has (i dunno about uair, but i have faired through every other cap aerial, so I am pretty sure if timed right it can plow through and uair). It usually combos into itself, so while it isn't something that one can employ to create openings, it definitely can be used to exploit which is normally considered not exploitable.

Or it could be having a good grab

Mewtwo has a good grab game yo. Just ask Kupo, MikeG, Rickr, Aho, Aurafox, etc. Pretty much anyone I played at SAV discovered how effective M2 can be at grabbing dudes. Also, after a grab he can do a lot of things with most characters, ESPECIALLY the space animals. A grab at 10% will more than likely mean that they will end up at 70-80% after my combo is done. 2-4 fairs are pretty rough on a dude. After that they fall into dtilt combos, fair combos, etc. They are also vulnerable to bthrow to edgeguard kills.

From what I gather, he beat you because he saw your tendacies. Speaks volumes to me, because that meant that he wasn't forcing himself into creating openings, which you also incorporate into your playstyle.

The main thing is that he was able to predict my grabs. I didn't mix it up enough. If I threw out some short hop nairs, or delayed fairs when I would have normally have grabbed it wouldn't have been as bad. He also started to play a more defensive game (espicially after I tripple faired him :-p), which is something I am not used too for the most part (I mainly play agressive Marths). Thusly experience against that would allow me to get in more oppertunities.

[kailo34ce]

ive never played a mewtwo that was faster than my marth...and in my opinion its true that "speed kills"

[Umbreon]

:p my mewtwo is faster than your marth. matt's mewtwo is faster than mine.

and for openings you can't argue with SB to dtilt, too good!

[MookieRah]

ive never played a mewtwo that was faster than my marth...and in my opinion its true that "speed kills"

He still has lag, and if you try using nairs i will grab your *** :-P. Also, if M2 gets within Marth's sword range then prepare to eat a large chunk of percent. Marth is combo city for M2.

[kailo34ce]

well at least your confident...

[MookieRah]

I am confident cause I am experienced. I have taken down many Marths already, and it isn't that big of a deal to me to play Marths. In all actuallity the statement M2 counters Marth is true, but under one condition, which is when Mewtwo is inside Marth's range. Outside of it though, it is very much the opposite.

[kailo34ce]

wow..thats cool...im glad to see that there is at least one good mew two out there....and how go do you do againts peach ?

[MookieRah]

A good Peach is a *****. I don't have that much experience against them though.

Samus is also a problem character too.

[Mew2Matteo]

It's about "all flash and no cash," when you play m2. :dizzy:

[kailo34ce]

i decided to train a little with mewtwo earlier.....i got 3-stocled by a level 9 g&w...and i failed to find a decent combo with mewtwo...


to anyone readin this:
if you use mewtwo ,and live in texas,around the houston area.... i would
REALLY like to have a match with you and see how a good mewtwo fights...and btw,mookierah, i use peach as a main...so now i really think i would have the advantage over you

[white peachy]

kailo....mookierah will beat you. especially if...
"i got 3-stocled by a level 9 g&w"....yeah, he will beat you.

[kailo34ce]

goose...its gooses....im sure mookierah can handle himself againts me...but i know all of the tricks i need to know to beat him

[MookieRah]

but i know all of the tricks i need to know to beat him

Why isn't this topic closed yet?

I mean seriously, the only meaningful discussion has passed, and now dudes who haven't been on the boards for a month think they know a lot about a character they trained with for about 5 minutes against a level 9 Game and Watch...

Kailo... please... just stop posting and read the boards for a while. Learn how things go and get some more knowledge on the game before posting, ESPECIALLY before you start talking about how you can beat some dude just because you would have the character advantage in a matchup. That character advantage won't mean **** if the other person greatly eclipses you in skill.

[MetaKnight0]

Level 9 game and watch has to be like the worst thing to train against. You could at least train against a Fox so you can do some combos = T

[white peachy]

mookierah's sig beats your best character.

learn to wavedash and l-cancel all the time and then you'll see why mewtwo can win against, uh, level 9 G&W.

[kailo34ce]

the reason this topic was started is because i beat everyone around here that thought they were good with mewtwo...and i wanted a challenge....i realize that tiers mean nothing but when it comesto mewtwo..well...he just doesnt stand a chance...and whoever thinks that they greatly excell me in exprience or whatever can fight me and we can let that decide

[MookieRah]

I will more than likely be at FC-3. I will take your challenge there. $20 money match? If you are up to it, I am.

If not you can come visit me in Tupelo, MS, cause there is no reason at all for me to go to you.

I forgot who said it, but it's so true; it goes something like this:
"A challenge over the internet on the basis "you come over here and I will play you" is bull**** and doesn't mean crap.

[The Cape]

mooks I played some SAV ppl they says you're mad defensive so what's up with that.

according to them I still got my title =)

edit: **** wrong guy lol I'm at cape's still XD forgot to log out =/

[MookieRah]

I am all about being defensive agressive. I make plenty of my own attacks, but more often than not I take advantage of other people's **** ups. I am generally constantly in their face and if they give me half the chance I knock them around in some crazy combos.

Also, how I play is greatly determined by who I am up against. If I can get away with something safely 90% of the time I do it. I play most defensively against Marths, Roys, Jiggs, Samus, and Peach due to either projectiles, priority, or reach. Other than that, I often go to crazy town :-P.


Who was it that you played Mow?

[emblem pride]

id love to see a M2 beat around a marth

[NJE789]

Against Marth, try triangle jumps- you can avoid a sword attack, then be in perfect range to grab, and you'll be ready to grab long before that sword swing's over.
This requires precise timing and good mindgames, but it works.

You can also CC out of this, and should, if you get tricked..

Just float in on Marth, a little above the ground, and counter him when you get in range, or f-air him if he tries to fake you.. This makes a really ugly fight, and it's all about mind-games here..
Read your opponent, and mix it up with backward's wavedashes with down-B or something.. Don't triangle jump in front of Marth all the time, try backing away and wavedashing in after.

Try practicing against a lv9 comp Marth- he's predictable, so he's good for practicing getting the move right.
You should own him with this by the time your ready to practice with humans.