Ness's PK Flash doesn't suck!

[Smashbros_7]

My friend keeps saying it sucks. (He thinks it's the worst B move in the Game) Yes it sucked in Melee, but in Brawl it rules. It has more hitbox, faster, and a good edge guard, item guard, and FS breaker. He keeps on insisting that it leaves Ness wide open and it's not worth it. CHANGE HIS MIND (or mine...)

[Ademisk]

No. You're wrong on every account.

1: It was useful in Melee

2: It is now SMALLER, not bigger.

3: It is not faster, it simply comes out faster. After the initial part, it is JUST as slow as Melee, but less controllable.

4: It is a bad edgeguard, especially compared to its Melee version.

5: Nothing involving items counts

6: Or Final Smashes.


Its not useless, just the ways you're trying to use it. I haven't had enough experience with it to do anything big, but it's definitely useful in certain situations.

[Smashbros_7]

Didn't you pay attention, my FRIEND says it's bad... Plus it does have more hitboxes.

[Smashbros_7]

Didn't you pay attention, my FRIEND says it's bad... Plus it does have more hitboxes.

[Ademisk]

Right. But you were still wrong on every account.


And it IS smaller, I can assure you of that.

[Smashbros_7]

Whatever... Smaller but longer hitboxes. Melee had a weird range. Sometimes huge others minuscule.

[Ademisk]

...Not really. The range was just...big.

Are you talking about the actual size of the hitbox, or the range at which you could throw it? If that's the case, then yeah, Brawl PK Flash wins, but it's also infinitely less controllable, so in my opinion, it loses out BECAUSE of its range.

[NessOnett]

Well i have no firsthand experience, having not played brawl yet(curses). But from what i have seen in videos, it seems to have simply changed its role in general. It went from a monster edge guard(if you could time it right) in melee, to what now appears to be a quick combo-able move or a possible juggler but with a big hit to its power and blast radius. Not necessarily worse or better, just..."different"(until we learn more about the game. Maybe later on we will find some sweet ways to work it that make it undoubtedly better than the melee incarnation)

[Ademisk]

Ness Onett is correct. It's possible as an edgeguard, but people are too freaking floaty to be as good as Melee.

[Smashbros_7]

Well at least I own my friend. In Melee it was great, and in Brawl it's not worse.

[Ademisk]

In Melee it was...pretty...bad. >_> And you're talking to someone who used it more than most people.

[Timotee]

It's also hard to use as an edgeguard because of auto-sweet spots. And the plethora of unflinchable/invincible recoveries.

[gringo66]

In Melee it was...pretty...bad. >_> And you're talking to someone who used it more than most people.


come on ademisk. personally, if u timed it right in melee, i think it was a really devastating edge guard.

[Ademisk]

Like I said, you're talking to someone who used it more than most people. But it was bad. Trust me, against good players, it is not a good edgeguard. It's too easy to avoid. It's VERY situational, requires a lot of forethought, timing, spacing, and luck. Almost all of Ness's edgeguard options are better, almost always.

[Lunar Sorcerer]

Ness was my main in melee, and I can say from years of experience that PK Flash is far from useless. Situational, yes, but not useless at all. It's a good edge guard, great for juggling, and I myself like to use it once I've knocked someone down, or after using PK Fire. They usually don't have time to dodge it without shielding. I don't know how this may have changed in brawl.

[gringo66]

well then i guess i did time it right and it did work for me alot. but there are better options u can choose from ness' weapons.

[Blarfenzo]

Meh it seems like the bat would be a MUCH better and reliable edgeguard anyway so PK Flash isn't even worth it for that. I didn't really see it that much in brawl matches with Ness so I doubt it's THAT much better but who knows, hopefully.

[Hardcorenesser]

there are much better options then pk flash. I can't even remember the last time i used pk flash in melee. it was that bad.

