shorthop fastfall missle

[MLRS]

alright, this is to give the full details on the very difficult shorthop fastfall missle technique. first of all, i want to point out that i did not come up with this technique, jasona came on the hub, asked if it was possible, i said i was pretty sure it wasn't, but i went and tested it anyway, and OMGWTFBBQ!!! its possible.

alright, pretty much everything i posted was wrong, well, all frame data anyway. i made a really stupid mistake and looked at ordinary jump's fastfall airtime rather than sh's fastfall airtime. it turns out earliest fastfall on sh is at 28 frames, and total air time is 38 frames, so it looks impossible. but it turns out, missle slows your decent.

heres the real numbers, to do shffm you must fast fall on the first possible frame, then you must fire the missle the next frame, or the frame after, so there is a 1 frame margin of error here. the total time , including jump lag and land lag, is 52 frames if you fire the missle on the first frame, or 51 frames if you fire the missle on the 2nd frame. this is versus standing missle spam's 49 frames per missle, so if done perfectly, this is a tiny bit slower than standing missle spam.

i'm pretty much done now, i've been droning on for a while, and i'd rather go do something else. my progress with the technique, i can do it about 1/20 times on 1x speed, but i can only do it firing right, i can't seem to make my thumb go left as fast as i can right. i really hope i can master it, but its really really hard. good luck to you doing it. and i wanna thank jasona again for asking the stupid questions everyone else just assumes the answer to. a ****load more thanks to super doodle man for doing research on this, i'll make sure to read things more closely next time, i promise. although, if i had read it correctly in the first place, i woulda thought it was impossible, so its really for the best that this happened.

update: ok, i think this should be the last correction, but its impossible to be certain. its possible to fastfall up to 2 frames late and still have a 1 frame margin of error on the missle. if you fastfall on frame 31, you can still do it, but with no margin of error.
heres the chart (thx again SDM) ok, one last edit, changed the 47 to 51, but i swear to god it wasn't my fault this time!!!

fastfall frame--------------missle frame--------------total lag
28----------------------------29----------------------52
28----------------------------30----------------------51
29----------------------------30----------------------52
29----------------------------31----------------------52
30----------------------------31----------------------53
30----------------------------32----------------------53
31----------------------------32----------------------54

[ChRed2AKrisp]

Crap, I was wrong. My rough estimates w/o any knowledge of frames proved too limited. Cap' Crunch if you read my response in the other thread don't flame on the rate of fire part. Ur free to beat down everything else.

THe only thing I see is that you wouldn't use this if you needed an immediate missle since the normal missle will come out faster but have the lag after. But if u have enuf time the SHFFMC all the way.


Myabe if Ikeep practicing all get like 50% of the time by MLG.

[UndrDog]

Jasona, perhaps you could dub it with another name? its your tech after all. and SHFFMC isnt all that catchy.

[MLRS]

chred, you might wanna take another look at the first post, it turns out i was wrong on a lot of the numbers, and its all been fixed now. sorry for the mistake. and i think shffm is a good name.

[ChRed2AKrisp]

How about the McShuff
As you can see I like McDonalds.

[UndrDog]

Da Da Da Da Da... I'm Loving It!

[ChRed2AKrisp]

Put a smile on, then Get Happy!

[Aftermath]

i like the shffm thing but i thnk it's a bit too long for my lazy fingers. from now on i'll just call it the sfm or something.

[aho43]

This technique sounds very interesting and useful. But the technical difficulty in performing it also sounds like it might be so hard that you can't ever count on performing it consistently, maybe I'm wrong.

[UndrDog]

you might be right about that. I've been practicing it and have only down it twice in 1/4 speed. granted I havent been at it long. Jasona I believe has been having better results however.

[Jasona]

I can do it pretty consistant at 2/3 speed, it is only a matter of time before I reach real time. I'll keep refering to it as a SHFFMC, that seems shorter than making a follow up post describing a personalized acronym.
Today is the last day of my semester, soon I can put my full mental capacities toward revitalizing and personalizing my samus game. That and I can finish my samus techs vid.

