Pickachu vs. Pichu

[demoncaterpie]

All right, match of the century. Which electric pokemon is better? My choice is Pikachu, but I have been hearing some great things about Pichu. Any opinions?

[soberfox]

What great things have you heard about the worst character in the game? That it hurts itself?

I don't really have any advice on this matchup...but I had to ask because I have to know where you heard these "great things."

[pictish freak]

Perhaps you shouldn't act so dismissive of a character if you don't know enough about them?

Pichu is an excellent edgeguarder, great recovery, very little lag on aerials and the BEST evasive game. I'm not saying he's great, but he certainly has strengths.. they're just outweighed.

So anyway, what does Pichu do well? For a start, he fights fast fallers beautifully. U-air can juggle and lead to N-air, which is sweet. Fast fallers have crap recovery... so if you land an early F-smash, it's quite possible to edge guard nicely and get a low percent KO from that. His downsmash is great at high damage.. sending them horizontally, with their fast falling-ness pulling them downwards. Against Falcon in particular, he gains a huge advantage from his evasive ability. It's **** hard for Falcon to land the Knee on something that small and fast.. Pichu shouldn't be using moves that'll leave him open to knee ^^

As for hurting himself, that isn't his big problem. It's not like he NEEDS his D-air, jolt, and other stuff, though it helps. And the fact is once you hit 70-100% (depending on the character..) any good attack while KO Pichu, so he can shamelessly use whatever he likes ^^ That's why recovery damage isn't a huge deal. It's 1% at low damage, IF that.. and at high damage, he's highly damaged anyway, eh?

As for who's better.. Pikachu overall, and.. I'd give the match up to Pika also. Up smash negates Pichu's wonderful recovery, Pika can perfectly match Pichu's projectile WITHOUT self damage.. that sorta thing.

God it feels good to talk about the 'chus >.>

[Neophos]

meh.

pictish, i will now prove you wrong with 3 words.

Googles > Merlin hat

If i keep this up, i never get into the MBR...

meh. its just like LUE anyway. just a way to make people feel special...

[Influenza]

Merlin hat? Psh. Trucker hat all the way!

[Electricmouse]

You fools, trucker and wizard hat can't handle pichu's backpack. Seriously though, I would give the match to pika for all the reasons pictish stated but skill>tier so a good pichu can beat a average pika.

[VilNess]

Originally posted by Electricmouse
You fools, trucker and wizard hat can't handle pichu's backpack.
I agree 100% on that! (but just because Ness uses a backpack!) :D

Btw. I think that luigi´s evasive game almost matches Pichus. best WD, enough good sidestep.
Though luigi might get aerial comboed easier...
So Pichu keeps the award!

hey Picktish: I think Pichu has sometimes better projectile game tahn Pika because he can run with his spark. Might lead to nice grabs or smashes. Probably won´t ever work against marth though... but anyway.
The thing is that Pichu spark is usually a suprise move because it shouldn´t be spammed... is it always suprising your opponent, is a different thing.

[pictish freak]

Pikachu can dive forward with his projectile. You can fire one, then leap forward and fire another. You'll move in with two projectiles, if they aren't rushing you.

Using projectiles with Pikachu, occasionally the jolt will connect just as you land next to the opponent, your lag ending. On this odd occasion, you get a free up smash. I imagine the same is available Pichu, but Pika can spam the jolt so much more.

Oh, and Pichu can spam jolt like crazy at about 90%. Like he'll die any worse at 90%, or 100%, or 130% >.>

[VilNess]

good to know! thanks!

[demoncaterpie]

Originally posted by soberfox
What great things have you heard about the worst character in the game? That it hurts itself?

I don't really have any advice on this matchup...but I had to ask because I have to know where you heard these "great things."

Just look around sobrefox. This is a Pickachu AND Pichu forum. As for where I heard it specifically, I think it was in one of those Pichu vs. forums. He can do some incredible stuff.
As for being the worst character in the game, completely not true. He can do just as many amazing things as Pickachu, but with an added quickness. So what if he hurts himself, he's only taking 1-3% damages anyway.

...Still, I prefer Pikachu.

[pictish freak]

Please, if you've been reading Awdbawls posts... forgot everything, I mean EVERYTHING he said.

[demoncaterpie]

Originally posted by pictish freak
Please, if you've been reading Awdbawls posts... forgot everything, I mean EVERYTHING he said.

Awdball?! Please, don't lower me to that standard. Most of the info. I get is from the Pichu is frikin awesome forum, more or less. Just tyin' to be the best I can. Sometimes I go to the Pichu vs. forums, not all the time.

Never mention that name again...

[JayJay]

Demoncaterpie, soberfox was sort of right when he called Pichu the worst character in the game... Just look at the tier list, Pichu is at rock bottom.

I'm not saying he sucks and isn't worth playing, in my opinion you should play whoever you want, and not just what the tiers say. You'll just have to work a little harder to get good with him.

