Doc vs Fox

[falz]

when i use doctor mario against my friends who uses fox all he does is waveshine and it is getting really annoying, so is there anyway to counter this with doctor mario

[meepxzero]

wave shine shouldnt really effect you too much because mario/doc has too much traction on the ground. You can cc the waveshine and down smash :crazy: but thats like at 0%? Just roll away when it happens or run lol so he cant follow up with anything because mario/doc should slide far enough away from his deadly shine combos.

[MetaKnight0]

*Too little traction.

And Fox can catch up to Mario/Doc when he waveshines.

[Happosai]

does that count for PAL too?

[Knuckaclo]

i just jump,roll, or cape it...
u can also do this to his recovery moves..easy way to kill fox

[Blind]

Fox has cheap K.O.'s, but fortunately, so does Doc. Especially against Fox. If you can grab him near the edge, b-throw will pop him up and you can use b-airs priority to knock him low, followed by caping the firefox for an easy stock.

Combo into throws a lot. Up throw into smashes, FFLC an up-air into a throw, drill kick to shield grab (because many people, after getting popped up slightly from the d-air use a sex-kick to keep you from comboing; shield grab the attempted sex-kick counter) At higher percents, d-throw, walk over to jab and downsmash followed by b-air edgeguarding, or u-throw into a sex-kick. Jab to downsmash is your good friend, it's reliable at almost all percents because it doesn't let them shield grab, it's good damage early on and great KO'ing later on. Can't go wrong with it.

You don't rely on f-air for KO's as much in this matchup, because you won't knock Fox off the top with it and the height he comes in from the sides lets him play with the firefox and illusion more, so it's tricker to cape. Stick with d-smash and b-air. You probably won't get a good shot at f-smashing in this matchup.

Don't approach with pill spam, use it as a defensive maneuver, if an approaching Fox tries to reflector an obvious pill just hop around it and take advantage of his lag.

U-air and b-air are your favorite aerials for his match-up, so learn their spacing and how to outprioritize with them.

The waveshine is pretty tricky to handle. Only real solution is shield drill kicks and sex-kicks and get VERY good at shield grabbing. My brother can shield grab me out of drill kick to shine except when my timing on the shine is perfect because of the intermittent lag, even with proper l-cancelling. Also, it can mess with a fox's l-cancelling timing to direct your shield. Just lightly push up and forward while shielding, not enough to roll or jump, and you'll push your shield outward.

Also, try light shielding any lead ins to shine that he has. This keeps him out of range and you can jump from shield to avoid waveshining combos when the first shine is whiffed.

Your best chance in this matchup is to match cheap KO for cheap KO; cape every recovery and b-air him off the stage until he's forced to wander straight into the sheet. Slow down his options with pills and punish his predictability, and for the shine, just use whatever you can to keep him at fist's length. Jab a lot if you have to, it interrupts his flow and can be a good time for you to short hop into drill-kicks for combos. An under-used move in this matchup is actually the d-tilt, provided you are near the edge, because of Fox's fast falling and the low angle it sends enemies out at. Plus it can be crouch cancelled, so if the Fox is tilting or jabbing then you can use the quick d-tilt to send him back, out, and down. B-air and cape as is usual.

Fox is a tricky matchup for everyone and Doc doesn't have too many moves that outrange Fox, so those you do have (pills, b-air, u-air, d-air, d-smash) take advantage of. Cheap KO's can make this match a fast one and it'll probably be intense.

[UndrDog]

I just use my Sheet while he is off the edge for cheap kills.
D-Tilt, turn and Smash.
Dash attack, turn and Smash.
Edge Guard with B-Airs.
Chain-Throw too about 90% then F-Smash.

I actually like this match-up against Fox more so then alot of other characters.

[Bob Money]

keep it simple space with WD and grab when u can WD to smash when u see an opening and force the fox to play slower with pill spam. :psycho: :psycho: :psycho: :psycho: :psycho:

[FalseFalco]

does that count for PAL too?

In PAL the shine is unchanged.

Nice smileys bob money.

theres not much to add, but utilt sweetspot can usually clank a drill kick or stuff a sex kick si its a nice ground move, and of course bair has unreasonable priority.

[ssssupermario92]

Dr.Mario would easily kill Fox hands down :laugh:

[Hollowpoint]

Dr.Mario would easily kill Fox hands down :laugh:

Thanks for the well informed post.

[Mr1337]

When I play a good Fox I normally overdose on pills and edge guard like a jerk.

Cape also seems to be pretty effective.

[white peachy]

Dr.Mario would easily kill Fox hands down :laugh:

haha sorry but i found that post hilarious. yeah fox doesn't present any problems whatsoever.

that said doc does have a lot of nasty stuff on fox. three cheers for throw combos. :)