[PhillCollins]

MC SHFFL YO

Don't be a hater!


I dunno, it seems like the fast falling is only adding a very small advantage compared to all the mental anguish.

[ChRed2AKrisp]

I haven'tn practiced as mcuh as Jasona, I can only do it consistently at 1/2 speed. I only've gotten it a couple of times in nrmal speed. No chance of using it by Saturday. Hopefully Jasona won't be able to by Sat. or i'm screwed.

[zitanix]

Originally posted by PhillCollins
MC SHFFL YO

Don't be a hater!


I dunno, it seems like the fast falling is only adding a very small advantage compared to all the mental anguish.

I agree. However, can't test it right now because I'm in transition from college to home and my GC's packed up.

MLRS, if you could post the frame difference between SHFFMC and SHMC, I'd appreciate it.

[UndrDog]

SHFFMC is fast falling after your short hop. so that you can do it faster, and short the missle lower, sometimes even through the stage floor.

[zitanix]

I know what it is, but I'm asking how much faster it is than a regular short hop missile cancel.

[Jasona]

@zitanix-----that is similar to comparing a regular jump missle canceld to a regular jump FF missle canceled. Technically, it should be the fastest way to missle cancel. Even if it isn't as fast as missle spamming, at the least it can be used to double missle repeatedly at a faster rate thereby making it the fastest way to stream missles.

[HugS]

It seems to me that the difficulty of this move far surpasses the usefulness. I know i know...if perfected it can be a great technique....but so can powershielding every single move...but how many people do you see doing that? This is the hardest move i have ever encountered, and if people have trouble getting SWD 5/10 or Powershielding 5/10 then i feel the average of 1/20 ratio of performing SHFFMC is going to stay that way. It's just way too hard.

[UndrDog]

your probably right, but I'm gonna keep trying. but my money is on Jasona for getting it down first.

[Jasona]

Semester ended last thursday and I'm well into remembering samus. In my attempts to do the smash missle without smashing the joystick (very successful attempts), I think I stumbled into another thing. Since this topic is about fast falling missles, I'll post about it here. I think that double missle thingy in one jump can be fast falled, in fact I'm certain of it. Of course samus would only be able to fast fall the second missle, but it would speed up the process of firing volleys of missles every jump by alot (alot being equal to more than nothing).

EDIT #1: by doing this move, I have learned to SH with the joystick 50% of the time and find it easier to SHFFMC. It is just a matter of practice before I get that vid out.

EDIT #2: We should call "the two missles in one full jump", the dual missle jump and if my idea works I caould call it fast falling the dual missle jump.

[ChRed2AKrisp]

Jesus Christ, there's gonna be like no masrgin of error on that if it's possible. I mean doing the dual missles is in itself fast, but Sh immediately smash missling immediately FF when the SM ends then immediately SMing again.

BTW hoiw do you smash missle w/o smashing the joystick? I thought you had to to get a SM, tilting it just gets you the homing missle, or is it you press the joystick and B at the same time to get a smash missle and press the joystick first, then B to get a homing missle?

[Jasona]

technically, I am smashing the joystick, but I never let it hit the edges.
As for the "dual missle jump", if you start the first missle early then you have alot of time to fire the second. It is much much easier than SHFFMCing, mainly because you don't have to SH it.
I'm still annoyed that I can't WD well enough to wavebomb and can't SH well enough to SHFFMC.