[Timotee]

So, let's review what we've covered:

PK Flash edge guard ability: nerfed by size reduction and auto-sweet spotting
PK Flash as a directly above you guard/attack: decent, though I like to tail whip and wrap the thunder head around for greater damage.
PK Flash against people on the ground: If they really just let you get it that charged up, then sure!
PK Flash for healing ness/lucas: Top tier!

[Ademisk]

Uhm. No? Slow much?

[Timotee]

If you meant the healing part, it's what is commonly referred to as "sarcasm".

I prefer smarminess, personally.

[Ademisk]

Oh. Way to go then.

I got tired of sarcasm and smarminess a little while ago. Now I prefer the straight approach, just because it's all the effort I can manage to put in anymore. (IE "No, shut up, you're stupid." "No, that doesn't work, you're stupid" "WHY DO YOU MAKE ME WANT TO HURT MYSELF!?!?")

[Smashbros_7]

You really hate PK Flash.

[Ademisk]

No, I like it more than most people. It's just bad.

[BentoBox]

Lucas says hi.

[Kiki52]

If PK Flash had the same range and speed as PK Freeze it'd be the best move in the game.

[Ademisk]

Correction, if PK Freeze had the power of PK Flash, it'd be the best move in the game.

[Mikezor]

^ You forget Falcon Punch.

Also, PK Flash is pretty much useless in this game as of now.

In other words, PK Flash is one of, if not the worst of Ness's moves.

If you still don't understand me, PK Flash is a terrible move.

And if that isn't clear enough, PK FLASH SUCKS

[IrishSheikah]

People, PLEASE!!! Forget about how bad the PK Flash is! We are lucky that he has an up-b that makes p for this disappointment

[Ademisk]

Well, his Up-B isn't as bad as Mikezor says. Waaaaaay underating it. It's defnitely still useful in dozens of fashions that I can see. I was just saying that all the reasons the author pointed out were wrong.

[NessOnett]

Well, his Up-B isn't as bad as Mikezor says. Waaaaaay underating it. It's defnitely still useful in dozens of fashions that I can see. I was just saying that all the reasons the author pointed out were wrong.

isn't his PK flash his standard B? His up-B is PKT, which is arguably the best up-B in the game and i think that's what Sheikah was referring to.

[Ademisk]

Right, I just woke up. I meant PK Flash. And Ness's is the absolute worst UP-B in the game, recovery wise, as far as I can tell. Only Olimar's is potentially worse.

[BentoBox]

Lucas says hi again.

[Ademisk]

Tell Lucas to shut the **** up and go back to his own forums.

[Smashbros_7]

Tell Lucas to shut the **** up and go back to his own forums.

I don't get you. You hate PK flash, but you like PK freeze.

[Wizard99]

Ness is a great character and my main, but come on. PK Flash is too situational to be considered "good" by most standards. Also PK Freeze ius more useful, but all-in-all Lucas seems not as good as Ness.

[Ademisk]

I didn't say I like PK Freeze. When did I say that? You need to stop making things up.

[W.Jr]

Yea its does, it completely sucks

[BentoBox]

Tell Lucas to shut the **** up and go back to his own forums.

Why you gotta hate.

Pk freeze > Pk flash
Lucas's Pk thunda > Ness'
Lucas forums > Ness forums

but all-in-all Lucas seems not as good as Ness.

Lucas seems way more capable of fighting the higher ups. Range is still an issue with Ness and L's ground game is way better.

Lucas says hi!

[thesage]

Why you gotta hate.

Pk freeze > Pk flash
Lucas's Pk thunda > Ness'
Lucas forums > Ness forums



Lucas seems way more capable of fighting the higher ups. Range is still an issue with Ness and L's ground game is way better.

Lucas says hi!

Pk freeze and Flash are crappy moves that will almost never be used.
Lucas' pkt2 is better for recovering, Ness' pkt2 is better for attacking. Ness and Lucas' pkt are both good projectiles.

Lucas forums = Ness forums = brawl forums = filled with noobs. =-0 *runs away*

And according to vids, Ness has more range than Lucas in all of his attacks except his up-smash and psi magnet.