*On Topic* In the matchup between Pikachu and Pichu, I would have to say Pikachu has the advantage. Pichu is very evasive, but he can be knocked off the stage and edgeguarded at low %s
by a good Pikachu player. If the Pichu player is better than the Pikachu player, then yeah that might be a close one, but assuming the players are at even skill level... Pika 100%!

[pictish freak]

Pikachu and Pichu are both extremely difficult to edge guard when played well. Pika can't edge guard Pichu well in the same way it goes vice versa.

However, Pika can kill Pichu with the upsmash pretty early, which is what would sway this Match to Pichu's advantage. Pichu also loses his great edge guarding, since he can't dive out to intercept so well against Pika.

[demoncaterpie]

Another thing you learn when you play as Pichu is that his Up smash is horrible in comparison in Pikachu's. Also, a lot of Pichu's moves have completely different out comes then Pika's changing his entire game.

It's a safe bet that you can't play Pika and Pichu with the same strategies, since they are very different characters. How do you play as Pika and how do you play as Pichu?

[Thomas Tipman]

Originally posted by Influenza
Merlin hat? Psh. Trucker hat all the way!

trucker hat what are you talkin about??? thats definetly a fatal fury hat, pika is down with terry bogard and representing.:cool:

[Red Dragon]

Pikachu's Ash Ketchum Hat all the way! (red and white hat..) :D

Anyways, on topic...

Pichu cannot spam projectiles like Pikachu can, even though Pichu is much faster, he is very easy to kill with Pikachu, a simple up-smash can do him in at the percentages of 60% and less if hit right at certain levels. Pichu just doesnt compare, neither range nor power, its not a match.

[demoncaterpie]

Originally posted by Red Dragon
Pikachu's Ash Ketchum Hat all the way! (red and white hat..) :D

Anyways, on topic...

Pichu cannot spam projectiles like Pikachu can, even though Pichu is much faster, he is very easy to kill with Pikachu, a simple up-smash can do him in at the percentages of 60% and less if hit right at certain levels. Pichu just doesnt compare, neither range nor power, its not a match.

Since I made this thread, I've been practicing with both Chu's and have decided that Pika is indeed the better mouse. Their's just no comparison.

[Electricmouse]

Yup, in the overall sense pika is better than pichu but fun wise pichu is so much more fun to play as. Especially when you beat somebody with pichu, priceless.

[demoncaterpie]

It's really hard to get good with Pichu. For me, I didn't want to put in the effort.

[Bunny Slicer]

A thread about Pikachu and Pichu? How old are you? Three?

[pictish freak]

Signing up for video game boards and insulting people about talking about Pikachu and Pichu in the Pikachu and Pichu forum?

What are you? Three?

[Bunny Slicer]

Porn > pictish freak

[demoncaterpie]

Originally posted by Bunny Slicer
Porn > pictish freak

I guess that makes you your own best friend. Bet it's nice living with your mom. I should know, I still owe her a nickel.

Why are you hating on me? I thought my thread addressed the topic of the forum very well. I mean, this is a Pikachu and Pichu forum. I just thought it would be natural to compare the two. Why don't you think before you post next time.

You know what? I'm not even going to give your mom a nickel. She wasn't worth the time.

Edit: Whoops, sorry. Looks like you already banned yourself. That was nice of you. I take back everything I said about you.

[Xaron Fisk]

Pichu's up smash is not that bad a move.

[MR. P.A. Awdbawl]

Originally posted by pictish freak
Perhaps you shouldn't act so dismissive of a character if you don't know enough about them?

Calm down. Perhaps that individual is trying to understand Pichu better.

Pichu is an excellent edgeguarder, great recovery, very little lag on aerials and the BEST evasive game. I'm not saying he's great, but he certainly has strengths.. they're just outweighed.

Outweighted, yes, but not to be considered a major factor.

As for hurting himself, that isn't his big problem. It's not like he NEEDS his D-air, jolt, and other stuff, though it helps. And the fact is once you hit 70-100% (depending on the character..) any good attack while KO Pichu, so he can shamelessly use whatever he likes ^^ That's why recovery damage isn't a huge deal. It's 1% at low damage, IF that.. and at high damage, he's highly damaged anyway, eh?

You're throwing in the towel too soon. Yes, it's easier to K.O. Pichu from 70% on, but Pika can be killed from 85% on, so that isn't so much of a concern.

As for who's better.. Pikachu overall, and.. I'd give the match up to Pika also. Up smash negates Pichu's wonderful recovery, Pika can perfectly match Pichu's projectile WITHOUT self damage.. that sorta thing.

Finally, the climax. I would say a close match with a slight advantage to Pichu. Up smash only works at the edge (effectively) and the Quick Attack Recovery is short than the Agility Recovery. Still, love the way you broke everything down to a science. Makes a good read :)

Rooting for the 'Chu,

MR. P.A. Awdbawl

God it feels good to talk about the 'chus >.> [/B][/QUOTE]

[Ijuka]

Point is, Pichu has no good KO move to use on a Pikachu who is aware...