EDIT --- I just figured out what you were REALLY talking about... and no, I don't SH to perform the "dual missle jump" and I'm not even going to try (mainly because I can't SH consistantly enough, but also because I have a gut feeling that it is impossible)

[ChRed2AKrisp]

What's the poit in not smashing the edges? Does it affect gameplay at all or just cut down on controller deterioration

[Jasona]

It makes me feel like I have more control. Instead of letting the controller stop me, I stop the controller. Sometimes I feel like smashing the joystick within a match may change the responsiveness of the joystick enough to cause me to have to relearn the timing of a smash and make me doubt something that I haven't had a chance to do yet. The real reason is that when you touch the edges with the joystick, you stop suddenly instead of slowing down first and it alters your timing. Also, it cuts back on hand fatigue since you can't use all of your strength or you'll touch the edges.

[UndrDog]

see this is the crap I have to put up with... sigh, anyway Jasona let me know when you want to make the vid. I really want to see what you got going.

[ChRed2AKrisp]

That would increasemy stress level and tus tension and thus more fatigue for me.

And I realized I kept screwing up on my dual missle cuz I was subconciously SHing it.

[UndrDog]

Dual Missle FF seems really hard liek Krisp said. but if it could be mastered, and it didnt cause you to take your focus off your mindgames. but if you can do it then I guess we're all screwed. LoL!

[ChRed2AKrisp]

FFing it would probably make it harder than SHFFMCing. I personally think its impossible. And a waste of time if it is possible. The dual missle by itself is good enough, especially if you follow it with another missle or a charged power beam.
BTW do you know what the margin of error is for the dual missle jump? I just started practicing it and can do it consistnetly on 2/3 speed, but the problem is to time the second missle perfectly. If you press it to late the animation is canceled, too early and the previous missle is still taking effect. What is the gap after the first animation in which you can fire the second successfully? THe double projectile thread sucked.
If this can be done try to post the vids of it and SHFFMC, I'd just like to see them done consistently.

[Jasona]

Wow, FFing the dual missle jump is next to impossible nad utterly useless. There is almost no time gained by FFing. The dual missle jump doesn't have a set timing. Everything depends on when the first missle is fired and you figuring out when you can fire the second. Trail and error is the best advice I can give. As for the vids, I'm working on it.

[UndrDog]

I might've just quit Smash all together if he got that working. sigh, my poor Ice Climbers can't even get to him as it is.

[JesusFreak]

Well Samus destroys the ICs. <.< Link is a better choice. Or Marth or Sheik lol.

[UndrDog]

Well Samus destroys the ICs.
THANK YOU! and he is my only means of human practice. either that or 2 hours away... Sigh...

[Joker]

directed to anyone willing to answer to it: which is more effective

shooting a missle then jumping and shooting a beam, then falling back to a missle or............

fast-falling missles?????????

signed................JOKER.................

[Jasona]

what are you trying to do (generally)? r u trying to just spam missles as fast as you can?

[Joker]

No what I mean is : have you ever seen Captain Jack play with Samus, if so is what he does with shooting a missle then a beam and in the air then a another missle and over and over, or is your fast-fall tech better....


signed...........JOKER.........

[Jasona]

FFing into a missle-cancel lets you fire another missle faster-than-normal, so I would say FFing into missle canceling is much faster, if you want to spam missles at ground level.

EDIT: r u talking about SHFFMCing? SHFFMCing is the fastest way to fire missles and the most hopeless tech to try to perform. STick to dual missle jumps and FFing normal jumps into missle-cancels, because those are much easier and therefore more consistant and reliable than SHFFMCing.

[Joker]

Only one problem........what about "fast" movers such as Marth's and Sheik's.......who can jump over the first spamed missle leaving the second missle wasted.........

[Jasona]

ewewewewe... talking samus strategy now eh? ok then, instead of the second missle, dash or WD or anything you deem important.

I currently talking with Elijin, he says you two stocked him with your samus... LOL. He may try to get in touch with you or your crew soon. To ask you if you want to go to a smashfest in western PA tommorrow. Hopefully I'll be there and if you're there then we can talk samus. NO PRESSURE... LOL

[Joker]

I'll take your advise about the WD. seeing as though you may be a Samus Player I take it ............LOL

[Ninja]

Eljin mentioned this to me today i just want to know what kind of tournament it is