[PXTalon2000]

I experimented with this matchup before...
It first seemed almost even, which was surprising, but that's 'cuz we spent the match playing pinball until killtime. Figured eventually that all Pikachu had to do was use upsmash (JC from dash or shield, CC)... Doesn't matter too much how often it fails, getting around the thing is too hard, and eventually Pichu will die; it takes too much trouble to avoid it every time. Between two evenly matched individuals, Pikachu wins it easily as long as he finds ways to trade hits.
Pichu can kill Pikachu. Get him to start sidestepping by stressing grabs and you can use fsmash. Or catch him a little above ground and shuffle fair into upsmash. Or WD from the shield during a smash hit into upsmash. Or you could just.. edgeguard him. It's just considerably easier the other way around.

At least jolt spam doesn't work too well on Pichu. x.x

[demoncaterpie]

Killed from 85% on? Not how I use Pika. I can usually recover from more then that.

[MR. P.A. Awdbawl]

Originally posted by demoncaterpie
Killed from 85% on? Not how I use Pika. I can usually recover from more then that.

That was based on the average (aka Mario) and his Meteor attack on Pika. But it is possible to take out Pika from that percent on. Used properly, which is what I'm gathering from you, Pika can last approxiamently 30-50% more before it's too late to have decent recovery.

Adding new information,

MR. P.A. Awdbawl

[JesusFreak]

Pika's upsmash only works on the edge? WTF, it works everywhere. It's the strongest up smash in the game, and it has A LOT more range than Pichu's.

[demoncaterpie]

Originally posted by MR. P.A. Awdbawl
That was based on the average (aka Mario) and his Meteor attack on Pika. But it is possible to take out Pika from that percent on. Used properly, which is what I'm gathering from you, Pika can last approxiamently 30-50% more before it's too late to have decent recovery.

Adding new information,

MR. P.A. Awdbawl

I see what you're saying. In general, Pika can recover from around 70-80 percent max. Of course, theirs ways to counter this, but that's not the point of the argument.

Also, Awdball, how you end each post is really getting lame. I mean, Im sure it was funny at the time. But now...just move on to better things.

[PXTalon2000]

Originally posted by demoncaterpie
I see what you're saying. In general, Pika can recover from around 70-80 percent max. Of course, theirs ways to counter this, but that's not the point of the argument.

Excuse me? 70-80% max? What?

That's not even close to true. Anyone who's good at DI can extend even Pichu's lifespan a ways past that, unless you're dealing with someone who's got an easy to land, powerful kill move/combo (like Pika's upsmash)

[Pichu Paizano]

I agree... I can usually last up to 100% playing against anyone but Fox, Ganon, or Marth. My friend that I play most w/uses Pikachu as his 2nd, and I win 99% of the time. (Due to a skill lvl gap, but still) And I can't believe noone has mentioned what is, IMO, Pichu's most effective aerial, his Nair... Recently, I have discovered the many uses of his Uair, but I still use nuetral A more than any other attack, I think. Heck, I almost beat a Marth once b/c I landed a few good 6-hit shff'd Nair combos. The guy was like, "Hey, only I'm supposed to be able to do that!" (Referring to Marth) :laugh: Maybe I'm just an odd case, but I've found it to be extremely effective in my exp, which is why I use it the most.

[demoncaterpie]

Originally posted by Pichu Paizano
I agree... I can usually last up to 100% playing against anyone but Fox, Ganon, or Marth. My friend that I play most w/uses Pikachu as his 2nd, and I win 99% of the time. (Due to a skill lvl gap, but still) And I can't believe noone has mentioned what is, IMO, Pichu's most effective aerial, his Nair... Recently, I have discovered the many uses of his Uair, but I still use nuetral A more than any other attack, I think. Heck, I almost beat a Marth once b/c I landed a few good 6-hit shff'd Nair combos. The guy was like, "Hey, only I'm supposed to be able to do that!" (Referring to Marth) :laugh: Maybe I'm just an odd case, but I've found it to be extremely effective in my exp, which is why I use it the most.

Yeah, but what I think Awdball is trying to say is that if you dont do anything to stop the hit or to prevent how far you go, Pika can get KO'd at 70-80%.

Of course Pika can last longer, but that's not the point.

[TheMagicalKuja]

Pichu's Nair rules. And as much as you'd kill me for this, his forward smash is FUN. You can kill even Bowser at 60% or less with it.

The problem is you can only use it as a desperation/finishing move, since it's not worth it to try and use it offensively without going for the kill.

Oh, and if you're not going for straightaway fighting, Pichu is your item god.

[Bunny Killer]

Originally posted by demoncaterpie
Edit: Whoops, sorry. Looks like you already banned yourself. That was nice of you. I take back everything I said about you.


Hey thanks! Can I have a cookie? Pikachu > j00

[demoncaterpie]

I was going to same something, but the fact is Bunny Killer can't stay on for more then one post without getting banned. Some people are just compulsive losers.